MBB: NESCAC

[senatorfrost]

 I actually realized that Williams was not that good last year. I arrived at the conclusion the same way everyone did, I looked at the record. Chris Rose went from a NESCAC all star to something a lot less than that.
  I saw these guys play. They were young but they were very good, especially for their years in college.
I am aware it's a new system and I'm aware it's a new coach but they have time. How many times do you see a coach come in and completely turn things around-that can't happen? Why can't they return to form? It's my theory that last years team had TONS of issues and they simply collapsed, especially at the end. A great turn around coach could make this team a big winner because I know what I saw and the fact that 'it' wasn't there last year is not preventing me from liking them on paper.
   Mind you if the new coach fails to take this team to near the top, all I will say is that he's not a great turn around guy. Remember there are lots of turn around guys who can't recruit and they fade like an old rose when they have to face the world with their own material. He'll be judged by the long run and even if he fails from a won/loss standpoint, people will talk about how admissions screwed up the program.
  Meantime the Trinity game was not exactly bad news but we'll see.

[senatorfrost]

ac 08-No they weren't the best but they weren't that far away. It was the first time in the NCAA  for the folks who got minutes. They lost a reasonably close game to a team that was just about as good as the eventual winner up there. (OT) as I remember? Young team on the road-not bad at all. A lot of people expected them to improve since they only lost one person and he hardly played. They didn't as we all know.
   Let's put it this way if God somehow told you that the three I'm talking about were going to have improved SIGNIFICANTLY over what they were in 2007. (Lots of players do improve like that.) Anyway given that assuredness, what three players from this year's NESCAC teams would you take over those three? I might be tempted to go with Baskauskas and Wheeler but I said three. (Wheeler did look better the other night) The only three I would think about are Rudin, Smith and Edwards.

[walzy31]

SenFrost:  Your logic re: "3 starters returning from a NESCAC title holder = 2nd best in league this year" is definitely flawed.  You must've forgotten that last year, with five (5) starters returning from that NESCAC title holder, Williams finished 4-5 in the regular season (6th place) and lost in the NESCAC post-season tournament 1st round by 37 points.  This year, Williams has a new coach (& a new system) to deal with and only three (3) starters from that mediocre 4-5 season.  How can they leap-frog to 2nd best (on paper) in NESCAC?  I suppose that it's possible, but definitely not something to count on.  To me, it looks like Middlebury, Colby, Bowdoin, and Amherst - in that order.  The second tier is probably Williams, Bates, Williams, Trinity and Tufts - in that order.  Wesleyan & Conn Coll probably won't make the NESCAC post-season tournament.  But it's early in the season, so we'll see how it plays out.

Nice job picking apart Senator's math.
If you have Amherst cruising into the #4 hole at the end of the regular season then we need to talk in Las Vegas because I would love to put $$$ on them finishing in the top 3.
That wouldn't even be gambling.

[frank uible]

Why don't we all shut up, save our precious breaths for something useful and wait for a few short months - then we'll know for sure?

[ac08]

...that'd be less fun.

[ne-ball]

what do you all think of the freshman point guard situation at williams? how good does marcus wells seem now? did delaney (delbarton and then a year of prep) go elsewhere as he was also a freshman point guard that was supposedly going to williams?

[walzy31]

Why don't we all shut up, save our precious breaths for something useful and wait for a few short months - then we'll know for sure?

While we are at it, why don't we agree to not discuss any upcoming games or player matchups. Let's just wait and see before we try and talk about it.
This forum should abide by the presidential election protocol, which was that no one discussed the election until it was over.

[nescac1]

Williams has two frosh points: Wells and James Wang, who was also well-regarded.  Delaney was supposed to be very good but decided to go to Lafayette after Paulsen quit.  In the first game, Williams played no frosh at all -- Snyder moved to the point and he was backed up by two seniors, Golia and Kearney.  Considering all three graduate, I imagine Wang and/or Wells will get their chance in the future, but it looks like Maker will likely stick with the experienced guys this season. 

Ephs will get a strong test at home on Saturday against the winner of Ursinus / St. Lawrence. 

Still curious to hear more about what happened to Trinity, that is one of the worst out of conference losses for a non-bottom-feeder NESCAC team in years ...

[ne-ball]

thanks nescac. i imagine next year wang and wells will fight it out to run the point. i heard of another kid recruited at the point from poly prep in new york who finally bailed when he found out that paulsen was recruiting so many kids at the same position. if delaney would have gone, paulsen would have had 3 good, qualified point guards in the same year. any idea what the logic is?

[nescac1]

Not sure, but Paulsen's gone in any event and I imagine Maker will employ a different approach. 

[eclinchy]

SenFrost:  Your logic re: "3 starters returning from a NESCAC title holder = 2nd best in league this year" is definitely flawed.  You must've forgotten that last year, with five (5) starters returning from that NESCAC title holder, Williams finished 4-5 in the regular season (6th place) and lost in the NESCAC post-season tournament 1st round by 37 points.

You say that as though those are the only flaws!

What about... winning the title doesn't necessarily make you the best team? I mean, c'mon... tell me Trinity was better than Amherst (even Middlebury is a stretch) last year.

What about... doesn't it matter WHICH three starters return? Like, if you lose two All-NESCAC guys and just bring back the three role players around them, isn't that important to mention?

No? We're just gonna radically oversimplify everything? Okay...

[gobombers15]

Trinity...anyone...are they good?

[topoftheworld]

eclinchy,

aren't you forgetting the jumbos brought back 4 contributors to from the greatest tufts team ever last year and they...... oh wait

[eclinchy]

I think you're... agreeing with me? Hard to say.

[ac08]

Sen, I would go with the Midd 3 you mentioned; Baskauskas, Wheeler, and Holsey from the AC; Cutrone, Choice, and Simpson from Colby; and Ford, Rowe, and Westbrooks from Trin.