FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[AO]

The goal was always late spring from what I know. Probably needed to get it in the agenda first.

Word was out on TomToss, but not to the broader public. It sounds like someone from UST wisely let a few sympathetic members of the media know the shenanigans that were taking place. Initially to hopefully bring it out into the public eye and garner enough sympathy to prevent ouster. Falling short of that, to control the narrative in such a way that the COL (especially Olaf) look really pathetic.

To that end, KFAN just did a segment today highlighting the stupidity of kicking out a founding member. Especially one that attracts media coverage to the whole league.

Reusse says he got the first call from a longtime basketball coach not from St, Thomas.  I'm guessing it was Guy Kalland.

Was it Barrerio with the rant on the radio?  Since when has KFAN covered the MIAC?  I really like their shows but they don't have anyone that can talk about anything outside the big 4 pro sports. Media coverage goes towards the teams that advance in the playoffs and get on TV, the benefit the other teams get from that coverage is very small.

[sjusection105]

The goal was always late spring from what I know. Probably needed to get it in the agenda first.
Falling short of that, to control the narrative in such a way that the COL (especially Olaf) look really pathetic.

I would say this was achieved. Have you seen any article where the November 11,2017 97-0 UST rout of St. Olaf wasn't mentioned?

St. Olaf really looks pathetic and I can't imagine that maneuvering to change conference bylaws to force the team that quadruple and 2/3 Monkey Stomped them out of the MIAC. Maybe St. Olaf has a pipeline to players who want to be sheltered through their life and eliminating a team that put that bad of a beatdown on the program two years ago seems like the safe harbor community that they want to be part of Um Ya Ya!

[faunch]

The goal was always late spring from what I know. Probably needed to get it in the agenda first.
Falling short of that, to control the narrative in such a way that the COL (especially Olaf) look really pathetic.

I would say this was achieved. Have you seen any article where the November 11,2017 97-0 UST rout of St. Olaf wasn't mentioned?

St. Olaf really looks pathetic and I can't imagine that maneuvering to change conference bylaws to force the team that quadruple and 2/3 Monkey Stomped them out of the MIAC. Maybe St. Olaf has a pipeline to players who want to be sheltered through their life and eliminating a team that put that bad of a beatdown on the program two years ago seems like the safe harbor community that they want to be part of Um Ya Ya!

In all seriousness we should order MIAC Participation medals and hand them out to the C.O.L. football teams next fall. Who wants in? We could probably do it for about $50-100 a person.

[faunch]

The goal was always late spring from what I know. Probably needed to get it in the agenda first.
Falling short of that, to control the narrative in such a way that the COL (especially Olaf) look really pathetic.

I would say this was achieved. Have you seen any article where the November 11,2017 97-0 UST rout of St. Olaf wasn't mentioned?

St. Olaf really looks pathetic and I can't imagine that maneuvering to change conference bylaws to force the team that quadruple and 2/3 Monkey Stomped them out of the MIAC. Maybe St. Olaf has a pipeline to players who want to be sheltered through their life and eliminating a team that put that bad of a beatdown on the program two years ago seems like the safe harbor community that they want to be part of Um Ya Ya!

In all seriousness we should order MIAC Participation medals and hand them out to the C.O.L. football teams next fall. Who wants in? We could probably do it for about $50-100 a person.

On second thought we go with ribbons...they'll be cheaper...and in reality being cheap is kind of what this is all about.

[OzJohnnie]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

[Flynntowne]

Here's an extremely sensible, reasoned opinion on how to solve the "St. Thomas" problem:
   
   1.   Let Hamline, St.Olaf and Carleton move to the Midwest Conference for football only, just as Macalester did a few years ago. With St. Norbert leaving the MWC for the NACC, the MWC will be down at least one team. Adding three new football teams will allow the MWC to have two seven-team divisions and allow that conference to continue having an "exempt" (from regular season game limits) championship game.

   2.   Allow St. Scholastica to move completely into the MIAC, bringing the MIAC back to seven football schools – and up to 12-14 schools in other sports (allowing for two six- or seven-team divisions in those other sports). The Saints have always wanted to compete in the MIAC anyway and, even though they might start out by getting waxed by the MIAC's elite (in football), their players, alumni and administration have the guts and pride to do something about it (unlike the three MIAC schools mentioned in paragraph 1, above). It's a little more travel for some MIAC schools, but St. John's and Concordia probably wouldn't mind - trading trips to Northfield with a trip to Duluth. Plus, having two divisions in the other sports might make playoffs in those sports more manageable (e.g., having the top three or four teams in each division qualify for the playoffs).

   3.   Convince Augsburg not to vote to oust UST by allowing it to start calling itself the "University of Minnesota at Augsburg" - which is only fitting since it's already impossible to tell where the U. of M. ends and Augsburg begins, anyway. The "big school name" should allow Augsburg to continue recruiting top-notch wrestlers, who will be easily convinced to go there by telling them they'll be wrestling for the "University of Minnesota."

   4.   It sounds like St. Olaf might not be satisfied just by being allowed to move its football team out of the MIAC into a "more competitive" conference like the MWC. So, we should convince St. Olaf to stay in the MIAC for all other sports - and not seek UST's or any other school's ouster - by allowing the Oles for the next five years to play or sing "Ja, vi elsker dette landet" (the Norwegian national anthem) at the beginning of every home athletic event, with live performances by one (or more!) of the school's 147 "world renowned" musical groups.

   5.   Convince St. Mary's and St. Kate's not to seek UST's or any other school's ouster from the MIAC by threatening to have a few St. Ben's students go and beat up every student on those two campuses. Wait a minute! – After all of the events in paragraphs 1-4, above, have transpired, it won't matter what St. Mary's and St. Kate's do; they won't have the votes to force UST's ouster. Oh, well, I say we let the Bennies loose on them anyway and make them pay for their roles in this "MIAC break-up" soap opera. Bennies are tough!

[hazzben]

The goal was always late spring from what I know. Probably needed to get it in the agenda first.

Word was out on TomToss, but not to the broader public. It sounds like someone from UST wisely let a few sympathetic members of the media know the shenanigans that were taking place. Initially to hopefully bring it out into the public eye and garner enough sympathy to prevent ouster. Falling short of that, to control the narrative in such a way that the COL (especially Olaf) look really pathetic.

To that end, KFAN just did a segment today highlighting the stupidity of kicking out a founding member. Especially one that attracts media coverage to the whole league.

Reusse says he got the first call from a longtime basketball coach not from St, Thomas.  I'm guessing it was Guy Kalland.

Was it Barrerio with the rant on the radio?  Since when has KFAN covered the MIAC?  I really like their shows but they don't have anyone that can talk about anything outside the big 4 pro sports. Media coverage goes towards the teams that advance in the playoffs and get on TV, the benefit the other teams get from that coverage is very small.

It was Barrerio. Their knowledge of the situation indicated they spent about 5 minutes researching what was going on.

[johnnie_esq]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

This is spot-on, Oz.  The overall perspective on this situation has gotten far out of whack.

[OldAuggie]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

+k, this sums up the situation pretty well, I had some of these thoughts yesterday but I am glad it was you to put them here for public viewing as I am sure half the Twin Cities media is looking (jk). Thanks OzJohnnie.

[MIAC23]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

Nice! Pretty much spot on!

[GoldandBlueBU]

It was Barrerio. Their knowledge of the situation indicated they spent about 5 minutes researching what was going on.

Yeah, it was on the top 5 at 5 a few weeks back for about 2 minutes when this whole thing first became news.  Gaard knew a little more about the MIAC, but as you noted, they both clearly don't care about D3, which is fair given their jobs.

[art76]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

+K - jumping on the bandwagon.

Thanx Frank!

[miac952]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

Only part I might disagree with is the end here Oz. Because of how closed off this has been we do not if UST has shown humility or offered concessions. They may have also told Anderson and his followers to get bent too, but once again, there are firewalls preventing us from knowing any of this. And the media is the media; do not expect humility from Reusse and others. What has been astounding though is the landslide with which side they have all reported from. Chip, Judd, McFeeley, Reusse, and national beats like Football Scoop and D3 have eviscerated the C.O.L. ( )

Regardless of the fate or outcome, I continue to struggle most with the hypocrisy of the guy leading this charge, down on the hill in Northfield. He had Meidt as a head coach under his tenure rolling up scores, bussing kids up from Dade County, and making questionable sportsmanship decisions that make modern day UST look like saints. He has dumped money into athletic facilites and D1 coaches and Athletic Directors at a rate equal to UST.

Hamline and Augsburg - I can empathize and see where they are coming from. Bethel too, although it sounds like they are not a part of this contingent.

St Olaf - This is a complete embarrassment and mockery of their institution based on the above.

[Gregory Sager]

I don't like the COL terminology.  Other than STO who seem in peak whinge mode, I reckon many of these schools have serious issues and legit complaints.  It's just football, remember.  The most expensive sport at a school.  It's one thing to be dominated and another to be run out of business (which I believe is a legit concern for some "COL" members).

I think that many MIAC programs feel that they are taken advantage of in football, rather than partnered with.  It's not just the fact that UST recruits a lot of players, it's the fact that recruiting is seems unfairly competitive and is at the deliberate expense of partner MIAC programs.  I suspect they feel like UST is not merely competitive but is perhaps approaches being uncollaborative, even vindictive, in football.

I suspect it's not just being thrashed on the field, but having it rubbed in the faces of their players and parents.  Anyone should take getting beat, even badly, particularly by programs committed to national competitiveness in this extremely competitive D3 era.  It's a whole 'nother thing to have it rubbed in your face.  Students, parents and alumni would have little interest in paying high fees so that their kids can be punching bags in some juvenile rivalry between coaches.

To be frank, this whole "UST and other high achieving programs are the real victims of these whinging losers" schtick is ludicrous.  The real people getting lost in the shuffle of all this whinging and big-noting are the students and parents going into debt do give themselves a leg up in life.  They don't need to put up with this bulls***t.  And as long as UST and STO and whomever keep carrying on like porkchops then UST will be on a one-way train out of here.  Because UST football success is of zero significance compared to the missions of the liberal arts institutions in Minnesota.

I'm of the strong opinion that UST should stay.  The apparent inability of UST (and the media supporters) to show even an ounce of humility is what will ensure they do not.

This was an almost frighteningly lucid, well-reasoned, and sensible post for this thread.

[hazzben]

Yeah, my beef is with Olaf (and to a lesser extent Mac). I know firsthand the strain the other schools face.

The media's issue is that they only see this from a FB perspective and 97-0 is the easy/lazy be all end all. Hence the articles that talk about Gags & SJU and their lopsided dominance of yesteryear.

I get the tough spot for schools with enrollment and financial concerns.

The issue is that each school has its own motives (as they should). But some of them are far more honorable and honest than others. What doesn't sit well is the threats being issued to other schools. You better vote with us (and possibly outside your best interest as it pertains to UST's membership) or we are gonna leave and blow up the league.

97-0 appears to be a driving factor for Olaf/Anderson. But that doesn't mean Hamline's motives are the same at all. The media's inability to do a deep dive into the real issues means we get an oversimplified narrative where the whole league gets lumped into the 'we just think they're too good so we r gonna boot em' crowd. 

KFAN and Dan B. essentially painted a story of an entire league afraid of UST and in lock step to boot them.