FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[faunch]

SJU looked poor in all facets of the game.  The team I saw today is a 5-5 or 6-4 team.  I hope they can figure some things out soon.  UST and BU should be licking their chops.

We went 3 and 7 the year SJU won a National Championship...and damn near beat them. Something about that game that will get SJU up no matter what their record is. I'll be there October 1 regardless.

You didn't see how bad we were today...HOLY S_IT...we gave up 469 yards today!!!!
I'd like to think you're right but Oct. 1 could be ugly.

[hazzben]

SJU...what happened? Yikes.

UWEC is a good team...SJU is not.  The last few years the Johnnies have been fortunate to have a solid defense that could overcome poor play calling.  The combination of a sub-par and SLOW defense, no stable quarterback, average receivers, and no superior players could be the making of a horrendous season.  Not only should UST and BU be licking their chops (one or both of them could run the Johnnies off the field this year) but this SJU team should have the Oles, Gusties, Knights and Cobbers drooling.  Heck even Augsburg and Hamline might keep their game against SJU close this year. 

It's continues to frustrate me that SJU has not built on their success over the past 10-15 years.  It feels like complacency has come to Collegeville.  Sure there's the Peddle Pub race at halftime and don't forget the new Rhino Deck up by the press-box but maybe it would be nice to putt a little better talent on the field.  Yes I know that SJU has been conference champs in 2005, 2006, 2008, and 2009 and a playoff appearance as well in 2007 however the performances in those playoff games have been less than stellar.

Maybe it's my frustration with seeing the Johnnies get worked today...I actually only witnessed half of it...okay I peeked in during the 3rd quarter long enough to feel the bile in the back of my throat.  Maybe today was an aberration... maybe UWEC will rise to the top of the WIAC.  Nonetheless it still does not bode well for the Johnnies when they can't even compete with a team that will finish in the middle of the pack or above in the WIAC. 

Unrelated note....those uniforms Michigan and Notre Dame are wearing tonight are sweet!!!

At least you've still got attendance 

And those uni's are $money$

[chewey]

Pathetic display of football today at Clemens.  Still stunned.  UST and Bethel will kick SJU's butt.  Start recruiting more aggressively please.  Everyone respects the heck out of Gagliardi and the program but the days of just letting people come to you are over.  This is SJU's 4th year without a grade-A QB (Boyle was decent but not close to what SJU has been accustomed to).  Unacceptable.

[sju56321]

I have always admired Mount Union for getting great players year in and year out and now UWW seems to be on that same path. I too have wondered why SJU can't do that, especially after 2003- maybe location? But agree that SJU can't sit and wait for guys to come to them and can't stick with central Minnesota kids-gotta expand.

[faunch]

Pathetic display of football today at Clemens.  Still stunned.  UST and Bethel will kick SJU's butt.  Start recruiting more aggressively please.  Everyone respects the heck out of Gagliardi and the program but the days of just letting people come to you are over.  This is SJU's 4th year without a grade-A QB (Boyle was decent but not close to what SJU has been accustomed to).  Unacceptable.

John coached from the press box today.  Granted it was hot as hell but it raises concerns about who is really in charge and leading the team.   They say a team takes on the personality of their coach...well the Johnnies have none right now.

[OzJohnnie]

Well.  That was disappointing.

[sju#57]

Didn't see the game today but as a former player and HS coach I can see part of SJU's problem and why MU has been so succesfull for so long and why WW has recently. I may be totally off base with this, but I think part of this is due to the fact that MU and WW don't have to compete for recruiting top instate players with DII schools. I know this has always been the case, but I think it has become a more prevolent problem for SJU. The day's of guy's going to NDSU or UND or SCSU and then transfering to SJU are coming to an end. Hell the U of M can't even keep the top players in the state here, but with the cost of tuition as it is, the guy's that can't make a DI program will take the $ and go DII. And from the sound of it, they have taken on the personality of a Gagliardi, just not John.  I played with Jimmy.......enough said.....

[chewey]

A lot of good points by a lot of people here.  I, too, have heard that Jimmy's personality turns people off.  Can't say that I know the guy but many have indicated this.  With MU and WW, I think they get the D1 castoffs from Ohio/Michigan/Pennsylvania (MU) and Milwaukee/Chicago (WW).  Plus, Larry Kehres (who's a very nice fellow, by the way, and not one bit of pretense about him) has some serious connections with D1 coaches who probably identify some kids who just can't quite cut the mustard at D1 and get referred to LK/MU.  Chuck Moore was a good example in that he got injured, after having been recruited by Penn State, and couldn't get back to d1 level and went to MU.  Gagliardi would have at least as many connections (probably 10 times more) and with Johnnies like Mike Grant coaching powerhouse MN teams, SJU should not have any issues about getting top tier players year in and year out.  I don't want to disparage the players who are there because they obviously work hard and put in the time but many just are not as good as those on other teams and certainly not as good as those players we used to have even 5 or 6 years ago.  This is the 4th year of pretty average teams (viewed in light of Johnnie teams 1989 to 2006).  I'd say it's getting desperate.  Our d-linemen today looked like mid-sized linebackers, for the most part, and it's no wonder that they got blown back by an offensive line that averages 293 lbs.  No penetration and too many tackles made by d-backs on running backs. 

[Pat Coleman]

A lot of good points by a lot of people here.  I, too, have heard that Jimmy's personality turns people off.  Can't say that I know the guy but many have indicated this.  With MU and WW, I think they get the D1 castoffs from Ohio/Michigan/Pennsylvania (MU) and Milwaukee/Chicago (WW).  Plus, Larry Kehres (who's a very nice fellow, by the way, and not one bit of pretense about him) has some serious connections with D1 coaches who probably identify some kids who just can't quite cut the mustard at D1 and get referred to LK/MU.  Chuck Moore was a good example in that he got injured, after having been recruited by Penn State, and couldn't get back to d1 level and went to MU.  Gagliardi would have at least as many connections (probably 10 times more) and with Johnnies like Mike Grant coaching powerhouse MN teams, SJU should not have any issues about getting top tier players year in and year out.

You'd have a hard time pointing to the former D-I players on Mount Union's roster. They might have one a year and it's been a while since one was a key part of their success.

[hazzben]

Didn't see the game today but as a former player and HS coach I can see part of SJU's problem and why MU has been so succesfull for so long and why WW has recently. I may be totally off base with this, but I think part of this is due to the fact that MU and WW don't have to compete for recruiting top instate players with DII schools. I know this has always been the case, but I think it has become a more prevolent problem for SJU. The day's of guy's going to NDSU or UND or SCSU and then transfering to SJU are coming to an end. Hell the U of M can't even keep the top players in the state here, but with the cost of tuition as it is, the guy's that can't make a DI program will take the $ and go DII. And from the sound of it, they have taken on the personality of a Gagliardi, just not John.  I played with Jimmy.......enough said.....

I'm not buying this for Mount. UWW and the WIAC schools definitely aren't recruiting against a ton of DII schools and have some nice tuition figures, but they also aren't sitting in as fertile a recruiting ground as Ohio either (although Chicago's not bad).

But claiming Mount gets all the DI castoffs is just inaccurate. Ohio has a ton of great HS players. But there are also a ton of colleges.

The University of Akron, Bowling Green, Cincinnati, Kent State, Miami University, Ohio University, OSU, Toledo, Dayton and Youngstown State are all DI programs in the state of Ohio. Yeah, not many DII schools, but a couple more DI schools than MN or WI.

There are also some elite DII football programs in neighboring states that recruit hard in Ohio. This says nothing about the numerous DIII and NAIA schools in the state.

Plus, Larry Kehres (who's a very nice fellow, by the way, and not one bit of pretense about him) has some serious connections with D1 coaches who probably identify some kids who just can't quite cut the mustard at D1 and get referred to LK/MU.  Chuck Moore was a good example in that he got injured, after having been recruited by Penn State, and couldn't get back to d1 level and went to MU.  Gagliardi would have at least as many connections (probably 10 times more) and with Johnnies like Mike Grant coaching powerhouse MN teams, SJU should not have any issues about getting top tier players year in and year out. 

Agreed about the comments regarding LK. He's a genuinely nice guy. And while I think he probably is a great networker (see his relationship with Mel Tjeerdsma from NW Missouri St), I'm not sure how many coaches are steering kids his way. Even if they were, I'm not sure that Gags has the same DI connections. He's never struck me as a guy who's been interested in cultivating stuff like that. And you do have to cultivate it. Does he really have connections like this at the UofM? Because I doubt he's got them at Iowa, Iowa State or Wisconsin.

And Chuck Moore might be a good example, but is he the norm nowadays? If he's not, then he might be unique example.

[sjusection105]

<a href="http://johnniefootball.com/archive/sjusection105/2011/09/11/blugolds-dismantle-johnnies-47-19/">SJU-UWEC game story   <----- Click There
Nothing good for SJU fans,but plenty of ammunition for the collapse of the Johnnie Empire for all the rest of the universe   

[SJU09]

Yesterday's result has been building for years.  There has been discussion among Johnnie football fans since 2003 that expectations for the program haven't matched results of the past.  I totally agree that a sense of complacency has set in, but this happened years ago.  John is a great coach, great man and all Johnnie fans owe him more than can be repaid. However, gradually it seems he has become the focus of the program.  We bask in the glow of what he has accomplished, how he does things, his stories etc.  Each victory is hailed and his total just gets bigger and more amazing.  As we continue to focus this constant attention to John, Whitewater and Linfield have  passed us as the schools to beat in the region and St. Thomas and Bethel have moved ahead of us as well.   Alumni love to relive the past but I wonder what all this means to current players? (See Notre Dame)   Most players today probably  don't  even remember the 2003 championship season.  I also question whether current players can connect with an 85 year old coach, one that sits in the press box during the game.  It's telling that when fingers are pointed at the  program they are often pointed at Jimmy, not John who is the coach of this team.  SJU better think hard about the future because I have a feeling the bleachers set up for the students in the end zone may be a thing of the past in a year or two.

[sju56321]

Look, I have been tough on SJU in the past, but, while yesterday was a debacle, let's just see if this was an aberration or not. I remember many folks saying in 1997 that the Old Man had lost it-SJU was in big trouble. But looked what happened-the perhaps the best six years in SJU football.
I will tell you that being in the Chicago area, UWW gets some nice players from the top classes in Illinois-programs that are consistently in the playoffs and make deep runs-kids that could play at DII, at least. I am pointing this out to suggest that SJU needs to go after that type of kid in the twin cities area. I don't know if this is a great analogy, but Monmouth in Illinois has gotten some nice players from the small division high schools in Illinois and I think that shows at the playoff level-they have success in the MWC, but can't quite match the bigger conferences. While NCC and Wheaton, who get the bigger class kids do very well on the national level, save playing Mount Union or UWW.
Next week will tell a lot for all of us-this may be the harbinger of a downward spiral or just an aberration.

[sjusection105]

I have always admired Mount Union for getting great players year in and year out and now UWW seems to be on that same path. I too have wondered why SJU can't do that, especially after 2003- maybe location? But agree that SJU can't sit and wait for guys to come to them and can't stick with central Minnesota kids-gotta expand.

Zip please clarify your thoughts.
1) UWW proximity to Chicago area or SJU being in the "sticks"?
2) UST winning the recruits from the Twin Cities because they are a suburban campus with real nice locker rooms and have momentum in the conference title & play-off appearances?
3) Bethel going after kids with a completely different priority set and a nice conduit to Texas H.S. ball for some reason as well as obscure southern MN HS football programs with freakishly large QBs?

Others may be ready to dance on the grave of SJU football,but I'm not ready to accept this just yet.

Are you coming back for Homecoming?

[SUMMIT!!!!!]

I think the next 4 weeks will be interesting in Collegeville and amongst the USJ faithful. As an outsider, it looks to me like the recruiting effort hasnt adfapted to changes and the competition has stepped up- Caruso, Horan, Hegge, Johnson, etc are hauling in more and better recruits than in the past.

Solid wins by Cord, BU and UST yesterday, all on the road, too. SOunds like Bethel is rolling on offense and the D is strong as ever. UST got its running game on track at UWRF and the defense looked very primed.

Back to the wringing of "red" hands