MBB: NESCAC

[ChesterGreen]

cbone- 'Until a Rhoten led team actually wins something it is a joke to compare the two players' Your right, you can't compare the two, Schiel is not even in the same class as Rhoten.  Schiel played on a BETTER TEAM, he was no where near the player that Rhoten was last year and is this year.  Every game Rhoten plays the game plan of other teams is to shut him down and as formerbant pointed out you might really have to go back to maybe his freshmen year that this has been sucessful.  I've seen Schiel out played many times and left looking like the second or even third best big man on the court at times.  And I'm saying this and I'm not even a fan of Rhoten but you have to give credit where credit is due.  All things aside he is the best player in the league this year and was last year despite whatever player of the year awards want to say. 

[formerbant10]

Chester, seems like we may agree on something finally.  I like it.  No way Rhoten and Schiel are in the same class.  Rhoten has 1,850 points.  Yes Amherst has had some better teams, but you can thank guys like Adam Harper for that.
Bedford did play the same amount of minutes last year and didn't put up Rhoten numbers.  Wheeler never will.  Both are good players, Bedford and Rhoten grew up together, but get real.  Rhoten averaged 19.7 as a freshman, Schiel didn't even do that as a senior.

[nescac1]

Wow, sounds like quite a win for Williams, wish I could have seen that one. Desperately needed.   Live by the three, die by the three, I guess this game they lived by it.  Shalvoy had another amazing game it sounds like -- he has got to be the most improved player in NESCAC, assist to TO ratio is unreal and now he is scoring as well.  Interesting that frosh Snyder started over senior Gibbons -- anyone know the story there?  Gibbons was leading the team in minutes in the first few games but his PT has gradually diminished to a low point yesterday.

Good to see the bench producing with Hanifan's big game and Kuntz making a nice contribution.  Williams clearly still has a lot of work to do, only three more games to work out some kinks before the game at Amherst, where Williams will be in big trouble unless they improve on defense and get some interior game going on offense -- you know Amherst won't let them get many uncontested 3's.  But given the youth of this team, led by two sophomores, 7 and 2 is nothing to sneeze at.  If Hanifan continues to contribute and Weisbrot can develop into a rebounding / post defense threat, the Eph sophomore class should carry them for the next few years.  What a brutal loss for Springfield, they have to be one of the best 1-7 teams in recent history.  I still think they could win NEWMAC, not that much of a difference in talent between they and WPI really despite the wildly disparate records.  Have to wonder what their coach was thinking scheduling such a brutal slate of early-season opponents, not a gimme among the bunch.  Compare to Midd, who gained some confidence and momentum with a few wins against inferior teams and now has played well against some tougher opponents. 

In the region, Plymouth and Midd both go down, Keene barely survives, it really is a crapshoot after Amherst and WPI.   Tufts is looking very strong, and it seems like Trinity and Bates may be starting to put it together.  Midd is clearly better than expected, but I still think once conference play gets going, Tufts, Trinity, Bates and Williams will be fighting for second, with Tufts looking like the early favorite due to their balance and depth. 

[toad22]

Gibbons hurt his foot in the last game. They didn't think he was going to be able to play at all, but he improved enough to log a few minutes. In general, Williams is currently a completely unbalanced team, with almost no inside game. They shot 44 3 pointers! That seems like it should be some kind of record. They scored 15 in overtime, all 3s. I know they are working hard to improve inside, but for now, look for more of the same. It is on the defensive end that the greatest challenge exists. They need more stops.

[Mike T]

formerbant, you are a huge loser, why dont you stop posting every 5 seconds and do something with ur life...or are you still haunted  by single handedly ending your team's season last year, and just cant let it go?

[nescachoopsfan]

Mike T why do you care if someone posts, i dont see why any animosity has to come out of talking hoops.  Anyway, i think that it is very tough to compare schiel with rhoten.  Rhoten's numbers are ridiculous, but schiel never had to put up those kind of numbers.  i just think rhoten has been able to prove his maximum abilities, while schiel played within a system, and played with a much more balanced attack.  i would say its tough to compare.  on another note people arent giving dan martin of tufts any credit this year.  he is really carrying them offensively.  He is a legitimate center at 6'9" and the jumbos are really featuring him on offense.  they try and get him the ball all the time and let him go to work.  now that stovell is gone from tufts, martin is able to work on the block and really make defenses focus on him and allow the tufts guards to spot up and hit shots.  its a new look tufts team, and i cant wait for nescac games to start because of the many young unpredictable teams.

[baller i b]

Now that most NESCAC teams are done with their first semesters, i figured it would be fun to just throw out the first and second team of the first semester and maybe some interesting observations.  This year, the best players break down at strange positions, so the teams look a little weird, but bare with me...

First Team -
C Rhoten
F Stockwell
F Petrie
G Rose
G Bedford


Second Team-
C- D. Martin
C- Cohen
F- Wietzen/Jenkins
G- Shepard
G- Ray

On the bubble: Clarke, Bradley, Olsen, Shalvoy, Ashe, Hippert, Casnocha, Wheeler, Pelletier, Stone (I realize it's big bubble, but its early)

The hardest part was picking 2 of 3 out of Ray, Rose, Bedord, all have had great starts and Bedford's numbers are diminished because Amherst blows everyone out, maybe you could also throw Olsen on the second team and have some fun by moving Ray to the 2.  This might be the first time in a long time the NESCAC has had far more talented guards than big men, especially at the point. 

The biggest suprise of the year has been Mid's 7-1 and CC's 6-2, while not a lot of their wins have come at the expense of unbelievable competition, early season wins help confidence and make it far more possible for upsets during the conference season. 

The biggest dissapointment of the season so far has to be Trinity, although they have picked it up lately, the two losses to suspect oppenents will hurt their chances if it comes down to a pool C bid after the conference tournament, which it looks like it very well could.  In years passed they could just flat out outscore their opponents, and while Clarke and Rhoten put up numbers in bunches, their scoring depth seems to be largely absent. 

Alright, just wanted to stir up some discussion, interested to see some responses...

[formerbant10]

Oh Michael, sorry if I like posting.  What are you doing with your life that's so amazing pray tell???
And no I'm not haunted for not playing well in a game...it's life and I've moved on.  Sorry to disappoint you so much.  Clearly you still think about it though, good for you.  Glad you can let it go too.

Baller, the only thing I might change is putting Drew Cohen on the first team.  His stats put him there, but the team isn't doing as well as the others, so no big argument there.
I'd have to put Olson in over Shepperd though.  Olson makes that team go.  He's got to be 2nd team at least.  Other than that, the picks look solid to me.

The Bantams are still trying to find their legs.  An unexpected leave of absence (Taylor) and a bad injury (Hasiuk) left them with some big holes to fill.  The freshman are coming along and played very well the last two games.  The Martins are very good options to score as well, Pat's played better the last two games.  Russ hit some big shots on Saturday @ Hunter.  They're only playing 7-8 guys a game, and besides Rhoten nobody has started a full year for Trin.  The two losses were very bad, but hopefully they've learned something from them.

Looks like it's going to be more than a two horse race this year though.

[walzy31]

baller i b,

Rose is not a first team all nescac player. but being opptimistic is a great quailty to have.

williams really does not have one of the top 10 players in the league.
my teams would be

1st team

Rhoten
Bedford
Ray
Petrie
Olson

2nd team

Cohen
Martin
Wheeler
Ashe
Clarke

bubble
Stone, Rose, Jenkins.

[baller i b]

No love for Stockwell Walzy?

He might not be a first teamer, but I've seen him play quite a bit since his freshman year and not only has he improved, but he gives toughness to bates and is a huge part of why they win.  As good as Ray is, Stockwell gives a bigger matchup problems for most teams.  Granted his weekness is definetly his defense, but he's still a threat from almost anywhere on the court.  He also gets to the line well and is a good rebounder.

-IB

[formerbant10]

Walzy,

Stone is averaging less points this year than he did last year.  Not sure if he's the first on the bubble (if your listing the bubble from first to last).  
And who is Gharam???
Tough to argue against Rose right now, 5th in scoring and rebounding.  #1 3 point shooter as well.  
The Amherst boys don't have the stats due to the blowouts, Bedford absolutely a first teamer....not positive of Wheeler just yet.  
Drew Cohen is the best big man not named Tyler Rhoten right now.  The loss of R. Kelly at Wes helps him out, but his numbers are amazing right now; 17.5 points (3rd), 10.9 rebounds (1st) and 4.12!!!!! blocks (1st).  Not sure who he could replace on your first team though.

Baller, good point on Stockwell 6th in scoring, 2nd in boards.

[walzy31]

Yup I modified Gharam out of my post. It's all up for debate and clearly way too early. Just having fun. I think Amherst will get 2 first teamers because generally the conference champions do...(Beford/Schiel, Crotty/Coffin) Might not happen. If Olson isn't first team then he will be 2nd team at the expense of Wheeler.

Currently 15 players average over 6.5 minutes per game or more on Amherst. No one averages more than 23.3 minutes per game. I'll post up after tonights pounding of Emmanuel.

[formerbant10]

This just may be Tufts' year, but they have to knock off Amherst to get that done.  And they will have to beat Trinity at Trinity, which I think will be a great game.

As for the scheduling...I believe the Hunter game is the final part of a home and home series that the schools agreed to a few years back when Trinity needed to pick up an extra game.  For some reason, Trinity has trouble getting some of the better NE teams on their schedule.  Don't know whose fault that is. 

I like Tufts going after some of the big time programs and knocking them off, gives the NESCAC the bragging rights in the NE.

And Weitzen might be the toughest matchup in the NESCAC, after Rhoten of course.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I like Trinity's recent plan of scheduling East, Atlantic and Mid-Atlantic teams.  It gives them an air of superiority which is appropriate when you have a solid squad.  Trinity is increasing their exposure and staying away from the mine-field that is the second tier of the NorthEast region.  Sure there are detractors, but I like that one school has done it.  If a bunch more follow their lead, my mind might change, but for now, I think its good for all involved.

[nescac1]

Walzy, you may be basing your assessment of Rose on last year -- both he and Shalvoy have improved dramatically (badly needed, in light of all Williams lost from a middle-of-the-pack team).  I'd say the early season awards outlook goes something like this (this is based primarily on play so far, but also how I expect things to shake out, for example I believe Bedford and Petrie's numbers will both go up as the season progresses):

1st team: Rhoten, Bedford, Petrie, Stockwell, Cohen
2nd team: Rose, Ray, Olson, Martin, Weitzen
3rd team: Wheeler, Clarke, Shalvoy, Stone, Ashe

Martin may squeeze out Cohen in light of coaches' preferences for seniors and for guys from winning teams.  POY: Rhoten  ROY: Ben Rudin.  Defensive player of year: tough to say so far, but probably Cohen, if not Casnocha or Ray.