MBB: NESCAC

Started by cameltime, April 27, 2005, 02:38:16 PM

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P'bearfan

QuoteAnd we have our first NESCAC class of 2019 commitment, according to Nothing but NESCAC, Hilal Dahleh:

http://www.hudl.com/athlete/2294016/highlights/128573376

Hate highlight tapes, but this one is quite revealing.  Force this kid to his right hand until he proves that it's a heck of a lot better than shown.  Goes left with confidence, right not so much, and even took layups with his left hand from the right side.  He should spend this season and summer working on his right until his arm falls off.

GTR - great catch.  I looked at the video quickly but missed that - and it's a pet peeve of mine.  Any player at the college level should be able to finish a layup with either hand.  I often watch the pre-game warm up drills and just shake my head at the number of players who clearly can't do this.   Being able to drive left or right with confidence isn't graduate level work either - especially for a guard.

amh63

Now show me a guard that can stuff the basket with either hand and I would pay to see him play in college.  Had a HS classmate that could do that at 6'3".  In those days, that height would put you in the front court.  Big fellow..big hands...played football and went on to play BB in Philly at that Jesuit school on the Mainline. 
Believe there was a short guard last year on the UMass- Amherst BB team that led his team...less than 6' that could stuff the ball.  Do not know if he could do it with either hand..had the hops.
Kalema at 6 foot could and would finish a drive to the lane with a flush. 
Wonder if Calvin Murphy.... During his days at Nigara?..could score with either hand.
Ronk...need your help here. :)

toad22

I don't know if the following is 'modern coaching', or just an idiosyncrasy of Mike Maker, but he always insisted that his players finish at the rim with their dominant hand. His Williams teams practiced this endlessly. They got really good at it after a while.

ronk

Quote from: amh63 on October 15, 2014, 04:33:42 PM
Now show me a guard that can stuff the basket with either hand and I would pay to see him play in college.  Had a HS classmate that could do that at 6'3".  In those days, that height would put you in the front court.  Big fellow..big hands...played football and went on to play BB in Philly at that Jesuit school on the Mainline. 
Believe there was a short guard last year on the UMass- Amherst BB team that led his team...less than 6' that could stuff the ball.  Do not know if he could do it with either hand..had the hops.
Kalema at 6 foot could and would finish a drive to the lane with a flush. 
Wonder if Calvin Murphy.... During his days at Nigara?..could score with either hand.
Ronk...need your help here. :)

I saw Calvin score 68 in a high school all-star tournament game, but he was so quick, accurate, with hops that I don't remember him using his off hand.
That Jesuit school on the Mainline back then had a 5-11 guard(Steve Courtin) that could reverse dunk.

booyakasha

Quote from: toad22 on October 15, 2014, 07:03:20 PM
I don't know if the following is 'modern coaching', or just an idiosyncrasy of Mike Maker, but he always insisted that his players finish at the rim with their dominant hand. His Williams teams practiced this endlessly. They got really good at it after a while.

Spot on Toad. The ability to drive either direction and being able to finish with both hands are independent of one another, the latter being overrated (and usually only touted by dinosaurs ;D).

nescac1

Troy Whittington was notorious for going on virtually every move to his strong hand.  Everyone knew what was coming, and he still couldn't be stopped.  Of course, it helps to be stronger, faster, and able to jump higher than every opposing center!

Wesleyan has its season preview posted: http://www.wesleyan.edu/athletics/news/2014/10/mbbpreview101314.html

Definitely a sleeper this year.  Rashid Epps is kind of a poor man's Whittington, undersized but with long arms, good strength, and great jumping ability -- I think he could have a big junior year and contend for all-NESCAC honors if he becomes more consistent.  Kuo looked last year like a guy who could develop into a very good defensive stopper inside.  Cards have great size overall, with two other 6'7 seniors, one of whom missed last year with injury, and they bring in three frosh big men. 

Rafferty should be one of the best PGs in NESCAC with a year of experience under his belt.  It will be fun to watch last year's really impressive crop of frosh points guards -- Rafferty, Brown, Greenman, Berman, Tarik Smith -- go after each other as sophomores, as they all utilize VERY different styles of play, and all will be counted on to be leaders as sophomores. 

Wesleyan also has plenty of wing shooting with Edmonds, Mackey, Davis, Bartner, and Reed.  They need to figure out which three of those five guys will be the go-to players on the perimeter.  Cards are probably still a year away from contending without much of a senior class presence and without one true go-to star established, but with a lot of now-experienced depth, they will be a lot more competitive this year and will surprise a few teams.  They seem to play much more unselfishly and in a team-oriented style than some past Cardinal squads that had more star power at the top of the rotation. 


grabtherim

Quote from: booyakasha on October 16, 2014, 06:25:07 AM
Quote from: toad22 on October 15, 2014, 07:03:20 PM
I don't know if the following is 'modern coaching', or just an idiosyncrasy of Mike Maker, but he always insisted that his players finish at the rim with their dominant hand. His Williams teams practiced this endlessly. They got really good at it after a while.

Spot on Toad. The ability to drive either direction and being able to finish with both hands are independent of one another, the latter being overrated (and usually only touted by dinosaurs ;D).

I totally get finishing with your dominant hand when you can, but it doesn't always work.  That said, simply put: a guard has to be able to use both hands without thought the further away from the basket he is. 
In many cases, it's different up front.  Whittington was a good example to cite, but I would still rather have a big man who will not hesitate to go left or right. 
Watch how many guards can take unlimited dribbles, especially bringing it up under pressure, with their strong hand but pick it up after 2-3 with their off hand.  Any decent coach sees this, has his kid overplay the strong hand and therefore changes what the team wants to do or at the least their comfort level.     

amh63

Like this "technical" stuff.  I'm on the side of GTR....a MIDDHOOPS term :)
If coaches are out recruiting, I will bet the house that they prefer players that can go both ways with the ball.  Would I be wrong to say that this is a factor that distinguish a D1 player from a D3 level player?

Old Guy

Quote from: amh63 on October 16, 2014, 11:07:20 AM
Like this "technical" stuff.  I'm on the side of GTR....a MIDDHOOPS term :)
If coaches are out recruiting, I will bet the house that they prefer players that can go both ways with the ball.  Would I be wrong to say that this is a factor that distinguish a D1 player from a D3 level player?

Drives me crazy. I'm with Maker, Toad, etc. Finish, period. Make the hoop. All good players should be able to the basket with either hand; which hand they finish with is unimportant - as long as they finish. Ambidexterity handling the ball is very important, shooting with either hand less so. Finish.

Now driving to the basket from right to left, coming across the lane, is the exception - it only makes sense to be fluid with the off-hand. 

grabtherim

Quote from: Old Guy on October 16, 2014, 11:44:37 AM
Quote from: amh63 on October 16, 2014, 11:07:20 AM
Like this "technical" stuff.  I'm on the side of GTR....a MIDDHOOPS term :)
If coaches are out recruiting, I will bet the house that they prefer players that can go both ways with the ball.  Would I be wrong to say that this is a factor that distinguish a D1 player from a D3 level player?

Drives me crazy. I'm with Maker, Toad, etc. Finish, period. Make the hoop. All good players should be able to the basket with either hand; which hand they finish with is unimportant - as long as they finish. Ambidexterity handling the ball is very important, shooting with either hand less so. Finish. Now driving to the basket from right to left, coming across the lane, is the exception - it only makes sense to be fluid with the off-hand.

Clearly everyone is ready for some real basketball. "Finish"  I agree, but just think back a few short seasons.  Might have been a heck of a lot easier to "finish" and get a shot up vs A. Locke from the left side with your left hand than your right.  Hope to see you at Pepin this season for some pacing around.  We can "finish" with a few cold ones at Ups. 
   

Bucket

Quote from: grabtherim on October 16, 2014, 12:01:24 PM
Quote from: Old Guy on October 16, 2014, 11:44:37 AM
Quote from: amh63 on October 16, 2014, 11:07:20 AM
Like this "technical" stuff.  I'm on the side of GTR....a MIDDHOOPS term :)
If coaches are out recruiting, I will bet the house that they prefer players that can go both ways with the ball.  Would I be wrong to say that this is a factor that distinguish a D1 player from a D3 level player?

Drives me crazy. I'm with Maker, Toad, etc. Finish, period. Make the hoop. All good players should be able to the basket with either hand; which hand they finish with is unimportant - as long as they finish. Ambidexterity handling the ball is very important, shooting with either hand less so. Finish. Now driving to the basket from right to left, coming across the lane, is the exception - it only makes sense to be fluid with the off-hand.

Clearly everyone is ready for some real basketball. "Finish"  I agree, but just think back a few short seasons.  Might have been a heck of a lot easier to "finish" and get a shot up vs A. Locke from the left side with your left hand than your right.  Hope to see you at Pepin this season for some pacing around.  We can "finish" with a few cold ones at Ups. 


Locke still would have blocked it, no matter the hand used.


P'bearfan

QuoteLike this "technical" stuff.  I'm on the side of GTR....a MIDDHOOPS term :)
If coaches are out recruiting, I will bet the house that they prefer players that can go both ways with the ball.  Would I be wrong to say that this is a factor that distinguish a D1 player from a D3 level player?

No there are major D1 point guards who can only go one way....e.g. Tahj Shamsid Deen the sophomore PG at Auburn.  Highly recruited kid from the Atlanta area.  Beat our HS team on a last second play.  Coming out of a time out everyone knew 2 things:  1) Tahj was getting the ball; 2) Tahj was going left.  Only way he can go.....it didn't matter. 

Saw an Auburn game last year (believe he started as a FY) and he did the same thing.  He must go left 90%+ of the time but he's just so quick and difficult to stop.  The problem is eventually he'll run into a defense that will be smart and athletic enough to trap him.

middhoops

Using your outside hand when going to the hoop against defense makes a physical difference.  The offensive player can hold the ball in his distant hand, making it much harder to block.
When taking the ball into pressure (think Locke) it doesn't matter which hand as long as the timing is right to get the ball up, unblocked.  It may actually be easier to draw a foul when using the inside hand because the big guy doesn't expect it.
Really smart penetrators know the dominant hand of the shot blocker, too.

madzillagd

I'm in shock.  It's October still and Williams has already posted their schedule & roster.  :o

nescac1

Good to see that Lewis Hayes has added one inch and 30 pounds over the course of football season (he's listed on football roster as 6'4, 195, and on the hoops roster as 6'5, 225) :).  Darrias Sime also grew an inch, apparently ...

With an entirely new coaching staff running presumably a somewhat different system, three frosh, and three football guys who will need time to get in sync on a fairly small roster, it's going to be interesting to see how quickly this team can come together.  The early season games, even though not against a murderer's row of opponents, will certainly pose a major challenge.