MBB: NESCAC

[nescac33]

JeffRookie2...going back to the Petrie debate...I agree that Petrie should me mentioned as one of the best players ever in the NESCAC...however I disagree that he had no help....he played with 2 1,000 point scores in Kevin Bradley and current (but hurt) star Andrew Hippert....both 4 year starters and very solid players

[JeffRookie2]

Jeffs won 79-68
a balanced scoring effort from the Jeffs
Olson had 13 points, 5 boards and 6 assists.
Baskauskas with 17 points and 4 boards
Hopkins had 14 points and 2 boards (how a 6'10 guy gets so few rebounds is beyond me).
Jones had 13 points in 19 minutes, and pulled down 5 boards.

For the Jumbos:
Pierce had 18 points and 10 rebounds, though he only made 6-11 free throws.
Weitzen had 22 points and 4 boards.
Beyel had 15 points and 3 rebounds.
Gallant had 9 points.
No other Tufts player had over 2 points.

worth noting that matt goldsmith also had a great game, with 11 points and 5 boards, and walters had nine points, six boards and five assists. If you saw the first half of the game, I think you'll agree it definitively answered the question of which team has the better front court. Amherst kind of cruised in the second half, where weitzen and pierce padded their stats, but they were both owned by hopkins/jones/walters/goldsmith, and even mike holzey (emphatic rejection of pierce was the highlight of the game) out of the gate.

back to petrie, you're right about bradley, but i dont think he would have been a 1000 point scorer if he didnt have petrie to soak up attention. and as for hippert, he was only a sophomore when petrie graduated, right? i dont remember him doing much back then. anyway, we are in agreement, petrie was a fantastic player.

also, la verdad, i admit defeat. hopkins was a beast tonight. it feels good to be wrong

[La Verdad]

any details about the jeff/jumbo game?

Tufts didn't have any answers for Amherst's post players.  Pierce and Weitzen, who are both at least average defenders, had to stay out of foul trouble for Tufts to have a chance...it showed on the defensive end.  Tufts has nobody (besides those two) that can defend in the post.  Anyone who thinks #44 can defend is wrong.  He flopped while guarding Hopkins in the post leading to an uncontested dunk...twice...on consecutive possessions. 

Beyel shot well, but had trouble defending.  Black must be better than what he showed tonight.  Tufts is a few players away from being a scary team, but the fact is that they don't have much of anything off the bench. 

Hopkins had 14 points and 2 boards (how a 6'10 guy gets so few rebounds is beyond me).

He spent the majority of the game guarding Weitzen, so he wasn't around the basket much on defense.

[feces monkey]

I agree that Petrie should me mentioned as one of the best players ever in the NESCAC.

I disagree. Perhaps the most unconventional, but not in my Top 10.

For once, I thought Paulsen was outcoached. 

It's pretty difficult to get outcoached in Brunswick (in men's hoops). I'd chalk it up to a bad game.

The Polar Bears are a likeable team for reasons someone has already mentioned (play tough D, work hard, etc.), but lack certain key ingredients. Hippert will help, but not solve any of them. Bowdoin may catch a break as it appears Midd's top guy didn't play against Colby. Flu maybe?

As for Hancock, call him a "system" guy if you want, but you don't score 2,600+ points just coming off screens. I didn't see McKelvin as much as Hancock, but the few times I did I was really impressed, although it appears he was a knucklehead. He did seem to be the motor for that FF run...

[JeffRookie2]

Anyone who thinks #44 can defend is wrong.  He flopped while guarding Hopkins in the post leading to an uncontested dunk...twice...on consecutive possessions. 

[/quote]

I actually feel bad for Pat Sullivan (#44). That had to be one of the worst individual games I've seen in my time in Div. III. He looked like he had no business being out there. Not only the back-to-back no-call flops against Hopkins leading to dunks, but some really poor fouls. He looked lost on defense. Jeremy Black also had a bad game, but he didnt do anything too bad, it was just evident that he wasnt producing anything offensively. Any Jeff fan knows that Jeremy Black can be dangerous when he's on, but it wasnt there tonight.

[JeffRookie2]

I agree that Petrie should me mentioned as one of the best players ever in the NESCAC.

I disagree. Perhaps the most unconventional, but not in my Top 10.

i dont get the impression i have been a fan of the nescac as long as you have monkey, would you say that petrie is not top 10 of the last 3.5 years? out of curiosity, who makes your top 10?

[Denton]

As a Bears fan - very exciting evening.  As mentioned the guards played well but the Bowdoin big guys (Fligel & Phillips) were the stronger inside force depite foul trouble early.

Very balance play especally without Hippert - all starts in double figures.

Tomorrow WILL be interesting - Midd gave the Bears a real beating last year in VT, but it will be hard to maintain the energy they had tonight.

[ephoops]

A few other Ephs for the all time NESCAC team:

Harry Sheehy - Played for the Ephs in the mid '70's...two-time All-American...Scored over 1,300 points in 3 years on teams where he played within an offensive scheme under Al Shaw that didn't allow him to take a lot of shots...was one of the last cuts on the '76 Olympic team...played about 10 years for Athletes in Action (AIA) all over the world...by the time he was done was the all-time leading scorer for AIA...

Artie Pidoriano - Played for the Ephs in the early '80s...broke Sheehy's scoring record...he was a 2 who was physically much stronger than any 2 in New England...he had a weird jump shot but but it went in...played before the 3-point rule and probably would have scored a couple hundred more points in his career with the 3 (same could be said for Sheehy)...

Tim Walsh - Played for the Ephs in the mid 80's...broke Pidoriano's scoring record...was a very offensive minded point guard...he could really shoot although he was a selfish player...Paulsen was his back up when he palyed at Williams...

That being said,

Nogelo is the best I've seen in NESCAC...

Hancock was a great player but a gunner who did take a lot of shots...

Rehnquist was the best big in NESCAC in the last 40 years...

Chapin had a stretch in his senior year (1996) where he came close to Rehnquist, his last game against Rowan in the Elite 8 was one of the the best big game single performances in the history of NESCAC...

[ephoops]

Correction

Chapin's game was in the Sweet 16 against Rowan...that was the year that Rowan had five D-1 kids "parked" at the school for a year so they could gain eligibility to play in D-1...after the fiasco of Rowan winning the Nat'l Championship that year, the NCAA woke up and changed the rules...

If you ask many Eph fans that have been watching the program since the early 90's, they'll tell you that the '96 Eph team that lost to Rowan was the best Eph squad...Nogelo was a sophmore that year...that was the team that should have won a national championship for Sheehy...

[JustAFan]

Terrific game by the Bowdoin freshman guard DiFeo in his first start tonight.

Eclinchy--still no O'Keefe in the Tufts lineup tonight. What's the word?

I second Ephoops comments about Harry Sheehy. Along with Nogelo, he was the most talented DIII player I've seen. He'd be playing at the mid-major level if he was coming out of high school today. He had a bit of Pete Maravich flair to his game, and not only could he take it to the hoop or pull up and hit the outside jumper but he was an above average rebounder as well.  And he had a bit of Crotty's flair for getting the crowd going in the big games, especially against Amherst and Union.

Rehnquist was the dominant big man of his decade, for sure, but I don't think he'd have the same success today.  Teams that had a couple of 6-5 kids were considered big in the 70's, and each of the Williams and Amherst lineups now have a half dozen kids a couple of inches bigger than that.  But Rehnquist always stepped up in the big games, and consistently made the big shot.

For most of the 70's Bates was THE dominant DIII team in New England by far and some of their players probably deserve some mention.

Finally, despite the flair and talent of both Olson and Crotty,  if I was starting a team today Jimmy Frew '99 would be my point guard. Second all-time in assists at Williams (to Crotty) and seventh all-time in rebounds, the kid was a warrior and a winner, plain and simple.

[senatorfrost]

   I was far more worried about MIT than Tufts. It seemed like Tufts couldn't win.
Tabb is my shooting guard over a couple of Amherst players and the former Trinity player. Bauman was the Middlebury Center's name if I remember right.
Strahorn for one year was tremendous. Very quick.
   Thing is I wonder if these guys from thirty years ago are as good as the ones playing today. I truly don't think so because the make up of the college game has changed and low level D1 players are better than thrity years ago and so are high D1 level players.
   If players like Nogelo and Tabb And Crotty etc went back in time to the mid seventies, I think they would pretty much all be D1 players and some would be mid level. I think the further back they went the higher the level they would play at and if they went back to the forties they would probably be pros.(NBA i.e.) I was sitting next to a former D1 player from at least 35 years ago. He assured me that the D3 players we were watching could play for the team he played for and were better than he was.
   His team made the NCAA one year. This is his opinion and I have to respect it.He said he was 6:6, played center, was very fast, had almost no outside shot and was on the slender side. He said he couldn't dream of playing at the level he had played at if he were to come back as a youth today. He then pointed out the couple of players he said were better than he had been.
 

[senatorfrost]

  Since Frew was mentioned I thought I would tell about the time I first saw him. Game was at Williams and I was sitting next to a guy who told me Jim Frew was his favorite. He said that if he were a soldier and trapped somewhere or in a foxhole he would want Jim Frew to be with him.
    My first reaction was what kind of a mental midget did I end up next to talking about foxholes when we're here in a gym? So anyway somewhere in the middle of the second time I saw Frew play, I said to myself that the guy who talked about foxholes had been right and that he wasn't the stupid ------- idiot I had first thought him to be.
    It's not something I ever would have thought of on my own but I did have to admit that if I were in a foxhole that Frew was who I would want next to me. The guy was right.

     

[walzy31]

Amherst -9.5 Vs. Tufts
Trinity -7.0 Vs. Bates

Amherst won by 11
Trinity won by 17

Amherst -17.5 Vs. Bates
Trinity -4.0 Vs. Tufts

Final Saturday Lines
Amherst -23.5 Vs. Bates
Trinity -4.5 Vs. Tufts

[Old Guy]

"it appears that Midd's top guy didn't play against Colby. Flu maybe?" Feces Monkey

Midd's "top guy," Harris, was injured in the Colby-Sawyer game (wrist). It's too bad: he's a terrific player, Vermont native, a senior, good student (pre-med), co-capt.

Midd has some depth at 2: Dudley, a junior, small and quick, is a streaky shooter (28 against Johnson earlier this week, 6 threes); Coglan, a frosh, rose to the occasion last night (19 points off the bench) - he's a will o' the wisp, very slender, but a good shooter.

I wish we were going to Bowdoin with a full arsenal, but we have some depth, balance between front and back courts, and good senior leadership, so I think the Panthers will give the Polar Bears a tussle. Aaron Smith, very steady, consistent big man, could be a factor today.

[Pat Coleman]

I think Bowdoin has been greatly underestimated and I'm excited to see them when they come to lefrak, BUT couldn't this also mean that Williams was vastly overrated?  The rankings said they were the 4th best team in the country, but I think they are closer to being the 4th best team in the nescac

Williams is ranked eighth.