MBB: NESCAC

[Conts Fan]

In any case, Hamilton is not playing like a highly ranked team now, imho.

Certainly not today, but every team has off games. Their game scores are pretty much the same as their results from last year, where had they made their foul shots against Springfield, they may well have ended up as a #5 team. Now if they play like this again next week against Wesleyan and lose by 15, then they clearly have a problem.

[MiddWatcher]

"A side note: Zach Baines was alluded to in another post, and while he's been gone so long it's silly to go down the "what if..." rabbit hole—and not fair to the current Panther players, either—though I will say it's not his scoring that is missed the most, but his defense. Kornaker-Farrell played really good D on Hutcherson, forcing him to take (and make) high-degree-of-difficulty shots and NBA-range 3s, but neither of Midd's stellar guards have the length of Baines."

Yes, I am with ' Bucket ' on not bringing up the past ..... but I will bring up the current numbers as regards this issue, particularly as regards the rather harsh ( I thought ) indictment of the Middlebury team and players by the Mountain Man earlier in this blog. The two posts are somewhat related in that the Midd team is certainly challenged defensively. But I would suggest that all teams will be challenged by " physical, slashers " who are as talented as players like Hutcherson and Labossiere. They are very good D3 players !  Two of Midd's " Bigs " are non-leapers who are going to be in foul trouble most games due to physical limitations, but their efforts are great and they really work hard. I think it's tough to make fun of them. Midd's backup " big " is DeLorenzo, who is filling in as a post defender ( for Cahill and Finn, who are both injured ). DeLo is now 6'3.5 - 180 pounds, and thought he was going to be a guard in college. ( used to be 200 pounds as a prep ).  He is trying really hard, too, but the size differential borders on the absurd. Folger, of course, is of quality - mostly due to his shot blocking ability. He is decent enough on the ball, but, again, a slight defender and some of the wider big guys have given him trouble, understandably so.

So, I give Farrell and others credit for playing guys a bit bigger than them and competing hard. It is a domino effect for the Middlebury coaching staff defensively. Not an easy scenario to work with, but I can attest that they are really trying and I compliment Coaches Brown and Merrill for their in-game manuevering. Quite a chess match. Farrell, who was guarding Hutcherson, scored 23 himself and had three tremendous steals off of direct passes that were magnificent. He can play.

Now, let's back up to ' Bucket ' and the related past/present and the Baines factor. I remember the November Endicott game when the Gulls came in and upended the Panthers in a shocker. Film review of that game showed Baines ( and Daly, too ) as the biggest defensive culprits. Gave up a combined 48 points to Endicott players they were responsible for. Frankly, I thought Baines was ONLY interested in blocking shots and dunking at the other end. Thought his ' defense ' ( coming from NEPSAC Class C level ) was poor. Fast forward to this year's undefeated Occidental team in the SCIAC. Senior All League player Baines currently grades out to a " Below Average " on the SynergySports board defensively. ( the Bible for college coaches ). He has given up 34 hoops on 85 shots ( 40% ).  In a weak league. By comparison, Hilal Dahleh at Middlebury is giving up 26% shooting on guys who he has been guarding. Even DeLorenzo, as outsized as he is by players 6 inches taller on a consistent basis, is being scored on 36% of the time. ALL of the Middlebury players ( in the top 8 who play ) grade out better than Baines' " Below Average ".

As someone famous once said, " this comes as no surprise to this observer ".

So, I compliment the Midd " bigs " for their efforts, and the smaller guys, too. Not easy, they will need to get better, for sure. But I disagree with Mountain Man's ridicule, as I am sure virtually all of the posters on this board would agree.  I would also mention that the Endicott team returned to Pepin for the NCAAs later that year, after the transfer, and after a season of competition. Midd blew them out by forty. Playing a 3-2 zone.  Maybe we will see more of that in the future.  I would also be very happy to see the ghost of Zach Baines retired from the Pepin World; what you ( think ) you see is not always what you get as a fan. Coaches and players usually know better. 

[jumpshot]

MiddWatcher ----

Your point about not ridiculing players is quite correct. Over the years on this board, anyone who has done so has quickly been judged way out of bounds.

The games, at least at Williams and other DIIIl leaders, are for the players.

Mountain Man and Colby Hoops are in the penalty box at the moment ....

[cacfan11]

"A side note: Zach Baines was alluded to in another post, and while he's been gone so long it's silly to go down the "what if..." rabbit hole—and not fair to the current Panther players, either—though I will say it's not his scoring that is missed the most, but his defense. Kornaker-Farrell played really good D on Hutcherson, forcing him to take (and make) high-degree-of-difficulty shots and NBA-range 3s, but neither of Midd's stellar guards have the length of Baines."

Yes, I am with ' Bucket ' on not bringing up the past ..... but I will bring up the current numbers as regards this issue, particularly as regards the rather harsh ( I thought ) indictment of the Middlebury team and players by the Mountain Man earlier in this blog. The two posts are somewhat related in that the Midd team is certainly challenged defensively. But I would suggest that all teams will be challenged by " physical, slashers " who are as talented as players like Hutcherson and Labossiere. They are very good D3 players !  Two of Midd's " Bigs " are non-leapers who are going to be in foul trouble most games due to physical limitations, but their efforts are great and they really work hard. I think it's tough to make fun of them. Midd's backup " big " is DeLorenzo, who is filling in as a post defender ( for Cahill and Finn, who are both injured ). DeLo is now 6'3.5 - 180 pounds, and thought he was going to be a guard in college. ( used to be 200 pounds as a prep ).  He is trying really hard, too, but the size differential borders on the absurd. Folger, of course, is of quality - mostly due to his shot blocking ability. He is decent enough on the ball, but, again, a slight defender and some of the wider big guys have given him trouble, understandably so.

So, I give Farrell and others credit for playing guys a bit bigger than them and competing hard. It is a domino effect for the Middlebury coaching staff defensively. Not an easy scenario to work with, but I can attest that they are really trying and I compliment Coaches Brown and Merrill for their in-game manuevering. Quite a chess match. Farrell, who was guarding Hutcherson, scored 23 himself and had three tremendous steals off of direct passes that were magnificent. He can play.

Now, let's back up to ' Bucket ' and the related past/present and the Baines factor. I remember the November Endicott game when the Gulls came in and upended the Panthers in a shocker. Film review of that game showed Baines ( and Daly, too ) as the biggest defensive culprits. Gave up a combined 48 points to Endicott players they were responsible for. Frankly, I thought Baines was ONLY interested in blocking shots and dunking at the other end. Thought his ' defense ' ( coming from NEPSAC Class C level ) was poor. Fast forward to this year's undefeated Occidental team in the SCIAC. Senior All League player Baines currently grades out to a " Below Average " on the SynergySports board defensively. ( the Bible for college coaches ). He has given up 34 hoops on 85 shots ( 40% ).  In a weak league. By comparison, Hilal Dahleh at Middlebury is giving up 26% shooting on guys who he has been guarding. Even DeLorenzo, as outsized as he is by players 6 inches taller on a consistent basis, is being scored on 36% of the time. ALL of the Middlebury players ( in the top 8 who play ) grade out better than Baines' " Below Average ".

As someone famous once said, " this comes as no surprise to this observer ".

So, I compliment the Midd " bigs " for their efforts, and the smaller guys, too. Not easy, they will need to get better, for sure. But I disagree with Mountain Man's ridicule, as I am sure virtually all of the posters on this board would agree.  I would also mention that the Endicott team returned to Pepin for the NCAAs later that year, after the transfer, and after a season of competition. Midd blew them out by forty. Playing a 3-2 zone.  Maybe we will see more of that in the future.  I would also be very happy to see the ghost of Zach Baines retired from the Pepin World; what you ( think ) you see is not always what you get as a fan. Coaches and players usually know better.

Sobel currently leads the nescac in blocks by a considerable margin, and if you look at blocks/minute it is even more impressive.

[Bucket]

Trinity "robbed" of a chance to win at Hamilton today in regulation.  Yes, Trinity with 9.6 seconds to go in the game and the game tied at 70 apiece had the ball in the front court.  Coming out of a time out, and with the confidence of playing Hamilton even and HFC instruction.....PG, Is called for a pawning violation!   Ball to Hamilton...and the Continentals scores 2 points with less than a sec. to go.
Thought Trinity's coaches would go crazy at the ref's call...in front of the Bantam's bench. 
Trinity had a lead for about 95 percent of the game and at halftime too!  2nd half was a foul fest filled with questionable calls by refs throughout.
In any case, Hamilton is not playing like a highly ranked team now, imho.

Hamilton wins a game in which they did not play well against traditionally TOUGH trinity program. This is the 3rd game all year Hamilton played a team to single digits( winning all others by double digits) and is 37-5 in two years... you're right not a top 5 team....

If this was an Amherst program that had the same record and same stats in a two year period, something tells me there would be a different narrative and view from some on this board regarding the continentals...

Since you brought up Amherst, they did beat Trinity by about 30 on Friday.

[Mountain Man]

Bantams ALMOST... Palming violation in Tie Game gives ball back to Hamilton. Groll rolls in hook shot 72-70.

Great First Weekend

Williams takes the CLEAR = team to be beaten mantle at top of NESCAC

Bantams used my strategy to ALMOST....win.  Take Gilmour away & force the rest to win  4-10 & 15 points = pedestrian for Gilmour.
Just 7 points for Gilmour in the last 30 minutes of game.
Hoffman fouled out just 16 minutes. Denloye chipped in 12 from bench to balance that loss

Score was 72-70. You see how the slow (very chippy-foul fest) tempo hurts Hamilton. Slow tempo usually outlasts fast tempo team

Trinity has the athletes slow Gilmour. Middlebury does not. Middlebury will have to outscore Hamilton in a track meet.

[Colby Hoops]

MiddWatcher ----

Your point about not ridiculing players is quite correct. Over the years on this board, anyone who has done so has quickly been judged way out of bounds.

The games, at least at Williams and other DIIIl leaders, are for the players.

Mountain Man and Colby Hoops are in the penalty box at the moment ....

Must've missed where I ridiculed a player! Certainly didn't intend to if anything was taken that way.

[MiddWatcher]

Colby Hoops :

Comment about Penalty Box was not mine.  Seems to have been lumped into my much lengthier commentary about Midd defensive situation. My objection is to the other poster mentioned treating these young guys as if they are professionals. They are not. Just D3 athletes playing a game that they love. A " peripheral aptitude " as designated by D3 Admissions people.

Would never put a Colby person in penalty box : )   

[Colby Hoops]

Appreciate that MiddWatcher and agree with your comments! It was Jumpshot who lumped me in, and not sure why. Perhaps my use of "atrocious" describing the first half of the Colby-Bates (might have been a bit strong in retrospect ) but definitely never intended for any individual players.

In general, I do think it's okay to be critical (within reason) of the teams as long as it's not over the top and/or directed at individuals. These players take these games very seriously, and they are far more critical of their own games than we are! Obviously, it's just D3 basketball and all of these young men have studies, volunteer work and bright futures on which they are focused. In the long run, winning or losing these games means very little, but don't tell these players that!

[nescac1]

If nothing else, this weekend's games are a cautionary tale about not overreacting to a single game.  Colby won at Bates by 17 just TWO games ago, and lost at home to Bates by 10 this weekend.  There are other examples as well, but anyone can have one really off day or one unusually scorching-hot day ...

[ContinentalDomer]

Yes - a voice of reason!

Here's another example:  Trinity v Hamilton.  Trinity took the floor with a few things on its collective minds - the prospect of an 0-2 start in league, an extra day to prepare after getting pasted by Amherst on Friday, and memories of getting rocked by Hamilton last season.  Trinity began the game - and played to the wire - with characteristic intensity and focus.  The Bantams also played in desperation mode.  Hamilton benched its starters after 3 minutes, down 8-4.  Soon, Trinity led 19-4.  Hamilton spent the rest of the afternoon digging out of that hole.  This is certainly a game Hamilton would've lost 2-3 years ago.  The fact that Hamilton managed to eke out a win says a great deal about the team.

As to the final sequence, the referee who called the violation indicated that as Trinity's point guard dribbled off time near half court, the ball stuck on/rolled up his hip, which resulted in the discontinued dribble call.  Apparently, it had nothing to do with the way he was bouncing the ball and more or less cradling it (something that's never called).  Was it a close call?  No doubt.  Was it a violation?  Almost certainly.  Was it the worst possible moment to make a call?  Yes.  Bottom line - the way the ball got stuck on the kid's leg likely would've led to a call at any time.  On the final play, Trinity loaded up on Gilmour and the other shooters.  As Gilmour was covered, Hamilton ran the play to Grassey's side, and he fed Groll for the finish. 

Trinity can pose nightmares for any opponent when they're locked in.  When the Bantams have a lead, it is particularly difficult to play uphill against them.  In the end, Hamilton overcame a large deficit, great Trinity defense, and foul trouble, and then made a bunch of big stops to win a game that will serve them well in March when no one remembers the score - and during the rest of the season should anyone think about falling asleep on a NESCAC opponent.

If nothing else, this weekend's games are a cautionary tale about not overreacting to a single game.  Colby won at Bates by 17 just TWO games ago, and lost at home to Bates by 10 this weekend.  There are other examples as well, but anyone can have one really off day or one unusually scorching-hot day ...

[Colby Hoops]

Looks like Colby's game against U Maine Farmington has been moved from tomorrow night to tonight. Maybe some snow concerns for tomorrow. In a weird scheduling quirk Colby will have played Bates twice and UMF twice within their last 6 games. Not really sure why they are playing UMF twice this year as neither game is part of a tournament.

[amh63]

Amherst has a game tonight at 7pm with Brandeis.  Another out of conf. game before two weekend games with Conn. and Wes.  It is noted that the CT. Teams have always given Amherst trouble in the past.  On Amherst's twitter there is a video interview with F. Che.  He comments that defense has been heavily stressed in practices to date. 
Hope the game goes well and quickly......seems there is a college football game later I want to watch .

[Colby Hoops]

Fun read on former Williams commit Miye Oni, now an NBA prospect: https://www.forbes.com/sites/adamzagoria/2019/01/07/how-yales-miye-oni-went-from-division-3-college-commit-to-an-nba-prospect/#5dd85e371a92

[nescac1]

Not so fun if you are a Williams fan, of course ... The financial aid stuff is odd given that Williams is generally very generous with aid, and in all events, I wonder if he would have stuck around after his first year even if he had started out at Williams.  Nevertheless, it's pretty crazy that Williams until very late in the process had Oni, Scadlock, Heskett and Casey all arriving as part of the same recruiting class.