FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[DFWCrufan]

MIAC sources familiar with the Presidents' Council discussions indicate the following institutions planned to leave the conference if UST remained: Augsburg University, Carleton College, Hamline University, Macalester College, St. Catherine University, St. Mary's University, and St. Olaf College. Aside from St. Catherine University, each of these institutions competes against SJ2 and would therefore have an interest in the size of its athletic programs. 

The relevant institutions are led by the following individuals. I've included their terminal degrees, which are mostly in the Humanities. None appear to have been student athletes; little indicates they've ever prioritized developing leaders through athletics. Does this information tell us anything about the value they might place on competitive athletics?

Augsburg University: Paul C. Pribbenow, PhD in Social Ethics (Chicago)
Carleton College: Steven G. Poskanzer, JD (Harvard)
Hamline University: Fayneese Miller, PhD in Psychology (Texas Christian)
Macalester College: Brian C. Rosenberg, PhD in English (Columbia)
St. Mary's University: Rev. James P. Burns, PhD in Psychology (Northeastern)
St. Olaf College: David R. Anderson, PhD in English (Boston College)

Fayneese Miller got her PhD from a school of not much bigger than UST with as many Rose Bowl wins as the University of Minnesota.

Notice my karma took a hit with this post.  Must be some pain from the 2011 Rose Bowl loss by Wisconsin to little TCU.  Go Frogs!

I have to ask, is there anyone posting or submitting a defense of the leagues actions? Just curious, I've seen the "official" yah yah which gave me an image of a bunch of adults in the fetal position clinging to blankets, but is there anyone else from the programs or the AD's coming forward with their "explanation".

[57Johnnie]

This old Johnnie is grateful for those who gave their lives to keep us free!

Happy Memorial Day

[TheChucker]

Curious if St. Thomas has aspirations to compete in the prestigious UAA. It would seem to fit their ultimate mission and institutional profile, but St. Thomas would probably need to keep improving its academic profile to fit.

Here's an excerpt from the UAA Philosophy Statement:

"The founding members of the UAA are Brandeis University · Boston; Carnegie Mellon University · Pittsburgh; Case Western Reserve University · Cleveland; Emory University · Atlanta; Johns Hopkins University · Baltimore; New York University; the University of Chicago; the University of Rochester; and Washington University in St. Louis.

The participants in this association are private, research institutions in major metropolitan areas, who are committed to the NCAA Division III philosophy. They are similar institutions in many ways. They are research universities with several undergraduate programs and divisions as well as graduate and professional programs. Their academic programs are among the best in the country. Their undergraduate populations are also similar.

Although these institutions do not share a common history or saga, they do share a somewhat similar pattern in their historical development. In their beginnings, they rose from unique educational missions peculiar in many ways to the needs of their local metropolitan areas and founding constituencies. During their early years, they developed reputations in their regions as respected institutions, and more recently, they have gained greater national prominence."

Sounds like UST to me...maybe a little early in its quest.

[Pat Coleman]

UAA members also have to be members in the Association of American Universities, which does not include UST.

https://www.aau.edu/

[sjusection105]

This old Johnnie is grateful for those who gave their lives to keep us free!

Happy Memorial Day

Well said 57
+K

[TheChucker]

UAA members also have to be members in the Association of American Universities, which does not include UST.

https://www.aau.edu/

I didn't see an AAU qualification in the mission docs, but I'm sure it's unspoken as is the Big Ten. That said, Emory was in the conference for 10 years before it gained AAU status and Brandeis gained AAU membership about the same time the UAA conference became official in the 1980s.

St. Thomas is not there yet academically. My question is to whether they are aspirational to that goal.

[MUC57]

 As an old Air Force veteran, I ask that we remember all those who fought and died for our freedoms.
When they were called upon, they gave unselfishly of their time, their energy, and their lives. Wherever they may be, Arlington National Cemetery, a plain above the beaches of Normandy or a remote island in the South Pacific, may they rest in eternal peace!
Job well done! 🇺🇸

[AndOne]

As an old Air Force veteran, I ask that we remember all those who fought and died for our freedoms.
When they were called upon, they gave unselfishly of their time, their energy, and sometimes, too often their lives. Wherever they may be, Arlington National Cemetery, a plain above the beaches of Normandy or a remote island in the South Pacific, may they rest in eternal peace!
Job well done! 🇺🇸

One correction MCU57. Otherwise, perfect. 🏅 🇺🇸

[MUC57]

AndOne

MCU57? How about MUC57. Gotcha! Just kidding. 
Oh - thanks!

[AndOne]

Ya, that guy too! LOL. 

[hazzben]

+K MUC57

Grateful for our freedoms. Reminded they were never free.

[MUC57]

hazzben

Thanks, buddy! 

[hazzben]

From Charley Walters Sunday Pioneer Press column...apparently the MIACowards are already making their case to boot SJU!
https://www.twincities.com/2019/05/25/charley-walters-twins-owner-jim-pohlad-excited-with-a-grain-of-salt/

Jeez, surprise, surprise.

We've had a lot of great discussions here but really this post by Redtooth at the very start of it was pretty much all we needed to know about the St. Thomas situation, and, if the MIAC presidents really show their muscle, the future SJU situation.

April 07, 2019, 02:12:59 pm »
There are so many places to start when discussing the current state of affairs in the MIAC....I know way too much information on this situation....Let me start off by stating the origin of this matter was UST Football's dominance and a real demonization of Glenn Caruso as HC....The fact is, he has developed a nationally relevant, incredibly successful football program.  That coupled with Steve Fritz' wonderful vision as AD to excel as a total program....they invested and committed to building a Winning Department.  The bottom half of this league in the meantime has acted as though we are still in the 1970s, and then wondered why student athletes don't go to their schools.  Schools with billion dollar endowments that don't invest in athletics and then bitch when a competitor makes a different investment and commitment decision is the absolute definition of hypocrisy.

What the Presidents are now engaged in doing with the bylaws (modifying to create an Enrollment cap that would only impact one school) has been done under the cover of darkness amongst the like-minded schools....If successful, they will utilize the same strategy to eliminate any school that deviates from the clustering of mediocrity they so desire...SJU will be a next target, guaranteed!

Only good thing is most of what is being proposed is likely not supported legally and could be tied up in the courts.. Removing UST would not make the league stronger or better.

This has gotten out of control. Also, several Johnnies (SFury, Duff, Redtooth, etc.) have acknowledged the lunacy, even though it targeted UST.

Several others have seemed to care little since it targeted UST. How quickly the tune changes if SJU finds itself in the crosshairs.

Reminds me of the famous quote:
First they came for the Communists Tommies
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Communist Tommie
Then they came for the Socialists Johnnies
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Socialist Johnnie
Then they came for the trade unionists Royals
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a trade unionist Royal
Then they came for the Jews Cobbers
And I did not speak out
Because I was not a Jew Cobber
Then they came for me
And there was no one left
To speak out for me

NB: The MIAC situation isn't even close to the seriousness of the issue the quote refers to. At the end of the day, we are talking about collegiate athletics, not the internment and murder of innocent groups of people.

But it does seem analogous in the sense that the "Mission for MIAC Mediocrity" is developing and far from having run its course. The more truth that comes to the light about the process and motives, the more I wish there was an alternative option for the MIAC schools that have the will to compete.

As someone mentioned earlier, woulda, coulda, shoulda, on UST, SJU, Bethel, Concordia, GAC proactively sticking to their guns. However, there was a bluff to be called, especially in regards to where on earth Hamline, Augsburg, St. Mary's, and St. Kate's thought they were gonna find a conference when the dust settled.

[AndOne]

Curious if St. Thomas has aspirations to compete in the prestigious UAA. It would seem to fit their ultimate mission and institutional profile, but St. Thomas would probably need to keep improving its academic profile to fit.

Here's an excerpt from the UAA Philosophy Statement:

"The founding members of the UAA are Brandeis University · Boston; Carnegie Mellon University · Pittsburgh; Case Western Reserve University · Cleveland; Emory University · Atlanta; Johns Hopkins University · Baltimore; New York University; the University of Chicago; the University of Rochester; and Washington University in St. Louis.

The participants in this association are private, research institutions in major metropolitan areas, who are committed to the NCAA Division III philosophy. They are similar institutions in many ways. They are research universities with several undergraduate programs and divisions as well as graduate and professional programs. Their academic programs are among the best in the country. Their undergraduate populations are also similar.

Although these institutions do not share a common history or saga, they do share a somewhat similar pattern in their historical development. In their beginnings, they rose from unique educational missions peculiar in many ways to the needs of their local metropolitan areas and founding constituencies. During their early years, they developed reputations in their regions as respected institutions, and more recently, they have gained greater national prominence."

Sounds like UST to me...maybe a little early in its quest.

Probably need to keep improving? Seems that needs to be changed to "certainly needs to keep improving."

The US News & World Report annually ranks universities/colleges according to the type of school they are. All of the founding UAA schools named above and UST are classified as National Universities.
The rankings are accompanied by a score of X out of 100 to indicate their relative strength.
The 2019 scores for the above UAA schools are as follows:

Brandeis 69
Carnegie Mellon 74
Case Western 66 (lowest)
Emory 79
Johns Hopkins 90
NYU 71
Chicago 94
Rochester 70
Wash U 82

UST's score is 46, 20 points lower than the lowest ranked UAA school. So yes, if UST aspires to higher academic prestige on a national basis, it is definitely a little early in their quest to reach the lofty academic status of the UAA.

A more realistic path would seem to be either exploring membership in the WIAC if they desire to remain at the D3 level, or perhaps making the jump to D2. D3 wise, UST's size and academics would seem to pretty closely parallel with the WIAC institutions. With their size and location, it would not be surprising if they were successful at the D2 level should they aspire to compete at that level.

[hazzben]

@AndOne

I don't disagree that UST isn't in the league of the UAA schools academically. Nor would any sane Tommie for that matter. But US New & World Report is not the source that will convince me. Their methodology is roundly criticized, even by the 'elite schools' who tend to do best in the rankings.