MBB: NESCAC

[formerbant10]

Airing out dirty laundry in pubilc is a definite way to gain the arrogant label.  That's a pretty bold statement.  Has Hippert ever beaten Bates??? Has he outplayed Ray?

As for being showy in games....a lot of that is emotion.  I wouldn't characterize Furbush as arrogant either, but it's pretty normal to show emotion after a big shot.

[nescac hoops]

moving along....

any tufts-bates predictions for this weekend? i would like to see tufts win to avoid the possible coin-toss for second place. if bates were to win, it sets up the possibility that bates, trinity, and tufts will all have one loss (if amherst wins out) and be in a tie for second with no possible head-to-head tie breakers. for amhert's sake, i think they would prefer to see tufts in the finals rather then meeting them in the semifinals if tufts were to get the fourth seed - something about tufts really gives amherst troubles recently. i haven't seen tufts but from what has been described, i think there will be some really good matchups at the point position and b/t weitzen and stockwell.

i think williams will drop both games this weekend and while i expect midd to also drop 2 games, i am curious to see how they do against trinity and amherst to see if their improvement is warranted. wesleyan/conn/colby/bowdoin will be fighting for a spot in the conference tourny...or for the first lottery pick...depending on how you look at it.

[whoarewebobcats]

Being a complete Bates homer, I really can't see the Bobcats dropping this game, the reasoning of which I went through in an earlier post. It'll be a high scoring game for sure based on what I've heard about Tufts, it probably will take 85 points or more to win, which is uncharacteristic of Bates. The key for the Bobcats will be the play of their wing players, Wilson, Halloran, and Wholey. If they're hitting shots, and to me the likelihood of that is predicated on them sealing their man off around screens and getting the ball in position to shoot, then Bates should be fine. If they can't, they need to adjust better than they did last weekend, by either driving and dishing or just dumping the ball into the post more. Zak and Wholey, as the only two driving threats, need to be able to make quick decisions in the lane, either kicking the ball to the open shooter (Zak's doing), hitting Tony Parker-like floaters (Wholey's doing), or, something I'd like to see much more of, dropping the ball off to Stockwell or J. O'Keefe. Back to the wing players--can their defense be good enough to keep them on the floor? If Reilly has to go big and have non-scorers on the floor (J-Lat and D-Mac, namely), there could be problems for Bates, unless the defensive upgrade is really worth it.

Addendum to the arrogance talk, which obviously has run its course: I agree that Furbush wasn't really an arrogant player, but I think he may have had his moments, and that era team (probably particularly because of Salvaggio and Gerrity) seem to get in quite a few scuffles and had maybe a little more attitude than they should have. As for Hippert, I'm particularly sensitive to anti-Zak talk, so, to his credit, I'll say that I heard nothing but good things about him from a former teammate of his from high school, and that his most flagrant altercation, the WWE-style throwdown Gerrity applied to him in Brunswick, was obviously more of a discredit to Gerrity rather than Hippert. But he has always bugged me as a player.

[hoopjunkie]

nescac hoops
I think the Bates - Tufts matchup will be a classic - I did a quick study of the 2 big men :

                       fg%    3point %    ft       point avg       rebounds     assists       minutes

Stockwell        54.1       38.8        53.2        18.8              10.9           1.7             30.8

Weitzen          52.8        48.8       75.6         15.5               7.1           3.2              26.7

   
I think the game will be tight & may go down to free throws .

I think Stockwell is a beast of a rebounder & scorer but freethrows

[eclinchy]

Rebounding-wise, Weitzen has a good excuse -- he's a small forward, while Fitz and Kumf are the big guys in the paint.

The most interesting stat to me is the assists!  Weitzen has almost double Stockwell's total... might that be because he has better weapons at his disposal?  If Weitzen has an off night, Tufts has O'Keefe, Pierce, and Black, all great pure shooters, to pick up the slack.  I don't think Bates can compete.

I think the Jumbos pull this one out just like they did last year, but obviously, I'm just as biased as whoarewebobcats.  I'd love to hear an impartial observer make their prediction...

[hoopjunkie]

ECLINCHY
I DONT AGREE WITH THOUGHT THE REASON THAT WEITZEN HAS MORE ASSISTS IS BECAUSE HE
HAS MORE "PURE SHOOTERS" . O`KEEFE HAS BEEN IN A SEASON SLUMP SHOOTING UNTIL
HE FINALLY BROKE OUT THIS WEEKEND . ALSO BLACK WAS 1-15 IN THE WEEKEND MASSACRE
FOR THE JUMBOS IN NEW JERSEY - I DONT HAVE THEIR STATS BUT I BET NEITHER ONE OF THEM
ARE OVER 45% FROM THE FIELD .

[hoopjunkie]

ECLINCHY

I WAS RIGHT  OKEEFE 44% --- BLACK  37% . PEOPLE IN THE STANDS AT MEDFORD
WERE COMPARING WEITZEN`S PASSING TO LARRY BIRD. THE KID IS GOOD , NOT LARRY BIRD
GOOD , BUT HE CAN HIT THE OPEN MAN . I WONDER HOW MANY ASSISTS HE WOULD HAVE
IF OKEEFE & BLACK SHOT BETTER !!!

[diehardfan]

Attention NESCAC fans:

NESCAC native frank uible has been elected to the Posting Hall of Fame.

Please make a note of it.

Ooh, I finally figured out where Frank's home board is.... woo! Frank, I think it's a testimony to how much you deserve this award by the fact that I had no idea what your home board was! I was under the impression that is was not even in this region! Congrats!

Better = self-righteous?

I think we can just say that everyone has reason to be proud of whatever athletic accomplishments they achieve.  Does it have to be a competition?

Uhm, hello! Everything is a competition. Duh. 

I obviously enjoy DIII sports much more than DI. In fact, I am one of those rare people that actually follow only DIII sports.  Ask me a question about professional sports; I can't tell you anything after 1999. However, as someone who is still paying back college loans (like much of the world) I have no problem with people choosing DI or state schools at all! I've dropped the DIII-is-morally-superior act in the last several years. In Virginia, for example, the University of Virginia and the College of William and Mary are better schools than pretty much all of their private school counterparts aside from Washington and Lee... and they're a heck of a lot cheaper. Yes, I love the fact that there are true student athletes at the DIII level. Yes, I value the merits of small class sizes. Yes, I think very highly of this league for the great combination of national Academic and Athletic achievements in each of the programs. Yes, I have loved every Academic All-American or All Region caliber player that has graduated from my campus. But come on....

[JeffRookie2]

58-33 Jeffs over Elms at the half. Only negative is steven wheeler missing his first collegiate three on his 9th attempt. The WAMH guys do a great job.

[nescac hoops]

die hard,

do you truly believe that the athletes on uva's basketball, football, or lacrosse teams are getting the same education as non-athletes at this or any other top caliber institution (ivy league and maybe patriot league aside) that happens to be division 1? do you truly believe that a basketball player at stanford is receiving any better of an education than a basketball player at uconn? let me tell you, that they don't. one of my best friend's who i played aau with went to stanford and was told he couldn't major in a science b/c they had labs that would cut into practice and he could only take certain classes that met when it didn't interfere with basketball. he also had to take classes where class participation and attendance didn't account for much, b/c he had to miss a number of class with travel, etc. yes, graduation rates at duke, virginia, stanford, etc. are better (but still not up to par) compared to other d1 schools, but are students athletes really receiving a great education at ANY college when for 5 months out of the 8 month school year you spend missing half their classes and trading in the lectures of top notch professors at these insitutions for team "tutors"?

so yes, for a non-athlete in a state like virginia, you can get a very good and cheap education from uva and is a better deal than a private, small d3 school. but if you're a student athlete i think, in MOST cases, at a d3 you recieve a better education. i think attending class, knowing your professors, and taking classes you want (no matter when they meet or what the attendance requiremens are, etc.) provides a better education than going to half of your "selected" classes at a us news and report acclaimed "top notch" institution.

[formerbant10]

I'm pretty close with a guy who played 2 years at Notre Dame and 2 at UVA....academically he is on par with just about every NESCAC player that I have known.

Don't lump everybody together, there are exceptions to every rule.

[diehardfan]

die hard,

do you truly believe that the athletes on uva's basketball, football, or lacrosse teams are getting the same education as non-athletes at this or any other top caliber institution (ivy league and maybe patriot league aside) that happens to be division 1? do you truly believe that a basketball player at stanford is receiving any better of an education than a basketball player at uconn? let me tell you, that they don't. one of my best friend's who i played aau with went to stanford and was told he couldn't major in a science b/c they had labs that would cut into practice and he could only take certain classes that met when it didn't interfere with basketball. he also had to take classes where class participation and attendance didn't account for much, b/c he had to miss a number of class with travel, etc. yes, graduation rates at duke, virginia, stanford, etc. are better (but still not up to par) compared to other d1 schools, but are they really receiving a great education when for 5 months out of the 8 month school year you spend missing half their classes and trading in the lectures of top notch professors at these insitutions for team "tutors"?

so yes, for a non-athlete in a state like virginia, you can get a very good and cheap education from uva and is a better deal than a private, small d3 school. but if you're a student athlete i think, in MOST cases, d3 athletes recieve a better education regardless of the two school compared. i think attending class, knowing your professors, and taking classes you want (no matter when they meet or what the attendance requiremens are, etc.) is a better education than going to half of your "selected" classes at a us news and report acclaimed "top notch" institution.

I'm guessing there are a few DI athletes that learned capitalization rules while at their institutions of higher learning.  Just teasing!

I believe tutors are primarily for the students who aren't good enough to be there... The schools that are better academically do try to recruit talented and smart players at least some of the time... I know of lots of examples.

Apparently you've never tried to read some of the posts here from students who come from some of the poorer schools academically... it's acutely painful to my eyes and chronically detrimental to my own writing skills over long term exposures. Some DIII colleges are extremely easy to get into, and have extremely low standards (if any at all). You're just spoiled because you happen to come from a conference that is vastly superior academically to so many others.

[nescac hoops]

perhaps b/c most nescac athletes you know went to trinity. sorry, i couldn't resist.

you're right. i shouldn't lump everybody/school together. my point is that athletes at duke, stanford, uva, etc. are not receiving the same education - that doesn't mean that they are not as smart as those attending their respective colleges or athletes attending nescac schools, but i do not think that they are able to get the most academically from these schools that non-athletes do. that's all.


die hard,
yeah, i heard john thompson was equally impressed with allen iverson's linguistic skills as he was his crossover. that's why he went after him at georgetown. yes, there are some really bad d3 schools as there are really bad d1 schools. however, the standards to play d1 sports (which a number of top recruits at d1 schools can't even make) is really quite easy. is an allen iverson type player who got an 800 on the SATs (though not always an indication of intelligence) any smarter at georgetown with a tutor writing all his papers than if he was at a bad d3 school - at least he has to account for his own work and hopefully learn SOMETHING in a d3 school. yes, i believe duke, stanford, etc. tries to find true student athletes and sometimes they do, but my point is that no matter how smart (or stupid) the recruit that duke gets, not attending class and not getting to choose your classes (not a lot of pre-med/science d1 basketball players is no coincidence) is not a top notch education.

[mrmike88]

Amherst wins running away tonight.  Aside from Steve Wheeler, nobody could miss a 3 tonight.  But the thing that truly impressed me in this game (granted, it was against an inferior Elms opponent) was how smooth the Lord Jeff fast break was tonight.  They converted almost every single turnover into quick and easy points, whether from an open spot-up 3 or an easy layup.  Hopkins beat the Elms players down the floor 3 times!

Stat of the night - at halftime, Andrew Olson had 11 Assists and 1 turnover.

[Friar T]

Olson drops an Amherst (possibly NESCAC?) single-game record 15 dimes on Elms. The kid is just absurd...

Comparing Weitzen and Stockwell is like comparing apples and oranges: They don't play the same position. The only thing that makes Pillsbury a forward rather than a guard is his equator-like waistline. He becomes an impossible matchup because no guard can handle his weight, while no big man can handle his outside game. Amherst is the only team that matches up with him even decently, b/c of their long guards like Bausky, Walters, etc. Stockwell on the other hand is your typical big man who's good for 15 and 10 on most nights. He can step away from the key and shoot, but he's not going to make the perimeter And-1 moves and passes that Bowser brings out of Waltham (that's the right one right?).

Neither can really stop the other one and I think it's highly doubtful to see one guard the other come the weekend...