MBB: American Southwest Conference

[Ralph Turner]

A solid "in" with the JUCO's is definitely a nice luxury to have year in and year out.  Do Mississippi JUCO's not place that many kids in DI or DII programs?  If it is so easy to accept junior college transfers, I wouldn't imagine MC's academic standards aren't the most difficult to recruit with.  I think that would be a clear advantage on today's recruiting scene.  Private schools such as Trinity and Southwestern (again, I'm more familiar with SCAC) have taken large hits due to increases in tuition, decreases in financial aid, and the obvious economic decline, while maintaining their academic standards. 

The economic downturn hits everyone.

Most institutions endowment portfolios are similar in many ways. Even Harvard is having to budget.

The losses cut across the board.  Harvard/ Trinity/ Mississippi College, it's all the same, IMHO.

[Walter17]

I agree with you in the fact that economic downturn hurts everyone, Ralph.  However, I don't really see how Harvard's basketball recruiting is affected in the same way as schools such as Trinity or other lesser known private institutions.  Even in the article on Harvard you attached, it states: "The school intends to implement initiatives to make education affordable to students from low- and middle-income families, and will ensure that those with income below $60,000 will pay nothing to send children to Harvard College. Those earning up to $180,000 can expect to pay no more than about 10 percent of their income."  I don't think this economic downturn hurts Harvard's recruiting at all.  It may hurt for players they want whose families make more than $200K.

Smaller private institutions are the ones that take the larger hit because they are so tuition driven.  When they begin making cuts, it usually deals with cutting financial aid to students and targeting a different type of student (i.e. richer families who can afford $40K a year for college). 

[Ralph Turner]

Good evening Walter.

I think that Trinity comes into focus when the national player that they are seeking decides to stay closer to home, if the player cannot get into or affrod a WashStL or NYU or Rochester.

Southwestern's endowment was over $300M last year.  McMurry' was only $60+M and those schools are not that different in size.  I think that a Hendrix or an AC may be in more trouble than Southwestern ColColl or Trinity.   

[golden_dome]

A solid "in" with the JUCO's is definitely a nice luxury to have year in and year out.  Do Mississippi JUCO's not place that many kids in DI or DII programs?  If it is so easy to accept junior college transfers, I wouldn't imagine MC's academic standards aren't the most difficult to recruit with.  I think that would be a clear advantage on today's recruiting scene.  Private schools such as Trinity and Southwestern (again, I'm more familiar with SCAC) have taken large hits due to increases in tuition, decreases in financial aid, and the obvious economic decline, while maintaining their academic standards. 

Walter,
 The MS junior colleges have a very good athletic tradition and produce a lot of major talent every year for Division I, II and III. In football, MS Gulf Coast won the NJCAA National Championship last year and 4 of the top 13 teams in the latest NJCAA Poll were from MS. Basketball also usually puts out a lot of talent.

 The MS junior college system is unique because there are 13 schools in a relatively small state. They attract a lot of good students from the state, particularly lower income, because of the great value they provide, and not just to students who can't get in anywhere else. They are also attractive to student-athletes who are hopeful of athletic scholarships but get passed over. They can earn free college credits and a chance to prove they are worthy of a scholarship somewhere.

 No doubt athletics benefits, but the entire college brings in a lot of transfer students for the simple fact there are a lot available from 13 schools. We probably have somewhere around 3,000 undergrad students, and about 1,000 are transfers.

   MC's academic standards and financial aid packaging are similiar to the rest of the ASC's private schools. There are several sites you could find the info, but collegeboard.com is one of them.

[Bearkat00]

Bearkat - I do not agree with your assesment of NAIA.  A good D3 team cannot beat most NAIA schools.  For instance, LSUS would be a very tough game for anyone in our conference and they have can hardly get past the sweet 16.

Also, HBU did not BEAT UP ON the Red River Conference.  Undoubtedly they were a perenniel contender, but Texas Wesleyan just recently won the National Championship and several other teams give them fits every time they play.   

I apologize for my earlier comments.  It was said as an opinion and not through facts.  Obviously D3 schools do not fair well at all against NAIA schools.  Thank you for providing the statistics 

As for HBU, winning 9 RRAC championships in 9 years seems to be beating up on them.  I think the D1 move was good for them, though they are in for an awaking in a couple of days!

[Walter17]

Oh, I absolutely agree with you there Ralph.  It will be interesting to see how schools such as Austin College or Hendrix respond to these times.  It's often a tough decision for schools to make when deciding what applicants they should accept.  It wouldn't surprise me to see these types of schools sacrifice a small portion of academic standards to keep enrollment numbers comparable to prior years.

[lewis]

Maybe schools like Howard Payne will scope you some students. Ranked #2 Best Value in West Region by US News and World reports this year.

[frank_ezelle]

One thing you have to say about MC is that they have found a system that works.  What always amazes me is that they ever get any freshmen basketball players into the program since it is almost certain that the playing time they hope to get as they work and mature is playing time that will go to a Juco player who will be recruited in a couple of years.

Look at the 30 players on the current MC roster.  There are 9 freshmen, 4 sophomores, and then 16 players from junior colleges and 1 from a D1 school.  There's not a single junior or senior who came into the program as a high school player.  Over the years I've seen some pretty good high school guys who would have played some right from the start at Millsaps and would have had good careers over their 4 years, but they never get to play much or any varsity ball at MS College.

There are exceptions such as Tyler Winford who had a great career and won recognition both on and off the court.  His stats don't look that great because of the MC system, but people were able to look past his stats and recognize his talent (which reminds me of the joke that Dean Smith was the only man who ever effectively kept Michael Jordan from scoring).  However, few high school players are on par with Tyler Winford.  If he had come to Millsaps he would have started right from the beginning, he would be among the all time leaders in SCAC basketball, he would probably have a National Championship ring, and he might have even made 1st team All-American. 

Again, I'm not criticising the MC system because the reloading with Juco players works and I won't be surprised if they do win a national championship some day.  I'm just amazed that they are able to bring in a significant number of freshmen basketball players year after year when it is obvious that very few of them will ever play much in the MC system.

[golden_dome]

Again, I'm not criticising the MC system because the reloading with Juco players works and I won't be surprised if they do win a national championship some day.  I'm just amazed that they are able to bring in a significant number of freshmen basketball players year after year when it is obvious that very few of them will ever play much in the MC system.

Frank,
   I hear that question a lot from people because of the JUCO numbers, but it's not entirely accurate. For example. Last year MS College had two freshman, E. C. Williams and Chris Kastmo, who were among the top ten players and received significant playing time all year in the second rotation of players. Both players played about 10 minutes a game and to my knowledge more than any Millsaps freshman. Williams actually made the ASC All-Freshman team.

   This year, David McClain is currently among the top ten players and played 16 minutes against Alcorn as the backup shooting guard. He helped lead Picayune to the MS 4A state championship game last year. We brought in about equal numbers of JUCO's and high school kids this year.  The level of play is high for everyone so it's hard to get on the court, but the best players always play. I think the fact that Coach Lofton uses a rotation of 10-12 players every game is attractive to players because there is a lot of opportunity for playing time.

The winning also helps get freshman. Here's a good stat few people would know. The NCAA's active winningest coach list only lists coaches with at least 5 years as the head coach. Coach Lofton only has four years, but his winning percentage (.800 which would be ahead of Rob Kornaker, St. John Fisher .786) would lead all of DIII and actually is second among all divisions behind only Roy Williams of North Carolina and ahead of Gonzaga's Mark Few. (Roy Williams, .807 ;  Don Lofton, .800 ;  Mark Few, .797).

[frank_ezelle]

No disagree from me Chris on what you are saying.  In general, I think it is fair to say that freshmen who come in at MC and are able to contribute right away are guys who would have contributed right away at most D3 programs.  But I also think there are a handful of guys who come to MC every year in need of some development, guys who would become very good players at a place like Millsaps, and I think most of these guys end up never playing in the MC system.

For example, Chad Songy has developed into a very good point guard at Millsaps but I doubt he would have ever played at MC.  I don't think he would have gotten the practice time or playing time that he needed to develop, even with a junior varsity schedule.  It's guys like that who seem to get lost at MC, guys who could be very good players in a year or two if they were in a different system.

Again, this is just an observation not a criticism.  It's like in football where a team geared towards running the ball might be an excellent program, but it might not be the best program for a guy who excells at passing the football.  In a way MC is like the New York Yankees and they tend to go out and get veteran players to fill a need and a school like Millsaps is more like a team that builds through their farm system.  It's just a different way to try and get to the same result.

[golden_dome]

Frank,
   We do have a lot of good players who hang it up every year because they don't want to sit on the bench and watch, but that happens with our JUCO guys and the high school kids. I would think that happens at most DIII schools who have success. It's hard to get players to watch from the sideline when they aren't on scholarship.

   This happens every year, but right now we are probably down to around 20-25 players, which gives everyone a chance to get better at practice. If you come to our practices you would see that everyone who sticks it out is still getting an opportunity. Lots of drills and rotating to make sure no player gets overlooked.

   It hasn't happened lately, but we had a couple guys like Songy 4-5 years ago. Tracy Phillips sat for three years and I think was First Team All-ASC as a senior in 04. Steven Makamson was another kid who did that and was ASC Defensive player of the year around the same time.

  I would agree with you though that a lot of kids fall through the cracks for us who could be very good players somewhere else, but I don't think the system necessarily makes it harder for the freshman to play. It's hard for everyone because of the talent that Coach Lofton has brought into the program.

It's just hard to convince a freshman to stay around for 2-3 years of practice before they play, even the ones that you can tell will contribute one day. They all want to play from day one and they are at a disadvantage to kids a couple years older. But we would have the same problem if we relied solely on freshmen to mature because once they were juniors and seniors the new incoming freshmen would sit and watch them. Just the nature of DIII.

[kid nice]

Curt Crain and Travis Bernhard also. One of those two started all 4 years they were there I believe.  Good Luck Chocs and lock down on D.  Thats the only thing that worries me with the JUCOS, SOMETIMES they are not used to having to do that. Also good luck to UT Tyler.

[#1ascfanman]

I was checking out everyone's schedules and saw HPU played Stephen F. Austin yesterday and got beat pretty bad.  I know they did well last year, did they lose some people or not recruit well? They only scored 38 points.  ETBWHO plays Jarvis Christian today.  We will see how they are going to be.

[#1ascfanman]

My Wildcats play Lamar tonight as well as Ozarks against Hendrix, Hardin Simmons at UT Arlington and Sul Ross at UT- Pan Am.  Just saw these on the conference website. 

[etbualum]

ETBU beat Jarvis on a 3 at the buzzer by Dennis Jones.  The refs had to go to replay.  Jarvis missed the a ft with about 7 seconds left and ETBU was able to go the length of the floor and get a 3 up.  Tigers will be at Northwestern on Tuesday.