MBB: NESCAC

Old Guy · September 11, 2012, 09:09:07 PM

Appreciate Amh63's analysis, but demur: If Kaalsila were better than Holmes he would have played more. I side with Nescac1 on this one (though I worry that Kaasila will have a big year this year). Sleeping giant.

toad22 · September 11, 2012, 09:49:21 PM

Kaasila has a really nice low post jump hook, and is a good area rebounder. His biggest strength is in fact his strength. He is a horse. He will never be a consistent big scorer, but he is very valuable to Amherst. In many ways he reminds me of Drew Demuth, Williams' center on our 2003 national championship team. Michael Mayer, Williams' current center, is a completely different type of player. Last year, Mayer did not have a jump hook in his repertoire. Instead, he had so many unusual, completely instinctual moves. He led the team in scoring as a sophmore, something I doubt has ever been done before at Williams by a center. This year, I expect Mayer will come back with a first rate jump hook, more strength, and a knowlege that he can compete withy anyone in the country at our level. His upside is enormous. I wish Williams had Kaasila, but I'll take Mayer if I have to choose.

grabtherim · September 12, 2012, 08:34:02 AM

Quote from: Old Guy on September 11, 2012, 09:09:07 PM
Appreciate Amh63's analysis, but demur: If Kaalsila were better than Holmes he would have played more. I side with Nescac1 on this one (though I worry that Kaasila will have a big year this year). Sleeping giant.

Sort of agree with Old Guy, the problem for Amherst and the gameplans of the other NESCAC coaches, is the only thing which is consistent about him is his inconsistency. Like all of you, I have seen him look like great out there with nice finesse around the basket, but I have also been witness to games which left everyone in the gym scratching their heads. If he puts it all together over his last season which I think he may well do, Amherst will be a much tougher team to plan for than they already are. This should be one heck of a season with solid returning players all over the league. Moreover, with very few exceptions, the beauty of D3 is you really do not know too much about the value of incoming players until they are seen in the heat of league games. Can't wait.

gordonmann · September 12, 2012, 09:18:32 AM

SE_D3_fan:

I agree with everything NESCAC1 said, including the preeminence of the WIAC. If you want to see how all the conferences compare in terms of non-conference record or NCAA tournament performance, check out the D3hoops Conference Guidebook. Check out pages 4-8.

I'm putting together the updated version that includes 2011-2012 results right now.

amh63 · September 12, 2012, 09:51:35 AM

Thanks all for the "debate" as the season is two months down the line. I guess we all can agree to disagree. One thing I do know is that Coach Hixon who reads this board...has told me that I should leave coaching to the professionals wrt to Amherst.
I must remind myself at times, especially after tough games, that these players are not robots that perform the same game after game. Matchups, health issues, and even the stresses of school and life can alter a player's play on the floor. Coach Hixon pointed out that big Pete was injured early last season and Holmes arrived late to the team from his time abroad...slowing team chemistry a little. When Toomey was hurt last season, the team lost a game. Kalema was put in to the point guard position and had to learn on the fly. Late in the season, not only could Kalema provide backup relief for Toomey, but was paired with Toomey often to give the team more overall quickness, etc.. There is anticipated joy of watching the season to come.....to see how favorite players develop, new players are incorporated and how coaches play "chess" with their respected opponents.
Meanwhile, I will continue to converse here with you'll with limited knowledge and speculate.

madzillagd · September 12, 2012, 01:03:56 PM

I haven't seen these guys play yet so I can't speak to their roles and how they fit into their team's game plan, but just taking an objective look at the statistics I don't see how you can compare the two. Mayer is a very consistent scoring threat and an average to poor rebounder for his size. Kaasila is an average scorer at best and a poor rebounder for his size.

21 out of 24 games last year Mayer scored 10 pts or more. As a comparison, Toomey did it 25 out of 28 games. That's incredible consistency for both. Compare that to Kaasila's 6 out of 29 games and you can see the gap. You're not spending much prep time worrying about Kaasila if you are taking on the LJs. Even if he does have a big game he never put up more than 16 so he still is not going to have that much of an overall impact on the scoreboard. Even if his numbers improve this year, just doesn't seem like the type of player that you are going to suddenly give a much bigger role to in your offense. If he pushes his numbers up I suspect it will come through offensive rebounds and simply higher minutes.

Everybody starts the year off at 0, but if I was a betting man I'd definitely be putting money on Mayer to make a big move this year. If you look at the last 6 games of the year, he averaged 20.5 pts 10.3 rbs a game. Those are monster stats and I don't expect him to be able to do that over the course of the year but it does give you an idea of how good he can be. Over that same stretch Kaasila went 7.8 & 4.3. Not a whole lot of improvement to build on.

If I'm Coach Hixon I'd be happy if I could consistently get 8 & 8 out of Kaasila, with solid defense on the inside. With Mayer, I think you're looking for more like 16 & 8 with 16 being a conservative number and 8 boards being a stretch.

amh63 · September 12, 2012, 05:05:00 PM

Mad.....not to question your knowledge/expertise and your "objective" analyses of the stats, I will simply have to say....you will have to see the games and observe how the players fit into the team play and game plan and how game plans change during the games.
I too expect Mayer to have a great year for he does have a fine upside.
However, I will like to point out several areas that comparing stats between particular players without knowing their particular value or roles in games can be a little short sighted.
First, in the Amherst vs Williams games, both sides REALLY want to win. Guess you know that. In the first game, Kaasilla started and Mayer did not start, even when he was a very productive player. Emerson started for Williams. Kaasilla played a vital role in the close win. In the second game at Amherst, Kaasila again started as well as Emerson. Again it was a close game and Mayer played well. However, it is interesting to note that in the second close game, Williams' coach played more players and kept in the game Nate Robertson, a very fine and vital player, for most of the game when his stats were not great. I was at the game. Both coaches went for quickness, speed and defense as the game went on. Mayer may have put up great stats but he did not stay in the game more than his usual minutes. Nate Robertson has been the player and was the key player for Williams in the game....imho. Amherst as in many of its games over the season, gets it's rebounds from Workman, Barrise and other guards/forwards and its points from them as well.
Looking at the last 6 or 7 games that Amherst played.....especially in the conference tourney and in the NCAA, Kaasila had his playing time reduced and his stats went down. The majority of the games were blow outs (except for the Midd. game) and many of the starters played less.
Rest assured, Coach Hixon will play and start big Pete this season. I also hope Pete will have a fine season. I trust Hixon and he will again build a team that will strive to win the title again.....and big Pete will be a vital part of the team and season.

P'bearfan · September 12, 2012, 08:29:39 PM

gordonmann,

Very interesting guide to the conferences. Thanks for posting.

madzillagd · September 13, 2012, 02:45:06 PM

amh63,

Essentially what you are saying is that Udonis Haslem and his role on the Miami Heat is as important as Pau Gasol and his role on the Lakers. Haslem doesn't get as many boards because of strong rebounding wings, he's not asked to score a lot, but he fills his spot and supports the other players well. Gasol on the other hand is the main post player, expected to put points on the board but has a lot of weaknesses to other parts of his game.

It's more a comparison of how well they fill their respective roles than a comparison of the players and their individual skills.

amh63 · September 13, 2012, 04:03:50 PM

Madz.......Well put..and more pointed than I could state. However, after watching Gasol in the Olympics, I think he has more ups than weakness. Be interesting to see how his role change this year with his big team mate up front gone.
If I got the numbers correct, in the last few minutes of the 2nd Amherst vs Williams game, Kaasila and Emerson were on the floor...there was a tall Williams player with a number 50. Kaasila had 3 blocks in that game and none for both Emerson and Mayer.
You can catch some of the highlights of the games on the Amherst Website in the Utube/video section. There is also some of the Midd vs. Amherst game with All-American Sharry. Of course it maybe bias video. Maybe the Williams site has some video of the games.

madzillagd · September 18, 2012, 12:07:43 PM

Noticed something this AM on my usual peak to see if anyone has posted their schedule. The NESCAC site has a scrimmage 11/3 between Midd & Centenary (NJ). Do CAC schools usually scrimmage that early (2 days into practice right?)? Also, 300 miles seems like a long way to go for a scrimmage.

http://www.nescac.com/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule

gordonmann · September 18, 2012, 01:56:06 PM

It's not unusual to see scrimmages in early November, but I can't recall ever seeing a NESCAC team travelling that distance to play one. Particularly against a team that likely isn't at Middlebury's level. The Cyclones went 12-13 last in year a conference that isn't very strong, aside from the top two or three teams. Maybe there's some connection between Middlebury and Centenary's new coach.

toad22 · September 19, 2012, 10:55:46 PM

I hear that James Wang has won a job playing basketball in China. I watched James this spring and early summer practicing and playing around Williamstown. He looked really good. He was getting is "pop" and shooting back. He was able to secure several tryouts in China (he speaks Chinese). I'm told he wowed the coaches over there and won a contract. I'm very happy for him. He worked so hard last season to try to recover his game after his back surgery. He was still hurt, and never got back. Now he seems to have recovered, and his work is paying off.

madzillagd · September 19, 2012, 10:56:19 PM

http://athletics.trincoll.edu/sports/mbkb/2012-13/releases/Men-s_Basketball_11213

September 19, 2012
Trinity Men's Basketball Announces 2012-13 Schedule

Hartford, Conn. - The Trinity College men's basketball team has announced its schedule for the 2012-13 season. Trinity, coached by James Cosgrove (3rd Season), finished the 2011-12 season with an overall record of 10-14 and came in ninth place in the NESCAC with a 2-8 conference mark.

The Bantams will begin against Worcester State in the 2012-13 campaign in the Mass.-Dartmouth Invitational on Nov. 15, and will attempt a third title defense at the Harbor Invitational at Mass.-Boston on Nov. 23 and 24. Trinity closes the calendar year with its own invitational tournament including the Bantams, McDaniel, FDu-Florham, and Regis. The Bantams have won all six invitational tournaments they have entered in Cosgrove's first two seasons at the helm. NESCAC play opens on the road against Connecticut College on Jan. 4 and continues through the regular-season finale at Williams on Feb. 9. Four teams that finished among the top 25 in the final 2011-12 D3Hoops.com National Poll, Eastern Connecticut, Albertus Magnus, Amherst, and Middlebury, appear on the Trinity schedule.

Schedule
http://athletics.trincoll.edu/sports/mbkb/2012-13/schedule

madzillagd · September 19, 2012, 11:09:36 PM

Quote from: toad22 on September 19, 2012, 10:55:46 PM
I hear that James Wang has won a job playing basketball in China. I watched James this spring and early summer practicing and playing around Williamstown. He looked really good. He was getting is "pop" and shooting back. He was able to secure several tryouts in China (he speaks Chinese). I'm told he wowed the coaches over there and won a contract. I'm very happy for him. He worked so hard last season to try to recover his game after his back surgery. He was still hurt, and never got back. Now he seems to have recovered, and his work is paying off.

Yep. My bro has been staying connected to him - saw a pic the other day from some news site with James and Jeremy Lin chatting. Everything is in Chinese so you can't find clips etc. on YouTube but here's a peak...

http://www.tudou.com/programs/view/2sYXxlh03LQ/