MBB: NESCAC

[walzy31]

nescac hoops,

we ONLY beat Brandeis. 9-1 Brandeis who will finish the season in the top 3 of NE. you continue posting about something Coach Hixon years ago said post game after an emotional loss...you've beaten skidmore, union and s. vermont. you're funny.

WAR indian spirits
WAR all the preaching
WAR bates & amherst for being undefeated
WAR JP Morgan and Lehman Brothers

[nescac hoops]

thunder,
i guess i feel that building and mantaining an empire are both hard tasks, but i feel that building and trying to restore an empire after a huge loss (rhoten) is more difficult though our historian poster might feel differently. Reilly built bates and was given accolades the past two seasons for doing so. This year he is mantaining what he has already built, which is NOT easy. His team is 8-0 but hasn't really played anybody and almost suffered a loss to bowdoin. nevertheless, they are 8-0 and off to a great start and ray has yet to hit all cylinders. 8-0 is 8-0. However, rebuilding after a loss and building is much more difficult to me and i think both trinity (as i already explained) and colby are doing just that. colby has 3 losses - one to bates (a game that was tied at the half), davidson ( d1 team) and a 8pt loss to wash u (don't think they are ranked but are receiving votes). i give their coach props for playing that difficult a schedule and having respectable losses. in many ways, they are the most successfull team in the nescac who has played against a REALLY tough schedule so far and they are a team that their coach really has playing good basketball that was once on nobody's radar. obviously, i don't think they'll finish in the top 3 but they could pull a surprise or two.

i think hixon's most impressive year was the first time he reached the final 4 - not because they made it that far but b/c they were very successful after losing zeija and co. the year before - a year that some would have thought they would lose a step and they didn't, they did better.

i will have to disagree about the patriot league, who i think all give scholarships now. i've only seen one patriot league game and that was holy cross vs. williams. that year, williams was the best nescac team i ever saw - some may disagree and say amherst that year was better and some may think it's this year's amherst team that is the best but i haven't seen them play yet and it's only MY opinion. that year that williams beat holy cross it was not the same holy cross team that went to the ncaa tourny the year before and they were a medicore/bottom half of the patriot league team. williams wasn't lucky to win but did have one of their best shooting nights of the year and hit an absurd amount of 3's (ben coffin also converted one of the nicest ally-oops i've ever seen but that is besides the point). that being said, it took one of the best efforts from one of the best nescac teams ever to beat a mediocre patriot league team that year.

walzy, by ONLY beating brandeis i mean ONLY as in your only quality win. i know you're probably in the middle of exams and don't have time to read the papers but when you have a chance you can read all the newest articles in the financial world that just came out in regards to goldman having the most successfull year. they're kind of like the amherst of men's basketball in the financial world. williams sucks this year, i know that.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

As much as I love this Brandeis team (and have for three years running) we can't be too quick to annoint them NE top 3.  They proved last year that an impressive start in New England doesn't always translate to the UAA schedule.  I think they have a much better shot at winning games in their conference, but I wouldn't want to speak before I've seen them play a few there.

[blacklordjeff]

Nescac Hoops,

No love lost man, I didn't think you were hating, just stating the facts.  That war was more like a general comment on life, us preachers tend to do that sometimes...

Back to the DI-DII thing, not to play the if A beats B then B beats C then A can beat C game BUT back when Williams did beat Holy Cross, someone extended that whole line of thought and had Williams beating UNC i think.  Now where we stand that obviously isn't the case on a regular basis for a DIII school but if a top tier DIII school could play with a George Mason, who made it to the final four...  All i'm saying is that anything can happen on any given night.  You combine injury (jk) + hot streak + overconfidence of "superior team" + plus team chemistry and us against the world of the "lesser" team, I think it could be done.

Since I'm playing conversation starter, going into break, what are the glaring weaknesses of the top teams (I havent seen them all so I definitely can't comment).  I have seen Amherst and I think that we have the same problem we've had for a few years, interior defense.  Not so much against incoming guards, See KHop changing all those shots against Brandeis, but I mean more like defense against a monster of a post player.  Not that we've necessarily played against a GREAT post player yet, but until we do, and show that we can stop him, that'll probably be our weakness.  But pointing out that weakness on the Jeffs is like pointing out that Iverson isnt the best practice player ever, not really a big deal.  And because i have to at this point due to the fact that its my new calling card...

WAR Going home for Christmas
WAR Love on the NESCAC Board while no games are being played
WAR Walzy and Thunder
WAR Dynasty making

[thunder32]

Nescac Hoops

All I meant by that was the top teams in the NESCAC can compete with most the teams in the patriot league.  Im not saying we are going to win every game I just think that the top teams in the NESCAC can compete with most the teams in the Patriot League.

Wow I just realized that this was pretty redundant

[thunder32]

Blacklord

I think that Tufts is having trouble against some good big men.  They are smaller this year than last and I think that they are playing a little different.  Instead of going right inside every posession they looking to drive to the basket and dish.  This isnt to say the Peirce doesnt have a good post game but I think that they have a little different philosphy this year and it took them a few games to get use to it.  But now going into break they are hitting on most cylinders and beat a team that I had not beaten my four years at Tufts.  Sheldon also does a great job of scheduling.  They play great competition though out the year.  I think this is really what got them to where they are now.  Every year Tufts plays the best teams in NE and each year I think the players benifit from it.   Another problem that Tufts has is that they are very inconnsistant.  A lot of times, I know I can speak only for the past couple of years but has been a trademark of our team, Tufts plays to the level of the competition.  Whether it is playing up to Amherst or down to Newbury.  But hopefully after a great win against PSC they will be able to elevate their play become the team that everyone thought they would be.

[Friar T]

I have to agree with my fellow Holy man that the gap is closing. We are seeing more kids at the DIII level who had the opportunity to play DI, but chose differently. If this trend continues, the gap will continue to close. Do I think the Jeffs could hang in the ACC or Big Ten, no. Could they steal a game or two, maybe. The scholarship issue is obviously a huge one and gives DI a HUGE advantage. There's no question there.

A never meant to allude to the A beat B, who beat C arguement, sorry that was misunderstood. I was simply saying that a loss to Springfield was not excusable by any means for a team of Trinity's supposed caliber. Springfield is 3-6 overall and 1-4 against the NESCAC with losses to Williams (+2), CC (+13), Tufts (+16) and Amherst (+39) by an average of 17+ points. I'm not saying that all four of those teams are 17 points better than Trinity, I'm simply stating they were able to get it done against a bad team and the Bants did not.

Fact: Brandeis IS probably the only legit team Amherst has played. However, they're showing that fact by beating the piss out of everyone else they've played. Their closest margin of victory, other than the double-digit win over the Judges was 32 points at MIT, who beat Midd (+10), took Tufts to triple OT and suffered a 16-point loss to CC.

Now before you accuse Hixon of running up the score on scrubs, he's not playing his horses. Only Olson (26 minutes) and McLaughlin (20 minutes) are playing more than half the game. Measure this against other schools who, despite playing schedules that can't be too much tougher, have their starters going 30+ minutes (Stockwell - 32, Farrell - 35, Stone - 31, Shepard - 34, etc.).

Tufts and Colby are the only schools I think had truly LEGIT schedules to date.

Fiction: The extremity of loss Trinity had had to overcome. YES, Rhoten was a stud. YES, their offense did revolve around him. However, he's the only guy gone from last year. They returned four starters, and a few more-than-solid reserves, including the return of Robert Taylor. Ogrodnik had the ENTIRE offseason to build a new offense and then instill it within a set of players who already had solid chemistry. From the looks of the numbers (I haven't seen them play) it doesn't appear that the offense has changed too much since Russ Martin, who has entered into Rhoten's spot in the starting lineup, is leading the team in points, rebounding and FG attempts. Are they a good team? Yes. Will they be one of the top teams in the NESCAC? Probably. Do we need to throw Ogrodnik a parade and build a statue to honor the great savior of a program after its golden son has left? Not really...

Trinity fans, I'm not trying to take anything away from your coach or team and if you feel I am, sorry. I'm simply pointing out that to have his team be 8-1 against a bunch of teams they should have beat, with nearly the same team as last year, isn't an accomplishment worthy of 1st semester coach of the year.

[JeffRookie2]

WOW. I go two days during finals period without reading the board and all of a sudden Schiel's sister is posting. UNBELIEVABLE. Just for the record, I think we do scrimmage against UMASS. Not actual, official games, but i think the teams practice against each other. Correct me if im wrong, but I've heard that.

[senatorfrost]

NESCAC-A broken foot is not a broken foot-If a Doctor told you that then he is a quack- There are all kinds but anyway I just want to say I WAS NOT!!! suggesting the comparing of injury lists. I was saying that injuries existed on both sides and I took them all to be a given. Coffin had a broken foot-fine, I believe that. There were a few very painful injuries I heard about on Amherst but I did not notice a diminution of performance during the season. I agree you can't add up and quantify injuries if people are playing and performing reasonably with them.

What I was saying was whatever injuries there were, there were. Coffin et al were playing in varying degrees of pain BUT then Amherst had to suffer and undergo three departures in the middle of two very key games. Departures-means they were OUT!!!  of the game. Schiel and Casnocha at the game where Kain tied it up and the one we have already discussed. Would Ephs have come back in the Kain Game without the departures? You are probably positive they would have and I am positive they would not have. however the departures happened and the Ephs won.
    That is what I call LUCK-You can call it what you want but be sure to state what I am saying (and implied before) accurately. Take Coffin's injury and all the others and throw them in the garbage because they were IN THE GAME.
   I do agree with you on NESCAC v Patriot league though I think the best in NESCAC could probably beat a couple Ivies. Like maybe Dartmouth and Columbia? Maybe a bottom rung Patriot team also? Remember last year Carnegie Mellon beat Princeton and I think Princeton was 2d in the Ivy League.

WAR  Sasquatch
WAR        Charms           

[senatorfrost]

 I was impressed with the Brandeis game. You can read the boxscore and see that some people seem to be really improving, if Brandeis can be used as a barometer.
I did notice that Rexhepi, did not play too much. He had missed a few games before Amherst so I assumed he was injured. I had never seen Brandeis before so I only say that I have heard he is very good.
  They seemed to go more to Deluca in the second half and actually outscored Amherst by a few. I asked myself what would happen if Rexhepi was healthy and the game had been at Brandeis??? Those who are familar with Rexhepi can answer that better than I can.
   I too like Trinity and figure on them doing well. Taylor has been away for a year but as a Frosh he impressed me an awful LOT. As a Soph he had a bad hand. He will probably get better as season progresses. I think Tufts will improve also. They are most likely a lot better than that OT game with MIT. From what I have been told Bates is a little on the small side. Wilson would seem to be in the running for ROY

[thunder32]

whats up with the War Sasquach

[senatorfrost]

Sorry-my mistake-this was supposed to be under NESCAC.

[senatorfrost]

  First of all my point is that many players would have been a little better or a lot better without injury-but if they were in the game-it was better than not being in. Can't quantify injuries. and yes I understand Coffin (and some on Amherst too) would have been better if they were 100% healthy.
Anyway, was Tufts better? The game Amherst won with "The Shot" was one thing but the NESCAC final was pretty much the same thing. The ball came to Casnocha, pretty much unexpectedly with a second left on the shot clock and Amherst down by one. He quickly fired it up from 27 feet and Amherst was up by two. Tufts tied it and Amherst won in overtime.
Tufts was VERY strong in the middle where as has been mentioned, Amherst perhaps lacked. Tufts took Amherst to Overtime 2x's AT AMHERST. Once I would easily call it luck-Twice-and I start to think that maybe Tufts was better. I think if you took Martin out and any one player from AMherst, then Amherst wins, but you can't do that so I would have no problem with someone saying Tufts was better head to head. Which also leaves open the possibility that Amherst would have done better v the world at large outside of Tufts. However, the important thing to me and I am sure most of the Amherst fans there was that Amherst won. If Tufts was better and I can certainly see some people saying that, then to me it makes no difference simply because Amherst won.

[senatorfrost]

 I'm doing this wrong again. I think I see the idea now-better late than never

[nescac hoops]

friar,
i don't mean to insult you, but what big 10 or acc team do you think amherst could MAYBE "steal" a game from? granted i have yet to see amherst play this year, but let's keave the holy clouds and come back to reality. olsen is, in my opinion, the league MVP but he is 5'10'' and quick but not lightning quick, and might get stripped a couple times and perhaps get his shot blocked.

senator,
i already suggested that the top could compete in the ivy league. perhaps somewhere in the middle/bottom of the league  comparable to a 7th place finish in the nescac. i have tried to explain coffin's injury the best i could. an injured/hindered, less effective ben coffin is as detrimental to williams as an absent jones is to amherst - not taking anything away from jones (again) but coffin was hindered by his injury no matter how serious the bone he broke was. the year before he was the final 4 mvp - he scored 8 pts. in the final game they lost at the buzzer and was seen limping at times in the game. he was often whincing at the end of the season and at times hobbling - which was worse for williams than the loss of jones was to amherst. that's all.

as for the kain game, i am not as holy as friar and maybe williams won by "luck" but at times i believe luck is earned perhaps even with a little fate. was amherst lucky to win that game against tufts last year in the sweet sixteen? yes, absolutely. do i think tufts was a better team than amherst despite amherst having this luck? absolutely not. did tufts deserve to win that game? yes, but they didn't win. if williams was lucky to win the kain game b/c of injury to amherst then that is the same luck that amherst had to win that game against tufts - a missed free throw from an otherwise solid free throw shooter (i heard he had a sore hand, just kidding) and a double clutch, leaning in 3 ptr. from a very talented player who probably couldn't make that again if he was paid (or was alone in the gym with nobody on him). lucky? yes. fitting and "luck" well deserved? absolutely.

walzy, i know you are a little out of this loop this week as finals approach, as evidence in your financial world WAR statement following a day when goldman was glorified in every major world paper for this year's success. so i want to bring you up to news before you bash my alma mater and make another uneducated statement - dana leary was named d3 national player of the year in soccer and huffer was d3 national scholar player of the year in soccer with a nice 3.98 gpa as a biology major in addition to his NESCAC POY honor. they are a microcosm of the entire college - #1 in athletics (sears cup) and academics (#1 us news and report). WAR   in all honestly and jokes aside, how did leary win the national player of the year and not the nescac poy and vice versa for huffer?