FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[BU5758]

If the Johnnies win the Walnut & Bronze, they will have (likely) beaten
Bethel on the road (done),
UMHB on the road, ;
Bethel  at home , and
UMU in the Stagg.

That is commendable.

Fixed it for you, Ralph.

60 years since I suited up for Bethel and about 10 years since I last posted. BU played in the Gopher-Badger Conference in the late '50s, which we won in 1958.  We occasionally had a scrimmage with Hamline and Augsburg. We took a beating but have some great memories.  Still pulling for BU and nice  to see 5 players from Washington State on the BU team, 2 starting, 1 on the 2 deep chart plus the the long snapper. Looking for direct flights from SeaTac to Shenandoah. Friend told me there are several direct flights from Bainbridge Island to Shenandoah, Saturdays only.     

[OzJohnnie]

Great article on BU and SJU at d3football.com

https://www.d3football.com/playoffs/2018/minnesota-teams-doing-good-work-on-defense

[retagent]

I think SJU would have a better time beating UWW or Bethel.... I'm not sure they could beat UMU or UMHB.... I watched you guys vs. Whitworth and although you pretty much dominate the game... I wasn't impressed with your lines or running back... plus your pass defense isn't much to write home about.... 

I believe you saw the worst game the Johnnies played since before the Tommie game. Erdman was off, and the Defense took the first half to get up to speed on a better team than they had faced in a few weeks. They got the running game going in the second half as well. When you say "running back" not sure what you mean since they usually employ at least 4 backs regularly. They bring in 3 large fellows (all over 230) in short yardage situations as well. They also have a secret weapon who didn't see the field against Whit, but, who  I hope they use at times this week. The pass defense has not been stellar, and has given up big plays. It looks as though they are playing "Prevent" for the whole game. They have pretty good athletes at the DB/S positions, and I can't explain this phenomenon.

[Toby Taff]

fury, I agree with you, obviously.  It's beyond obvious that UHMB are favourites.  They are as tough as anything that the Jays have encountered in years.  Travelling to TX means that the Johnnies are one or two score underdogs.  At least on or two scores.  They will need to play out of their skin on both offense and defense, particularly defense, to have a chance of victory.


That being said, why is it so controversial to point out that UHMB have been raised on a diet of Texas creampuffs, candied almonds and maraschino cherries?

I think its more an issue of dismissing th conference overall. yes we have a few teams that are down, some of which have been in the playoffs in the last 5 years. The ASC has 1 non-conference game and the teams try to schedule good opponents. HSU played trinity, ETBU played Plattville, SU played Denison, UMHB traveled to NY to play Albright so they'd have a game (apparently, Albright backed out of the backend of the home and home because UMHB is looking for a week 1 game now). the top middle of the ASC put up numbers on everyone they play in or out of conference, except UMHB. The MIAC has 4 teams above .500, the ASC has 5. Each MIAC team gets 2 non-conference games and none of y'all were scheduling juggernauts, so your cries of cream puff and candied almonds come across as specious and selfserving. I'd be willing to bet that one of our top half teams would be willing to put y'all on the schedule so you could have a taste of texas cream puff, too.

[DuffMan]

I would think Texans would have thicker skin.  Sheesh. 

[wally_wabash]

For some perusing...

UHMB stats: http://stats.ncaa.org/teams/450417

SJU stats: http://stats.ncaa.org/teams/450344


UHMB dominate the national stats to a scary degree.  The question is: have they padded them in a conference of cream puffs by building a huge program in a minnow pond or are they insanely dominant? We'll find out soon enough.

I am confident in thinking their defensive stats are legit.  The offensive ones are built on the back of drilling below average teams.  MHB has the penchant for burying teams by 70 if they can which inflates the scoring higher than it actually should be.

On the contrary. UMHB puts up big points in spite of the fact that the 2nd/3rd stringers are usually in the game in the 3rd quarter. If UMHB were interested in inflating their numbers, and left their starters in for most of the game, they could have scored 100 several times, including last week in a second round playoff game, and against a Southwestern team that beat Mount Union's 'mighty' first round opponent earlier in the year.

  Snooze.  Every top team only plays one half of football.  The fact that the Johnnies played starters in four quarters twice this year isn't a testament to the Johnnies' weakness but to the strength of the MIAC.

Texas creampuffs are on the menu for UHMB week in and week out.  We'll see if the Jays can serve a more filling meal.

SJ played one more non-cream puff than UMHB. The Crusaders didn't have a game closer than 21 points all year, and the starters didn't finish the 4th quarter in any games.

I'm not claiming that SJ is weak by any stretch. In fact, the match up with them concerns me as much, if not more than potential match ups with Whitewater and MU. I'm just refuting the assertion that UMHB runs up big numbers against nine scrub opponents while SJ faces a full gaunlet of power houses, because the facts simply don't support that.

SJU did face two legitimate playoff teams, one of which is still alive and the other that would have walked through the East.  Who did UMHB face?

Hardin-Simmons

Are we really sure that Hardin-Simmons is actually good?  Because we've been wringing the benefit-of-the-doubt chamois for quite a while now on a team whose best results over the last handful of years are not getting beat by 50 by UMHB. 

[crufootball]

For some perusing...

UHMB stats: http://stats.ncaa.org/teams/450417

SJU stats: http://stats.ncaa.org/teams/450344


UHMB dominate the national stats to a scary degree.  The question is: have they padded them in a conference of cream puffs by building a huge program in a minnow pond or are they insanely dominant? We'll find out soon enough.

I am confident in thinking their defensive stats are legit.  The offensive ones are built on the back of drilling below average teams.  MHB has the penchant for burying teams by 70 if they can which inflates the scoring higher than it actually should be.

On the contrary. UMHB puts up big points in spite of the fact that the 2nd/3rd stringers are usually in the game in the 3rd quarter. If UMHB were interested in inflating their numbers, and left their starters in for most of the game, they could have scored 100 several times, including last week in a second round playoff game, and against a Southwestern team that beat Mount Union's 'mighty' first round opponent earlier in the year.

  Snooze.  Every top team only plays one half of football.  The fact that the Johnnies played starters in four quarters twice this year isn't a testament to the Johnnies' weakness but to the strength of the MIAC.

Texas creampuffs are on the menu for UHMB week in and week out.  We'll see if the Jays can serve a more filling meal.

SJ played one more non-cream puff than UMHB. The Crusaders didn't have a game closer than 21 points all year, and the starters didn't finish the 4th quarter in any games.

I'm not claiming that SJ is weak by any stretch. In fact, the match up with them concerns me as much, if not more than potential match ups with Whitewater and MU. I'm just refuting the assertion that UMHB runs up big numbers against nine scrub opponents while SJ faces a full gaunlet of power houses, because the facts simply don't support that.

SJU did face two legitimate playoff teams, one of which is still alive and the other that would have walked through the East.  Who did UMHB face?

Hardin-Simmons

Are we really sure that Hardin-Simmons is actually good?  Because we've been wringing the benefit-of-the-doubt chamois for quite a while now on a team whose best results over the last handful of years are not getting beat by 50 by UMHB.

Actually in the last handful of years they beat UMHB which is something in that time frame that only Linfield and Mount Union can say.

We can go in circles all day on how good HSU is but pretty much every poll out there had them top 10 going into the game and the computer models that have been updated since have them still as a top 15 team.

HSU has had their chance but in the last 3 years they have only lost of UMHB and Linfield, which would have been the case for about 97% of the rest of D3.

[Toby Taff]

I would think Texans would have thicker skin.  Sheesh. 

Notice I don't generally respond to this kind of banter. I'm an Auburn fan in a family full of Alabama fans. My family settled in tuscaloosa when they immigrated from Ireland in the 1800's. I get to hear lots of crap spewed forth from the mouths of family, most of which is about how great the SEC is, but they only really play SEC teams, and I don't think you can argue for greatness by nature of what conference youre a part of when you canabilize the other "great teams" in the SEC rather than playing other conferences. That's what I love about D3. We have playoffs and settle it on the field. So i don't tout the ASC as great because we play mostly ASC teams (even in the playoffs), but I do hold UMHB up as a good tot great team, because year in and out they make deep runs on teams from all over the country. They put up crazy numbers in conference and their quality as a team sustains them deep into the playoffs; so their quality of opponent in conference is at least good enough to help them prepare for the rest of the country.

I have pretty thick skin, I hear Roll Tide or read it on my facebook feed more times a day than anyone should have to. This isn't an issue of thick or thin skin. A question was asked and I gave the best response I could, for me. I get trolling. I know what a troll looks like on the internet and I don't get bothered by them. Most of the time i read their remarks and move on. Just decided that I wanted to walk across the bridge this time so I paid the toll to the troll.

[wally_wabash]

Are we really sure that Hardin-Simmons is actually good?  Because we've been wringing the benefit-of-the-doubt chamois for quite a while now on a team whose best results over the last handful of years are not getting beat by 50 by UMHB.

Actually in the last handful of years they beat UMHB which is something in that time frame that only Linfield and Mount Union can say.

We can go in circles all day on how good HSU is but pretty much every poll out there had them top 10 going into the game and the computer models that have been updated since have them still as a top 15 team.

HSU has had their chance but in the last 3 years they have only lost of UMHB and Linfield, which would have been the case for about 97% of the rest of D3.

HSU did beat UMHB three years ago.  Then turned right around and lost to them in the tournament.  Before that?  2004 was the last time HSU beat UMHB.  So we shouldn't paint this series as a back and forth rivalry because it isn't.  I'd like to see Hardin-Simmons do something other than not get completely wiped out by UMHB to validate their ranking.  Especially if we're going to use Hardin-Simmons to validate UMHB's quality of schedule.  That line of dialogue is getting a bit too circular for my liking. 

[retagent]

The Johnnies NC schedule this year consisted of UW Stout, a middle of the pack WIAC team. The WIAC has been deemed the toughest conference in DIII for a number of years. They played Thomas More, a ranked opponent who was in the running for a Pool B berth. Hardly cupcakes.

When you can save your private institution money by playing decent opponents, without travelling halfway across the country, I would say that's being smart. Let the Tommies, who have the cabbage to do that, do that. We can then beat those teams by proxy.

[MUC57]

WOW!

You guys are really going at it. I'm not getting involved. Just a quick comment. We all agree, Belton will get to see two great teams play Saturday. That's a given. Who will win? We'll find out in 3 days.
I will simply say - GO JOHNNIES! Bring that win back to Collegeville. This Raider fan is with you all the way. Travel safely, no injuries to the team and enjoy the fruits of your labor over the season. Have fun St. John's!. 🏈👍

[art76]

The Johnnies NC schedule this year consisted of UW Stout, a middle of the pack WIAC team. The WIAC has been deemed the toughest conference in DIII for a number of years. They played Thomas More, a ranked opponent who was in the running for a Pool B berth. Hardly cupcakes.

When you can save your private institution money by playing decent opponents, without travelling halfway across the country, I would say that's being smart. Let the Tommies, who have the cabbage to do that, do that. We can then beat those teams by proxy.

And Bethel beat UW River Falls, who went 3 and 7, but also beat Simpson, one of 4 teams vying for the ARC championship and finished 7 and 3. FWIW, I'd like to see BU play more CCIW and WIAC teams in the coming years. Iron sharpens iron.

[02 Warhawk]

Are we really sure that Hardin-Simmons is actually good?  Because we've been wringing the benefit-of-the-doubt chamois for quite a while now on a team whose best results over the last handful of years are not getting beat by 50 by UMHB.

Actually in the last handful of years they beat UMHB which is something in that time frame that only Linfield and Mount Union can say.

We can go in circles all day on how good HSU is but pretty much every poll out there had them top 10 going into the game and the computer models that have been updated since have them still as a top 15 team.

HSU has had their chance but in the last 3 years they have only lost of UMHB and Linfield, which would have been the case for about 97% of the rest of D3.

HSU did beat UMHB three years ago.  Then turned right around and lost to them in the tournament.  Before that?  2004 was the last time HSU beat UMHB.  So we shouldn't paint this series as a back and forth rivalry because it isn't.  I'd like to see Hardin-Simmons do something other than not get completely wiped out by UMHB to validate their ranking.  Especially if we're going to use Hardin-Simmons to validate UMHB's quality of schedule.  That line of dialogue is getting a bit too circular for my liking.

He didn't say it was. He was just responding to your "last handful of years" comment. Way to stir the pot.

[crufootball]

Are we really sure that Hardin-Simmons is actually good?  Because we've been wringing the benefit-of-the-doubt chamois for quite a while now on a team whose best results over the last handful of years are not getting beat by 50 by UMHB.

Actually in the last handful of years they beat UMHB which is something in that time frame that only Linfield and Mount Union can say.

We can go in circles all day on how good HSU is but pretty much every poll out there had them top 10 going into the game and the computer models that have been updated since have them still as a top 15 team.

HSU has had their chance but in the last 3 years they have only lost of UMHB and Linfield, which would have been the case for about 97% of the rest of D3.

HSU did beat UMHB three years ago.  Then turned right around and lost to them in the tournament.  Before that?  2004 was the last time HSU beat UMHB.  So we shouldn't paint this series as a back and forth rivalry because it isn't.  I'd like to see Hardin-Simmons do something other than not get completely wiped out by UMHB to validate their ranking.  Especially if we're going to use Hardin-Simmons to validate UMHB's quality of schedule.  That line of dialogue is getting a bit too circular for my liking.

You don't like the circle but you keep it going. I am happy to admit that they have squandered their chances to prove their overall standing in D3 but you don't seem willing to admit that they may be better but don't get the chance to prove that in that playoffs against anyone other than Linfield and UMHB. The same geographic challenges you site to give the NCAA clearance for having them play UMHB in the playoffs are the same reason they don't go out and schedule big time opponents in the regular season.

[HSUCowboy2015]

Are we really sure that Hardin-Simmons is actually good?  Because we've been wringing the benefit-of-the-doubt chamois for quite a while now on a team whose best results over the last handful of years are not getting beat by 50 by UMHB.

Actually in the last handful of years they beat UMHB which is something in that time frame that only Linfield and Mount Union can say.

We can go in circles all day on how good HSU is but pretty much every poll out there had them top 10 going into the game and the computer models that have been updated since have them still as a top 15 team.

HSU has had their chance but in the last 3 years they have only lost of UMHB and Linfield, which would have been the case for about 97% of the rest of D3.

HSU did beat UMHB three years ago.  Then turned right around and lost to them in the tournament.  Before that?  2004 was the last time HSU beat UMHB.  So we shouldn't paint this series as a back and forth rivalry because it isn't.  I'd like to see Hardin-Simmons do something other than not get completely wiped out by UMHB to validate their ranking.  Especially if we're going to use Hardin-Simmons to validate UMHB's quality of schedule.  That line of dialogue is getting a bit too circular for my liking.

You don't like the circle but you keep it going. I am happy to admit that they have squandered their chances to prove their overall standing in D3 but you don't seem willing to admit that they may be better but don't get the chance to prove that in that playoffs against anyone other than Linfield and UMHB. The same geographic challenges you site to give the NCAA clearance for having them play UMHB in the playoffs are the same reason they don't go out and schedule big time opponents in the regular season.

THANK YOU. We're acting here as if Linfield and UMHB aren't dominate D3 programs. Yes, we have to find a way to win a playoff game, but the competition we are facing compared to others in the first round isn't exactly on the same level. I fully believe that if given an opportunity in another region we could win some games in the playoffs. It is what it is, but to say HSU isn't good is absurd. With that being said, see y'all in Belton this weekend. Should be a phenomenal game Saturday.