MBB: NESCAC

[fpc85]

Honest Question:

If you were Amherst, would you trade Brandon Jones for Manute Bol (today)?

What about Andrew Olson for Spudd Webb?

I would take B. Jones anyday

[CCsalive]

As a Hamilton alum I can speak to the NESCAC rumor. Tobin Anderson, Hamilton's head coach, is a Wesleyan alum. He might enjoy battling it out in NESCAC. In the Liberty League, however, Hamilton has been and should be, an annual NCAA participant. For a few years they played a competitive schedule in both leagues without a travel partner in NESCAC...this was a huge disadvantage. Every week Hamilton's Saturday game was against a NESCAC opponent who had the previous night off. What helps recruiting more? NESCAC or annual trips to the Big Dance? Only a few NESCACs can count on both yearly (Trin, Williams, Amherst).

[Baller10]

Midd's team seems to be very good this year. I thought Williams was going to win the game because of the mental advantage they had going in. Midd had never won a nescac playoff game and traditionally always loses to Williams. The fact that not only did they win but win big I think says a lot about both their menta mindset as well as their talent. I think Rudin is a very underrated player.

Glad to see Colby and Conn knocked out in the first round. Every year their supporters jock their team (which is a good thing) but to an extent that is fairly tough to read about given the lack of results year in and year out.

regarding marcus wells, the pg to be at Williams that was posted about. He was not recruited by any d1 schools so at least by some measurement he might not be the savior that some seem ready to annoint him as.

Hard to argue with anything Friar, Verdad, and FPC have said about lefrakenstein/jeff rookie. He knows absolutely nothing about the game of basketball evidenced by numerous posts that show an embarassing lack of knowledge. This coupled with his incessant bickering with Coleman, his lack of class when constantly harping on rose's struggles, and his catfight last year with another amherst poster seems to make him one of the most unlikeable posters on d3hoops. a real dweeb.

i bet both games this wknd will be close as I think all 4 teams are among the elite in new england.

[eclinchy]

What helps recruiting more? NESCAC or annual trips to the Big Dance? Only a few NESCACs can count on both yearly (Trin, Williams, Amherst).

I'm sorry... what?

Trinity has missed out on NCAAs in five of the last eight years.  Williams has missed three of the last four.  I don't think they're "counting" on anything.

Obviously getting annual trips to the Dance is a big deal, but in the long term it probably helps to work your way up through the NESCAC and gain the prestige that Amherst and Williams have.  Unfortunately for schools like Hamilton, there's usually a lot more than just basketball that goes into that... it helps to be one of the top 2-3 liberal arts colleges in the nation.

[eclinchy]

Did I miss something?  Are jeffrookie and lefrakenstein the same person?

[nescachoopsfan]

I was rethinking a bunch of things about this past year and years past and one thing has stood out.  There have been many number 2 and 3 teams in the nescac, but only 1 the past 4 years.  Year in and year out amherst is on top.  The one constant for every nescac school except for wesleyan are the coaches.  so why doesn't coach hixon win coach of the year ever year? 

He obviously deserves it.  No other school brings the talent amherst brings in.  Sure amherst has a great athletic and academic rep, but any better than williams?  and not too far behind some other nescac schools.  Not only does he bring the talent, but is able to keep it on the bench and have them wait their turn and still sell amherst to kids that could play 3 or 4 years at other school and break records, and have all league accomplishments etc.  ask any coach and they will  tell you recruiting is more than half the job.  no matter the year amherst is number 1, and as good as olsen is, he is not the reason amherst has been on top for 4 years.
Just because a team has a breakout year, doesnt mean the coach should win coach of the year.  for example
there has been some chatter about coach brown (midd) winning coach of the year, and sheldon (tufts) won it the year his team went to the sweet 16.  anyway, bottom line, hixon should get coach of the year even though his team was expected to play the way they have.

[La Verdad]

If they aren't then I sincerely apologize to lefrakenstein 

And to clear up any other confusion, I am not now, nor have I ever been, a member of the Amherst basketball team.
Lame loser?  Huh?   

I'd take Olson over Webb bc of the showmanship factor.  I'd make Jones and Bol go one on one, winner stays.  Bill Walton gets winner, he used to ball back in the day.

I agree about Hixon, superb coach.  The family atmosphere he's created at Amherst is what separates them from the rest of the nescac.  Not sure about the assistants though...

[walzy31]

Friar T:
It's hard to know what to write after a 37 point second half slaughter. Clearly, the Ephs never got a good team rhythm going the entire year. I Think it is very difficult for a team to adjust to the severe slump of a star player. I can't explain what happened to Chris Rose, but it wasn't because he didn't try or didn't care. The whole team seemed to go into a slump along with him, and so went the season. The one bright spot was the play of Matt Weisbrot. He finally got a chance to play for a whole year without injury and he made the most of it. Middlebury should get a bid to the NCAAs. They really do have game this year. 

I agree with your post except I have to point out that starting a season 12-0 is a pretty good rhythm to have.

[walzy31]

I agree about Hixon, superb coach.  The family atmosphere he's created at Amherst is what separates them from the rest of the nescac.  Not sure about the assistants though...

December 11, 2001 Hixon wins 400th game.
January 2, 2006 Hixon wins 500th game.
March 17, 2007 Hixon wins 550th game and National Championship.
February 23, 2008 Hixon wins 573rd game and bumps his NESCAC tournament record to 19-3 (Amherst has won four championships and lost to Williams the other three times in the Finals - coached in all 22 possible NESCAC tournament games)

1,000 Pt Scorers this decade
'01 - Daoust 1,024
'03 - Fitzsimons 1,077 - Zieja 1,708
'04 - Donovan 1,084 - Harper 1,228
'05 - Schiel 1,408
'06 - Bedford 1,517
'07 - Wheeler, D. 1,132
'08 - Olson 1,144*
'09 - Baskauskas 684*
'10 - Wheeler, S. 246*
'11 - Bennett 15*
'12 - Waller 0**
(lots of great Amherst talent left off this list)

Also, gotta give ups to the current assistants for essentially handing Olson the Jostens award for Community Service and Basketball talent.

[eclinchy]

'10 - Wheeler, S. 246*
'11 - Bennett 15*
'12 - Waller 0**

I... admire your optimism?

[lefrakenstein]

the jeffs win and ugly game. the game was uneventful. they gradually increased the lead from a good colby team. colby ran good stuff but could have used another scorer. bring on bowdoin. btw, choice had a great game and is a very good player and deserves all the credit he gets.

these are the kind of vapid, idiotic posts that we could use less of.

Dear jeffrookie/lefrakenstein,

I'd rather read stuff like this from a man who actually knows the game and has close ties to the Amherst program than the rants of some self -important twit who has never dribbled a basketball in his life and thinks that sitting behind a microphone and watching a few games somehow makes him an expert. 

You aren't on the team and you don't know any of the players, so your insights into things such as who is or isn't a leader are just plain stupid, please keep them to yourself. 

i apologize about the leadership thing. i just meant that he is not known to be as vocal. its funny how a very complimentary post can be twisted to be negative. i mean, the whole point of my post was that olson was the best point guard by far that i have ever seen, and he is a lot fun to watch... not really sure how that got lost in the mix. you would think the team would want fans that care that aren't former players or kids who try out every year but never make the team.

[frank uible]

lefrak: You must watch no, or almost no, basketball on TV.

[La Verdad]

i apologize about the leadership thing. i just meant that he is not known to be as vocal. its funny how a very complimentary post can be twisted to be negative. i mean, the whole point of my post was that olson was the best point guard by far that i have ever seen, and he is a lot fun to watch... not really sure how that got lost in the mix. you would think the team would want fans that care that aren't former players or kids who try out every year but never make the team.

I'm pretty sure I already made my point, so I'll only respond to say two things...

1) The team does want fans who aren't former players or kids who try out every year and don't make it.  I've already said I'm not affiliated with the team, so you shouldn't consider my posts to be anything but my own opinion...duh.

2) I have never been on the team, nor have I ever tried out. 

[CCsalive]

Eclinchy-
I take offense to your argument. Are you aware that there are other very fine colleges in the world that offer an education equal to that at Williams and Amherst (the point being such an argument is in fact a subjective one)? Are you aware that Hamilton's former coach, Tom Murphy amassed over 600 wins and that in 1991, before NESCAC teams could compete in NCAAs, Hamilton finished the year ranked #1 in the nation?
I would argue that many high quality basketball recruits were lured to Hamilton over the years do in large part to the great basketball program AND the institutions academic reputation (not sure what the school "ranks" at these days...only guys like you buy US News to see if you topped Amherst or Swarthmore in the latest rankings).
I would also argue (I am forced to choose a side since you avoided my question) that Hamilton would be insane to join NESCAC for basketball (I thought that my point about the lack of a travel partner made sense but I guess not) since they can more easily win an automatic bid in the Liberty League and their academic reputation speaks for itself. I stand by my statement that in recent years only Trinity, Williams, and Amherst can take the mindset of a pragram that uses the lure of NESCAC as a recruting tool while at the same time telling recruits that the team plans on competing for the league's automatic bid. Aside from Conn's run in the late 90s and some recent winning from Tufts and Bates, other NESCACs cannot realistically make such statements to their recruits.

[eclinchy]

I go to Tufts, not Williams.  And I'm not bitter about it -- Tufts is the only NESCAC school I applied to.  I visited Amherst and hated it; I visited Williams and thought it was nice, but didn't want to spend four years in the middle of nowhere.  They're both considered great schools academically and athletically, and I respect them both for that.  That said, I'm perfectly happy not attending either school.  So don't make the mistake of thinking I'm biased for or against either one of them.

I'm aware that there are plenty of schools out there equal to Amherst and Williams.  I don't know of anyone who objectively considers Hamilton to be one of them.

I do think the NESCAC is more prestigious than the Liberty League, and I do think it would help recruiting for Hamilton to be a full NESCAC member.  However I understand that there are tons of practical issues making that impossible, and I think your traveling partner argument is a very good point.  Either way, nothing's going to change as a result of our bickering.