FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[chewey]

God SJU sucks compared to what I've been used to.  They were again lucky to get a win today.  But for the blocked extra point, which just looked like a low, bad kick into the hands of several Johnnies, the J's would have their 3rd conference loss.  Keep in mind that Bethel needs to lose one and the Cobblers need to lose two.  I don't think the start are going to align like that for the J's.  The J's coaching staff had better get out and start seriously recruiting good players.  Evidently, St. Thomas stole two great players that were already intending to go to SJU.  I wonder who those players are and what was said to them.  I guess they are supposed to be really, really good.  I can't believe SJU lost a recruiting battle to UST.  That must mean that SJU just did not go out and sell itself enough. 

Chewey....before we start writing the SJU Football obituary let's take a step back and examine some history that may give the faithful some sense of perspective in terms of how and when seasons like this happen and what SJU has historically done in the seasons that follow.  My history with SJU dates back to the mid/late 80s so my examples are confined to the last 20 years.  During that time period 3 seasons would be classified as disasters; 1990 at 7-3, 1997 at 6-4 and 2004 at 7-3.  Worst case scenario this season ends at 6-4 like 1997.  To do that we have to lose to both Augsburg and Carleton to end the season.  The remains of the 97 team and its recruiting focus led to arguably the best multi-year run in SJU history 98-03....5 West Region championships in 6 years, two Stagg Bowls and one National Championship....keep in mind that many folks felt that SJU's best days were in the rearview mirror both during and after the 97 season.

In my estimation this year's team is more like 99 than 97 without the name leadership.  The offense in 99 after Linnemann's mangled ankle was challenged to say the least.  The players existed, but execution was brutal at times and OLine play was weak; much like this season.  Strong defense (like this year) ruled the day; the best example of which came in the playoffs when Beau LaBore scored more points on INT returns (14) in the game against UWSP than the offense (9).  The 99 season proved an SJU team can win/make the playoffs without scoring much.  I realize that doesn't sit well with the defense, but you work with the ingredients you have.

In terms of the UST recruiting success, this is not the first or the last time a player will pick them over SJU.  Several of UST's better players in recent memory have been picked them over SJU.  Hilliard, Barkley, Sauer and the guys this year are examples.  Hilliard was given a virtual full ride for academics, Barkley did not want to back up Chris Moore who had started as a freshman at SJU, Sauer did not want to back up Kofoed again.  For this year's reasons read the Star Trib article from this summer that clearly indicated money ($40,000 scholarship) was the factor.  The schools have very different ways of dealing with financial aid.

That's a very good analysis and those are very good points.  I hope you're proven right.  I still think that there are things that could be done differently in recruiting that could only help SJU.

[chewey]

Look at Linfield and PLU.  Two excellent programs that have hit the skids recently.  For PLU, it's been a very long ride in the tank.  Hopefully, Linfield will bounce back quickly.  I'd like to see them back at the top.  They got smoked today and I think it's been a very long time since a Linfield team has been beaten that badly.  It does not take long to become like PLU is now and I don't want SJU to get there.  Hopefully, PLU will find a way to bounce back, too. 

[DutchFan2004]

You have to look at the whole West.  There are a lot of programs that seem to be retooling this year.  Linfield though has not even been in the playoffs the last two years going on three.

[CobberFvr]

That loss for the Cobbers against Willamette looks pretty good still...

Congrats to all the victors today...now if my Buckeyes would just get their heads out of their arses.

[chewey]

I agree Dutch but it's hard to watch.  What ever happened to Jeff Krac###, the old coach there?  That 2000 Central team had one of the best defensive lines I've seen based upon my probably limited experience.  I don't know which was more formidable that year -- Central's d-line or UW-Stout's.  Stout had a lot of animals too.

[DutchFan2004]

He is back in Pella coaching Pella Christian High football team.  I don't know what else he is doing. 

[DutchFan2004]

He lead them to an 8-1 record to the playoffs this year.

[Redtooth]

You have to look at the whole West.  There are a lot of programs that seem to be retooling this year.  Linfield though has not even been in the playoffs the last two years going on three.

The West isn't the only place that this is happening...what about annual powers Rowan, Trinity, Hardin Simmons?  This is the sort of stuff that makes the MOUNT UNION juggernaut look all the more impressive.  They are going on consecutive year 16 of being the King of the Hill (or the team to beat).

I am still perplexed as to why Kac walked away from Central a couple years back.....great guy with a great program.

[sfury]

But Chewey, your basic analysis of SJU this year has been to repeatedly say they need to recruit better players, whether it's quarterbacks, skill position, or linemen. Any response to that is going to sound "sycophantic" because it's such an obvious and sort of absurd statement. All I can hope is that the SJU coaches read this, because I'm sure they haven't thought about that (maybe someone can get Gagliardi a log-in, so he's made aware of what needs to be done to make sure the Johnnies don't sink into the depths of the MIAC).

They somehow do manage to still recruit some good players, seeing that the defense is No. 1 in the league and hasn't given up more than two TDs in a game, despite playing the season without an All-American lineman in Gunderson.

And is it that shocking that someone might choose St. Thomas over St. John's for reasons other than recruiting incompetency on the part of the Johnnies? I mean, sure, the schools are so dramatically different in terms of academics, religion, social life and athletics that I can see where it'd be inconceivable to think someone would go there instead of SJU. It's not like they chose a JUCO Mormon school over St. John's.

It's obviously a down year for the offense. Yet somehow they're still in a position - a longshot to be sure - to win the conference or get an at-large bid. Even if they don't get into the playoffs, they could still finish 8-2, which, to my calculations, would be a better winning percentage than Gagliardi's career mark. For a sucky, disastrous season that will be a precursor to years of mediocrity, that wouldn't be too bad.

[Pat Coleman]

I am still perplexed as to why Kac walked away from Central a couple years back.....great guy with a great program.

I am not sure it was voluntary, if you catch my drift. It was billed as such but you know how things go.

[chewey]

But Chewey, your basic analysis of SJU this year has been to repeatedly say they need to recruit better players, whether it's quarterbacks, skill position, or linemen. Any response to that is going to sound "sycophantic" because it's such an obvious and sort of absurd statement. All I can hope is that the SJU coaches read this, because I'm sure they haven't thought about that (maybe someone can get Gagliardi a log-in, so he's made aware of what needs to be done to make sure the Johnnies don't sink into the depths of the MIAC).

They somehow do manage to still recruit some good players, seeing that the defense is No. 1 in the league and hasn't given up more than two TDs in a game, despite playing the season without an All-American lineman in Gunderson.

And is it that shocking that someone might choose St. Thomas over St. John's for reasons other than recruiting incompetency on the part of the Johnnies? I mean, sure, the schools are so dramatically different in terms of academics, religion, social life and athletics that I can see where it'd be inconceivable to think someone would go there instead of SJU. It's not like they chose a JUCO Mormon school over St. John's.

It's obviously a down year for the offense. Yet somehow they're still in a position - a longshot to be sure - to win the conference or get an at-large bid. Even if they don't get into the playoffs, they could still finish 8-2, which, to my calculations, would be a better winning percentage than Gagliardi's career mark. For a sucky, disastrous season that will be a precursor to years of mediocrity, that wouldn't be too bad.

With respect to Kac and Central, I have a hard time seeing Central firing him for how he did as a coach. Maybe he was a spit fire and pissed off the right people.  He's my age and I remember that he was an extremely gifted and mean (in a good athletic way) player when SJU played them in the later 80's.  Obviously, whatever happened is none of my business but he was a great coach and I was shocked to hear that he had left. 

Sfury, my comments are directed primarily at the offense.  The defense has held up and has done a decent job but they are not like the 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 defenses talent-wise.  There is no question, based upon my admittedly limited perspective, that the talent level has dropped as a whole, especially on o-line.  It reminds me of the late 80's when I was there, starting with the 1986 4-4-1 squad, following the Rick Bell/Mike Zumwinkle/Rick Dougherty years.  In fact, the entire 80's were fairly mediocre by 1990's and 2000's standards.  It was not until 1989 that SJU got to the semis and lost to Dayton.   

Maybe this year the better players are there but have not gotten in.  Waring is a good example.  My point is not necessarily that SJU  needs to recruit better players.  I think it's obvious that the ones starting right now are pretty average, at least on the o-line.  My point is that it seems as if they don't actually go to great lengths to recruit anyone.  Good players in the past have gone there because of Gagliardi and because it's St. John's.  I think that's happening a lot less now and that there is a lot more competition in the MIAC for those athletes.  Just saying that "we're St. John's" is not going to cut it and the pre-game baloney that they do now does not help.  If I were a player attending an SJU game, I'd be really turned off by that.   St. John's has always been about humble,  hardworking middle-class type comaradarie.  It is that basic, unpretentious philosophy that has drawn great people there, including great players, in the past.  I am really surprised that Gagliardi consented to all of that. 

To compete with the other MIAC schools, SJU is probably going to need to take a more personable and less pretentious approach to recruiting and tone down the glitz.  Even I, as a staunch SJU supporter, can acknowledge a haughtiness or borderline arrogance that has probably turned a lot of good players away.  More of the good players are being spread around the league, it seems to me, whereas before most went to SJU. 

Even MUC recruits by talking to players and trying to draw them there.  If I were to say "I'm the best lawyer, you come to me if you come to me" that would turn off a lot of potential business.  With 30 attorneys competing in the market instead of 5, that would really impact revenues.  The same thing applies with SJU.  When Gagliardi is no longer there, and I shutter to think of that, SJU won't even have the "coach with the most collegiate wins" selling point.  They're going to have to be unpretentious enough to possibly change how they do things, as I see it. 

[OzJohnnie]

Some reading from down under for the Sunday morning post church - pre game hour to kill...

"Woman's fishy-smelling mystery solved"

A WOMAN who spent four decades puzzled by a pungent body odour "resembling rotting fish" has finally had the smell explained by Australian doctors.

"Jobseekers duped into getting face tattoos"

Sawiyono realised he had been tricked after checking with the subdistrict chief of the Bojonegoro district of East Java...

"That's ruff - dogs 'eat' sleeping man's car"

Asked what he thought when he first saw the damage, Mr Dwyer said: "Doggone it! That's a bit ruff."

[Rugman]

But Chewey, your basic analysis of SJU this year has been to repeatedly say they need to recruit better players, whether it's quarterbacks, skill position, or linemen. Any response to that is going to sound "sycophantic" because it's such an obvious and sort of absurd statement. All I can hope is that the SJU coaches read this, because I'm sure they haven't thought about that (maybe someone can get Gagliardi a log-in, so he's made aware of what needs to be done to make sure the Johnnies don't sink into the depths of the MIAC).

They somehow do manage to still recruit some good players, seeing that the defense is No. 1 in the league and hasn't given up more than two TDs in a game, despite playing the season without an All-American lineman in Gunderson.

And is it that shocking that someone might choose St. Thomas over St. John's for reasons other than recruiting incompetency on the part of the Johnnies? I mean, sure, the schools are so dramatically different in terms of academics, religion, social life and athletics that I can see where it'd be inconceivable to think someone would go there instead of SJU. It's not like they chose a JUCO Mormon school over St. John's.

It's obviously a down year for the offense. Yet somehow they're still in a position - a longshot to be sure - to win the conference or get an at-large bid. Even if they don't get into the playoffs, they could still finish 8-2, which, to my calculations, would be a better winning percentage than Gagliardi's career mark. For a sucky, disastrous season that will be a precursor to years of mediocrity, that wouldn't be too bad.

With respect to Kac and Central, I have a hard time seeing Central firing him for how he did as a coach. Maybe he was a spit fire and pissed off the right people.  He's my age and I remember that he was an extremely gifted and mean (in a good athletic way) player when SJU played them in the later 80's.  Obviously, whatever happened is none of my business but he was a great coach and I was shocked to hear that he had left. 

Sfury, my comments are directed primarily at the offense.  The defense has held up and has done a decent job but they are not like the 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003 defenses talent-wise.  There is no question, based upon my admittedly limited perspective, that the talent level has dropped as a whole, especially on o-line.  It reminds me of the late 80's when I was there, starting with the 1986 4-4-1 squad, following the Rick Bell/Mike Zumwinkle/Rick Dougherty years.  In fact, the entire 80's were fairly mediocre by 1990's and 2000's standards.  It was not until 1989 that SJU got to the semis and lost to Dayton.   

Maybe this year the better players are there but have not gotten in.  Waring is a good example.  My point is not necessarily that SJU  needs to recruit better players.  I think it's obvious that the ones starting right now are pretty average, at least on the o-line.  My point is that it seems as if they don't actually go to great lengths to recruit anyone.  Good players in the past have gone there because of Gagliardi and because it's St. John's.  I think that's happening a lot less now and that there is a lot more competition in the MIAC for those athletes.  Just saying that "we're St. John's" is not going to cut it and the pre-game baloney that they do now does not help.  If I were a player attending an SJU game, I'd be really turned off by that.   St. John's has always been about humble,  hardworking middle-class type comaradarie.  It is that basic, unpretentious philosophy that has drawn great people there, including great players, in the past.  I am really surprised that Gagliardi consented to all of that. 

To compete with the other MIAC schools, SJU is probably going to need to take a more personable and less pretentious approach to recruiting and tone down the glitz.  Even I, as a staunch SJU supporter, can acknowledge a haughtiness or borderline arrogance that has probably turned a lot of good players away.  More of the good players are being spread around the league, it seems to me, whereas before most went to SJU. 

Even MUC recruits by talking to players and trying to draw them there.  If I were to say "I'm the best lawyer, you come to me if you come to me" that would turn off a lot of potential business.  With 30 attorneys competing in the market instead of 5, that would really impact revenues.  The same thing applies with SJU.  When Gagliardi is no longer there, and I shutter to think of that, SJU won't even have the "coach with the most collegiate wins" selling point.  They're going to have to be unpretentious enough to possibly change how they do things, as I see it. 

I would hope that every year, and this year in particular the SJU coaches sit down and first ask the question:  "Are we doing everything we could be doing to attrack the best, accademically qualified athletes to our sports programs, within our traditional recruiting parameters?"  If there are no significant improvements that can be made within these paramaters, the next question I would ask is "Should we expand any of our parameters?"  E.G. Spread out more geographically, expand the types of high schools we network with, modify our concept of a good fit with the program.  Then the final question I would ask is this.  "What are other MIAC schools doing that we have refrained from doing, that we should reconsider".  E.G.  Academic scholarships, perks, promising more playing time for freshmen and sophomores.

I have no idea how SJU compares to any of the other MIAC schools, but I'm sure others do.

[BudSJU84]

With rosters of around 180 players it sometimes must be hard for the cream to rise to the top.  The Johnnie coaching staff is probably as good at evaluating talent as they come,  however, talented players are bound to be overlooked.  Also, according to my brother who was on the team in the mid 1990's, some talented recruits just don't have the grades to get into St. John's.  While I realize this will never happen, I think the Johnnies would benefit from have a JV team.  It hasn't hurt Might Mount!

[justadad]

I've started four five posts since the Johnnies game yesterday.  What a difference from last year's thriller.  If AK or Penz played any game like the QB's played yesterday this board would be on fire.  The offense's may be down this year but the quarterbacks had opportunities to make many more plays than they did.  In the end St Johns expects to win, and the Oles waited for a catastrophe.  That was the difference in a very mediocre footbal game.