MBB: NESCAC

[geronimo]

Alright Friar, answer me this. If Kevin Hopkins is so good, what is he doing at Amherst.

Pretty moronic post.  You must be channeling Borat.  

You could say that about any player in Division III -- "If this guy is so good, what's he doing in DIII, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah, wah, wah, wah, wah, wah."  

If my aunt has no unit, why are we calling her uncle?

I'm assuming you post on d3hoops.com because you respect the level of play in DIII and in the NESCAC.  According to your argument, players (6-10 or not) are only in the NESCAC 'cause they suck.

Lamest post in a long, long time.

[Friar T]

Alright Friar, answer me this. If Kevin Hopkins is so good, what is he doing at Amherst. He is 6'10". There obviously has to be some glaring defects to his game, otherwise he wouldn't be at Amherst. And spare me the "he values a good education". If you're 6'10" and "a beast", then you go play for Duke. If you're 6'10" and good, then you go get a scholarship at a mid major. If you're 6'10" and mediocre, then you pull down 1 rebound in 19 mins during the biggest game of the year thus far.

As far as comparing box scores go, why is it foolish? From the looks of the box score, I would guess Cohen significantly ouplayed Hopkins, and everyone else in the league for that matter, which he did. Nothing foolish about it.

I shouldn't even dignify this with a response, but the Lord says I must. So you're basically saying that because Cohen outplayed Hopkins on a certain day against a completely different team he's better? WOW...

For the record, I never said KHop was better than Cohen, or hated on Cohen as a player. I think Cohen is an outstanding shot blocker with solid skills who plays for a decent team. All I did was comment on a foolish statement and then even more foolish support for that statement.

fpc85 used a more rational comparison for the pair, but I still don't think that can judge a full head-to-head spectrum. Honestly you're comparing a guy who is a marquee player for his team averaging 28.8 minutes per game with a guy who is the fifth option at best on his team averaging 16.1 minutes per game. It's just not fair to compare them because you don't know where Cohen would fit in the Amherst lineup or where Hopkins would fit in the Colby lineup. Their numbers would both change drastically if they swapped teams...

The Top 10s were incredible guys and gals, great work.

Walzy, I'll take the -14, the under Ray/Muller, over Stockwell/Reiff, no on Carcieri, yes on Olson's assists. I just hope the congregation doesn't catch me with my hand in the collection plate...

[geronimo]

3 - Jeffs were sending a message to Geronimo, telling him to back off MrMike or else

All I get is "get off mrmike?"  Not even a congrats on Baby Ipcah?

[nescac hoops]

based on how they have played THIS year, i'd take hopkins over cohen any day of the week. look at the numbers and then look at the minutes each receives. cohen has taken 100 more shots than hopkins, plays 12 more minutes a game, and hopkins fg% is far superior to cohen by about 20%. if it was possible to have a "shots altered" or "forced kickouts" stat, hopkins would probably lead the league, as he should with his height.

i think the bants would have a much harder time beating the jeffs in lefrak but let's say they do. i know people say that amherst is still guaranteed to host the regionals in the ncaa's, but if trinity beats the jeffs again, why wouldn't it go to trinity? trinity would only have 3 losses and a conference championship and amherst would have 2 losses...both to trinity. it would be pretty hard to tell the bants they didn't deserve to host at this point. again, i think it will be tough to beat the jeffs at home, but i don't exactly understand why everybody still thinks the jeffs would be an automatic shoe-in to host especially given this scenario.

[booyakasha]

Geronimo - Never said suck, I said mediocre. There are at least five Nescac centers I'd take before him (Cohen, Stockwell, Kelly, R. Martin, and Stone).

Friar - Everyone knows Cohen would still be the marquee guy at Amherst.

I'll concede the fact that is not prudent to make judgements based on one game, but still stand by the above statements.

[booyakasha]

and Nescac hoops, does last Saturday fall into "any day of the week"?

[geronimo]

Geronimo - Never said suck, I said mediocre.

So only "mediocre" guys play in the NESCAC? 

What brand of shovel are you using?

[booyakasha]

It must not have been a natural birth...

[Dr E. Spengler]

Booyakasha...stop.

Kevin Hopkins has the beast within...your reading comprehension skills are "mediocre."  So he's not playing at Duke?  Why would you want to play for a school in the middle of a four game losing streak anyway?  God knows Josh "I can't go inside on Gist or Ibekwe" doesn't have the beast within and would be shunned as a social outcast at Amherst anyway.  So right now we're comparing apples and mutants.  At Amherst Hopkins is going to a top liberal arts school in the country, able to balance a social life with athletics and play for a national championship.  You're knocking him because he realized he isn't going to the league?  Seriously...stop.  Being a Jeff is going to look better in the real world than being a Saluki. 

You ask about Saturday...Honor thy Sabath and keep it holy.  You are putting Amherst's loss on Hopkins shoulders?  GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOD POINT

And Cohen would be the marquee guy at Amherst?  At Center?  No chance...on the team/overall...God no.


Nescac hoops makes a good point...wow.


And Geronimo..."So it's not just a clever name?"

[nescac hoops]

booyakasha,
your argument for cohen here is stupid. he is a great player. however, your reason for picking him over hopkins is stupid. he had a good weekend against teams in the bottom half of the nescac and that makes up for the rest of the season? cohen had a 5 pt. performance against trinity and in his line against hopkins head-to-head, hopkins had the better game. i agree that hopkins should have been more productive in this weekend's game, but it wasn't as if cohen was stellar against the bants either.
8 points against amherst, 15 points and 6 boards against midd, 5 points against trinity, 14 points and 8 boards against a williams that plays with 2 freshman down low and struggles against any big men. he wasn't the top rebounder in the other games so they didn't list his rebounding stats. those are games against the top 5 nescac teams (colby being the 4th) where he plays 10-15 min more than hopkins. solid numbers but really....

[formerbant10]

Ipcah's mom.....everybody knows that River Bandits is two words....you're better than that.

[nescac1]

How about a neutral arbiter to settle this?  I nominate Tufts' always blunt coach, who presumably has a fair eye for talent, and is without a doubt the most entertaining coach in the league (I'll take his dry, unblemished commentary over Paulsen's coach-speak and Hixon's whining any day of the week):

shortened link

For those who don't want to cut and paste that monster, Sheldon says Cohen is the best big man in the league, but only when he chooses to "bring it," which, apparently, is not always.  So Cohen is more talented and better at his best, Hopkins more consistent.  Fair enough? 

As for why Hopkins didn't go D-1, first, he seems to have grown a little since high school (listed as 6'9 as a frosh), he played in the middle of nowhere, and there are the aforementioned coordination issues, which probably were far more severe three years ago (if not he would have gotten more pt on an Amherst team desperate for an inside presence at that point).  I bet that, were he a high school senior now, a 6'10 dude who can run the floor, finish and intimidate, he'd get higher level looks.  That's true for lots of division III guys who develop unexpectedly -- just ask the Holy Cross coach if he would have wanted Coffin or Crotty on his team after they schooled his squad, or perhaps Davidson would have given a second thought to their decision to dump Bedford had they seen him play as a junior / senior, etc. etc.

[geronimo]

And Geronimo..."So it's not just a clever name?"

$hi++y Beatles?  Are they any good?

[booyakasha]

Fair enough nescac1.

Here is the quote directly from the article:

"I think Drew Cohen's the best big guy in the league," coach Bob Sheldon said. "He doesn't bring it every night, and I think that that's why they're where they are - they're only 5-4, because sometimes he's not there. But he's still the best big man in the league, since he can block shots. He had a good game."


I'll take the opinion of Sheldon over the opinion of the peanut gallery any day...

[booyakasha]

Also, good point about the possibility of post high school development. I should have recognized this as a possible factor, as it certainly was a factor concerning Cohen.