MBB: NESCAC

[Old Guy]

I have been to every home basketball game at Middlebury the last two years (and most games for a long time before that). Fletcher Walters, along with Anthony Williams from Plattsburgh, have been the best players in our gym this year. I realize it's a one game sample.

Much of what I know about NESCAC teams and players I get from this page, so I was really looking forward to seeing in person Olson, Baskauskas, Hopkins, and also Wheeler (after having had a pre-game conversation with his parents at a Middlebury restaurant). I was sorry Coulibaly left the team, as he was often remarked upon here and I was curious to see him play.

Walters was a revelation: 17 points (6-11 from the floor, 2-3 beyond the arc, 3-4 from the line), 11 rebounds, three steals. He brought the ball up when we overplayed Olson. Who guards him?

So far, he's my POY. But there's lots of hoop left.

[Friar T]

(Fletch is a scoring machine)

This just goes to show who knew Fletch was a beast way back when. Glad to see him getting his love now.

No worries Pat, I get it.

[Friar T]

Fletcher Walters for Breakout Player of the Year in the 'CAC!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(robotic tone) I AM A SCORING MACH-INE.
Dude just puts it in the hole. Plain and simple.

More proof of my seer like abilities...

[senatorfrost]

  As far as the all decade team it's hard to argue about Nogelo being left off. I think the one thing that everyone who saw him can agree on, is that he was the best player of the past ten years. I know it was only for 1 1/2 years but Coffin for that period of time was pretty close to Nogelo and carried Ephs to a title and a second place finish. 
   However, when you look and see how NESCAC players of the past have been placed on so called!! All American teams it's easy to see how laughable they are. For example Tatum over Tabb in 2001. Whoever thinks Tatum was better than Tabb as a player or as a contributor to his team should switch to Volleyball. Then there is Schiel making HM over Bedford and Rhoten. Not that Tatum and Schiel weren't really good players but everything is relative.
   I know this is the men's board but some of the woman's selections are even worse. Start with Trenkle over Royer-Maybe some voters simply liked the sound of the name. That has to be it. Then Trenkle and Royer over Walsh in 2003. I loved Royer. She's probably my favorite player of the past ten years but she was NOT!!!!! better than Walsh.
    By far the biggest joke and it shows why the women's game lags is Higgins as first team All American. My God! She was good but there were several who were wayyy!!!! better. Check out her stats when a team had a decent athlete stay with her for the whole game-A horror show resulted. (See Salem State 1999 Elite eight) The one thing you can say about Higgins was that she had almost beautiful form and if the game were played in slow motion then she might have been a star in D1. A nice player but not even close to best in New England.
  Sorry for posting that here but almost no one reads the W board and they come here too. I used it to show how universally inaccurate these All American teams are. Silly would be the best way to describe them if accuracy is supposedly the primary objective.

[JustAFan]

A point of clarification regarding Mike Nogelo. He was not a one-time All-American--he was a 3 time All-American as voted by the NABC during his sophomore, junior and senior seasons.  Not only that, he was a first team All-American in each of those years, capping his career by winning the Jostens award in his senior season (97-98).  I don't think anyone has been a first team pick 3 years in a row, and the odds are certainly against it happening again.  Now, I know the NABC All American list is not DIII's list, but it's hard to believe that Nogelo's resume is not good enough to make the first team of DIII's all-decade team, but I suspect that's largely because DIII's decade arbitrarily begins in 97-98, his senior year, and you're not giving him any credit to what he did before that season. As I've said before, Nogelo and Sheehy were the best DIII players I've ever seen in New England.

[La Verdad]

La Verdad...
   Bowdoin does play a match-up zone.  They also have presses, a 1-3-1 zone, and other defensive schemes.  However, they play man-to-man defense the majority of the time.  Since when does playing zone a small percentage of the time, ban one from being considered a good defender?  Syracuse has had some pretty good defenders in their historic program and i believe they play zone all the time.  Sargeantson is the best defensive player in the NESCAC, hands down.  If you disagree, take a trip to Maine and watch him shut down Pierce this weekend or just simply ask all of the other great scorers he has already locked down.   

I saw Bowdoin when they came to Amherst.  On that occasion they only ran a match-up zone, which is why I asked what they normally run.  (And I never said that playing zone bans you from winning the award)  That night, Sargeantson was forgettable at best.  He certainly didn't seem like the premier defender in the league.  Claiming he is "hands down" the best defender because Rose, Choice and Taylor had bad shooting nights seems like a little much, and btw, shutting down Rose hasn't been that tough this year.  I saw Choice when he came to Amherst and wasn't real impressed, he seemed one-dimensional. 

[sac]

Mike,

Fletch still shoots the three with his left hand. I think in order to best get a scout on Fletcher you would have to see him in person. Otherwise I will say he goes both ways, can dribble and pass with both hands, can dunk, is from Michigan, can shoots threes, wears the #32 jersey, is averaging 25 and 9 the last four games, and always has a real intimidating grin on his face. If you decide to triple team him based on that summary of his game, please reference CCSalive's post about the other four scrubs Amherst starts.

Obviously this is his best attribute

[fpc85]

wow...i went to work and  taught the kiddies stoichiometry, coached my team to a win, and i get home and read about the all decade team and amherst bias/arrogance for the last 20 minutes...i know i am a slow reader...i think i am a d3hoops addict..i should be grading papers.

congrats to all who made the all decade team. i am sure all who made it deserved it. i am also sure there are more who could be considered.

i am confident olsen will be recognized in due time. i think he is better than crotty ( i couldn't help it )

amherst fans can get obnoxious when singing the praises of the team. most are college kids talking smack. i think we all remember when. a wise man from the red clay hills of georgia once told me it's a poor frog that doesn't praise it's own pond.

imho, NE teams don't get the respect they deserve. i always hear: weak region and the nescac lack of a home and home league. i used to care but i don't care much anymore i just hope the jeffs beat whoever is put in front of them. if that doesn't garner respect then it would be then it's obvious what the deal is.  not much anyone can do about that except beat whoever we play that day.

jeffrookie: no class or homework today? i mean i love your passion for the jeffs but let it go. i am sure you didnt see many of the ADT so let move on. pat's opinion is his opinion.

pat, your question to wheels after the championship game was ill timed...i think sac hit the nail right on the head. talking about williams at that time when it should have been solely about the jeffs winning.

[backinmyday]

Lots of talk about the "best" defender in the league.  I'm not going to flat out say he is the best because there are clearly numerous opinions and home team bias, but Aaron Westbrooks from Trinity is a name that deserves mention.  He is a strong defender and has been since his freshman year. The defense that Trinity played against Wes and CC was incredibly aggressive and led by Westbrooks

[Pat Coleman]

A point of clarification regarding Mike Nogelo. He was not a one-time All-American--he was a 3 time All-American as voted by the NABC during his sophomore, junior and senior seasons.

As we said throughout the process, the All-Decade team is based on our All-American awards, and we didn't take over Division III Basketball Online until Nogelo's senior year. Despite the fact that our parameters overlapped only one year of his career, he was undeniably worthy of being picked on this team. We gave all sorts of credit to what he did before we picked up the site, otherwise he likely would not be listed at all.

[Pat Coleman]

Just a reminder, Justafan, that the two guys ahead of Nogelo have been in the NBA. (Obviously, one of them much more than the other.)  And Andy Panko was also a three-time first-team NABC All-American, if that's the only measure you respect.

[Pat Coleman]

pat, your question to wheels after the championship game was ill timed...i think sac hit the nail right on the head. talking about williams at that time when it should have been solely about the jeffs winning.

I guess we'll stick to the other questions that were asked, like the moron in the front row who asked whether Amherst had hotel rooms for the night.

[JustAFan]

I guess it was inevitable that a die-hard Williams fan (Dave Fehr) would begin to complain that Amherst's recent dominance over Williams in basketball, coupled with Williams recent failure to dominate ALL NESCAC sports over the past couple of years, is evidence that admissions policies at Williams have become too tight and that the increased rigor of the Williams admission criteria applicable to athletes (unique to Williams, Fehr argues) means that there no longer is an even playing field among NESCAC admissions offices. See his column on this topic at http://www.advocateweekly.com/devilsadvocate/ci_8196143.

It does appear true that Williams president Shapiro has raised the lower rung of the ladder in terms of the minimum academic standards athletes must meet to obtain admittance to Williams.  And if the posts on the EphBlog are any indication, there also appears to be a growing anti-athlete undercurrent, or perhaps more accurately, an anti-tipping backlash, among some students and recent alums. See, for example, http://www.ephblog.com/2008/02/11/application-goes-through/#more-8005  and http://www.ephblog.com/2007/10/17/pro-athlete-anti-tip/

Is Williams going to turn into another Haverford in athletics? Or have Amherst, Middlebury, Trinity and Bowdoin, in particular, simply caught up, and recruited better than Williams over the past 4-5 years?

[fpc85]

pat, your question to wheels after the championship game was ill timed...i think sac hit the nail right on the head. talking about williams at that time when it should have been solely about the jeffs winning.

I guess we'll stick to the other questions that were asked, like the moron in the front row who asked whether Amherst had hotel rooms for the night.

i get your point...i hope you got  mine.

[fpc85]

I guess it was inevitable that a die-hard Williams fan (Dave Fehr) would begin to complain that Amherst's recent dominance over Williams in basketball, coupled with Williams recent failure to dominate ALL NESCAC sports over the past couple of years, is evidence that admissions policies at Williams have become too tight and that the increased rigor of the Williams admission criteria applicable to athletes (unique to Williams, Fehr argues) means that there no longer is an even playing field among NESCAC admissions offices. See his column on this topic at http://www.advocateweekly.com/devilsadvocate/ci_8196143.

It does appear true that Williams president Shapiro has raised the lower rung of the ladder in terms of the minimum academic standards athletes must meet to obtain admittance to Williams.  And if the posts on the EphBlog are any indication, there also appears to be a growing anti-athlete undercurrent, or perhaps more accurately, an anti-tipping backlash, among some students and recent alums. See, for example, http://www.ephblog.com/2008/02/11/application-goes-through/#more-8005  and http://www.ephblog.com/2007/10/17/pro-athlete-anti-tip/

Is Williams going to turn into another Haverford in athletics? Or have Amherst, Middlebury, Trinity and Bowdoin, in particular, simply caught up, and recruited better than Williams over the past 4-5 years?

i tend to believe the latter.