FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[OzJohnnie]

OTT?  If I were perfect then my name would be more famous.  Apologies for the blast of rightousness.

[Willy Wonka]

Oh, so wait, let me get this straight:

1.  You, a Johnnie fan, unbiased in your observation say he was down  ...
(Side Note: I also love how every fan at a controversial goal line game was "standing on the Goal line."  So either you had x-ray vision and could see through the official who should have been standing over the goal line during the play, OR the ref you sight for your evidence was out of position and you had a view right down the goal line OR you were "on the goal line" but evidently not right on top of it because the ref was actually in position)

2.  The Johnnie players after the game said he was down!      Oh, well in that case, there would be no need to ask any of the Tommie players what they thought happened on the play.  I mean, its not like any of those Johnnie players had a stake in the play!?!

3.  The refs, who made a call that favored your team, didn't tell you after the game "Yeah, actually we blew the call on the goal line.  The Tommie was in, they should have won, just don't tell anyone we made a mistake."  And yes, he may have even "crossed the goal line" after he was whistled down, but that doesn't answer the real question at hand.  WAS HE ACTUALLY DOWN??

All three lines of your evidence have gaping holes ROR.  Granted, the refs could really have felt they made the right call, but all the video and picture evidence I have seen seems to indicate either inconclusively or in favor of the Tommies.  I have yet to see any hard evidence in favor of the Johnnies.  Not to mention, every time I talk to an unbiased fan who has seen the film or the photos, they conclude USTD got screwed.

All that to say, I love the fact that SJU 'beat' USTD.  While I am no Johnnies fan, I can't stand the Tommies.  I love the fact that for the first time in a decade the Tommies actually beat the Johnnies on the field and they still can't claim a 'W' in the column. 

Here's to hoping their is another massively controversial call at the end of this years game, just to salt the wound and wind up the whiners!

You say all three lines have gaping holes, but it is the same hole you refer to every time: ROR is a liar because he supports the Johnnies.  In fact, your argument is, knowing nothing about ROR at all, that he must be a liar since it is, according to you, in his interest to lie.  Your assumption is that his support for St John's trumps his commitment to other principles such as honesty and integrity.  Of course, since you know little about him personally, you have nothing to base that judgment on other than your own character.

You may not have intended to call him a liar, but you did.  Should we all pack up and go home since no honest statement can be made on these boards unless it is not in our interest (according to you)?

Sigh.

Papa Wonka has known ROR since his high school days. He insists that calling the creepy photog a liar is not only logical, it's recommended. I'm sure he's got a few good examples in the old Anoka yearbooks

Duffman - Will I cheer for the Tommies or Johnnies? That's like asking me to hang out with TDT or finsleft — neither one is a particularly good option. Can't I just hang out with Veek instead? He at least provides me with beverages and a detailed scouting report of the local Bennies...

[OleHog74]

BLASPHEMY!  Say what you will about our football team, but NEVER insult our church coffee!

I have never been happier I am Lutheran and thus went to Olaf.

Well yeah, plus you have your jello and your weak, church-basement coffee. 

[corn horn]

Why the hell are we still dwelling on a game from last year?  And why are we hyping a game in mid-October?  For all we know, UST and SJU could both be 1-5 at that time 

Touche, DuffMan!

Tommy people...please, learn to take a deep breath and let it go. Understand that that is how it is when you play the Johnnies. To win, you not only have to beat the team, but also override the black hole that seemingly guards our Collegeville compatriots, sucking sure victory from many a foe in a most unglorious, unfathomable and gut-curdling way. You have to WIN to win. When you don't, you use it for fuel next time.

Now, think 2009.

Breathe in...breathe out. There, isn't that better already.

[tmerton]

AO, we worry about every team we play.  Except Northwestern.

[ARodsPACK]

[Kestrel if you really knew Fins, you would find this funny...yes it touches a nerve if you are a UWRF fan, otherwise its the type of banter we expect...you of course had to go below the belt the with pedophile comments taking it to a lower level, well done.

This is funny?  Finsleft has already distinguished himself as a cheap, obnoxious, arrogant liar as I documented earlier and then he appeared to refute (this is where the lying comes in).  This was difficult to determine since he cannot communicate in sentences.  Then it appears the twit tweeted the same things he denies.  So he has no values or redeeming qualities from what I can see of this individual.

Okay, I can see why you find him so adorable. 

I'm sure you all have a great time laughing at him in Collegeville.  My point is that when you take him out in public, follow the leash laws and keep him in the designated areas.  This way he won't annoy everyone else.   And don't forget to bring the bags to pick up after him.

[johnnie_esq]

It's much simpler than that esq:  I believe the referee could see the ball cross the line.  They made the wrong call, life goes on.  This year's matchup should be a good one. 

The continued need for football education by AO never ceases to amaze me....the perspective of the referee on the play in question is irrelevant as he is standing behind the offense, not on the goal line.  The only officials that have standing and are on position to make that call are the Side Judge and the Head Linesman.  Neither made the call....get over it.

With all due respect to the fresh love for UST.....this is not the first time the team has been blessed with some talent.  In the early part of this decade; they had a great QB, the fastest WR in the conference and the best RB (in terms of career yards at the time) all on the field at once and were unable to win the conference.  Let's play the season and see if being a target is as easy as sneaking up on everyone.

ooooh you got me, nobody has ever called the head linesman a referee.    my bad.   as a more serious reply, doesn't the line judge also have the ability to make the call?

AO, it is the linesman and side judge's responsibility to make that call.  It's theirs to make, not the referee's, umpire's, back judge's or anyone else's.   You are calling them a straight out liar, though, with intent to harm the Toms.  That's pretty brutal.

Point here is that an official is not going to make a game-winning decision on something that he cannot see for himself.  On first and goal from the one, he isn't going to call a TD on a running back into the pile unless the official can clearly see the ball cross the goal line-- he'll blow it dead when the RB's progress has stopped and give them another chance to clearly put it in the endzone.  And do it even quicker when the clock is running out.  So even if it were close-- UST should have known by running it up the middle that the officials can likely only see it as "close" and "close doesn't count".  That's a playcalling issue-- not a maligned official issue.

We all want it this way.  We like officials who only enforce what they see-- not what they think they see or expect to see. 

And calling that crew out as liars is pretty bold.  So you know, that crew also does Big Ten games-- so they are pretty highly trained and held in great esteem by the NCAA.  So blowing a call at the D-3 level is worth what for them?  Potentially losing the ability to officiate Ohio State the following week?   

[OzJohnnie]

ARod'sPACKAGE;

ok, I can see that fins made you angry.  I can understand why as well, since you don't deny the content of his claimsn but you're merely unhappy with the way they were delivered.  Yes, truth can be painful.  Perhaps fins should consider a more gentlemanly manner, but then it would be less funny.  You're going on like some one that lost a cowbell.  Good news is there are a few 'girls' wandering around RF that could spare one.  Blasted bells sounded like a Jenny Craig failures convention over the radio.

[DuffMan]

Arod,

Did you seriously create a d3football.com account just to complain about Finsleft?  Get over it

[DutchFan2004]

Arod,

Did you seriously create a d3football.com account just to complain about Finsleft?  Get over it

The only bad thing about Fins is that he doesn't have more of his great jokes.   

[AO]

It's much simpler than that esq:  I believe the referee could see the ball cross the line.  They made the wrong call, life goes on.  This year's matchup should be a good one. 

The continued need for football education by AO never ceases to amaze me....the perspective of the referee on the play in question is irrelevant as he is standing behind the offense, not on the goal line.  The only officials that have standing and are on position to make that call are the Side Judge and the Head Linesman.  Neither made the call....get over it.

With all due respect to the fresh love for UST.....this is not the first time the team has been blessed with some talent.  In the early part of this decade; they had a great QB, the fastest WR in the conference and the best RB (in terms of career yards at the time) all on the field at once and were unable to win the conference.  Let's play the season and see if being a target is as easy as sneaking up on everyone.

ooooh you got me, nobody has ever called the head linesman a referee.    my bad.   as a more serious reply, doesn't the line judge also have the ability to make the call?

AO, it is the linesman and side judge's responsibility to make that call.  It's theirs to make, not the referee's, umpire's, back judge's or anyone else's.   You are calling them a straight out liar, though, with intent to harm the Toms.  That's pretty brutal.

Point here is that an official is not going to make a game-winning decision on something that he cannot see for himself.  On first and goal from the one, he isn't going to call a TD on a running back into the pile unless the official can clearly see the ball cross the goal line-- he'll blow it dead when the RB's progress has stopped and give them another chance to clearly put it in the endzone.  And do it even quicker when the clock is running out.  So even if it were close-- UST should have known by running it up the middle that the officials can likely only see it as "close" and "close doesn't count".  That's a playcalling issue-- not a maligned official issue.

We all want it this way.  We like officials who only enforce what they see-- not what they think they see or expect to see. 

And calling that crew out as liars is pretty bold.  So you know, that crew also does Big Ten games-- so they are pretty highly trained and held in great esteem by the NCAA.  So blowing a call at the D-3 level is worth what for them?  Potentially losing the ability to officiate Ohio State the following week?   

The side judge lines up in the defensive backfield and watches for pass interference.  The head linesman makes the line calls.
I do not think it was a malicious lying call.  It was merely a bad call.  Regardless of how often officials make a similar call does not excuse it.  A tough call to make, but one that should have been made in the Tommies favor.  I really doubt the johnnie faithful would have argued the call much if it had gone the other way.  On to week 2....

[DuffMan]

Looking through the SJU/UWEC game notes, I see that each team has a 6'9" starting offensive lineman  

[DustySJU]

Check out the traffic updates to Saturday's Johnnie/BluGold tilt at www.johnniefootball.com

It'll be a meet and greet for some folks.

Developing...

[jelio101]

Cobbernation, I hope you enjoyed the Cobbers' win over Willamette.  I don't mean to call you out publicly, but did we ever settle our bet?  I honestly don't remember.  I'm not going to be able to make the trip to Mick's this year (damn weddings on Johnnie/Cobber weekend, who does that?).  Are you planning on making a trip to Collegeville this season?

TC,

You don't remember me bringing your case to Collegeville at last year's SJU/Cobber game.  First I had to bypass the campus security where they said "There is no alcohol allowed on campus."  Thanks to my quick wits, I responded by saying I owe this case to a Johnnie and we are not going to drink it here.  I had to do anything so I could have a s-fest burger cooked by JR.  Yes the bet is settled.  I might be making a trip up to SJU country later this fall with some johnnie friends.  I will most likely be at the Johnnie/Cobber game next saturday and TC the game is at 1 pm and the bride and groom have to idea if you come to the ceremony or not.  They only see you at the reception.  Sounds like I will see you in Moorhead!

I agree, this game is going to be huge.... no excuses!!  Unless you are in the wedding party.  Hey cobbernation whose running the show this year?  loving the 'MIAC men of genius' brilliant stuff

[hazzben]

Oh, so wait, let me get this straight:

1.  You, a Johnnie fan, unbiased in your observation say he was down  ...
(Side Note: I also love how every fan at a controversial goal line game was "standing on the Goal line."  So either you had x-ray vision and could see through the official who should have been standing over the goal line during the play, OR the ref you sight for your evidence was out of position and you had a view right down the goal line OR you were "on the goal line" but evidently not right on top of it because the ref was actually in position)

2.  The Johnnie players after the game said he was down!      Oh, well in that case, there would be no need to ask any of the Tommie players what they thought happened on the play.  I mean, its not like any of those Johnnie players had a stake in the play!?!

3.  The refs, who made a call that favored your team, didn't tell you after the game "Yeah, actually we blew the call on the goal line.  The Tommie was in, they should have won, just don't tell anyone we made a mistake."  And yes, he may have even "crossed the goal line" after he was whistled down, but that doesn't answer the real question at hand.  WAS HE ACTUALLY DOWN??

All three lines of your evidence have gaping holes ROR.  Granted, the refs could really have felt they made the right call, but all the video and picture evidence I have seen seems to indicate either inconclusively or in favor of the Tommies.  I have yet to see any hard evidence in favor of the Johnnies.  Not to mention, every time I talk to an unbiased fan who has seen the film or the photos, they conclude USTD got screwed.

All that to say, I love the fact that SJU 'beat' USTD.  While I am no Johnnies fan, I can't stand the Tommies.  I love the fact that for the first time in a decade the Tommies actually beat the Johnnies on the field and they still can't claim a 'W' in the column. 

Here's to hoping their is another massively controversial call at the end of this years game, just to salt the wound and wind up the whiners!

You say all three lines have gaping holes, but it is the same hole you refer to every time: ROR is a liar because he supports the Johnnies.  In fact, your argument is, knowing nothing about ROR at all, that he must be a liar since it is, according to you, in his interest to lie.  Your assumption is that his support for St John's trumps his commitment to other principles such as honesty and integrity.  Of course, since you know little about him personally, you have nothing to base that judgment on other than your own character.

You may not have intended to call him a liar, but you did.  Should we all pack up and go home since no honest statement can be made on these boards unless it is not in our interest (according to you)?

Sigh.

Wow...all I can say is wow...

Nowhere in that post do I call ROR a liar or insinuate that he was.  All I stated is the simple reality that he is a Johnnie fan, and like the Johnnie players, has a natural bias to seeing a controversial call in favor of his team. 

I'm not saying he's lying about what he thinks happened.  I'm not saying the Johnnie players are lying about what they think happened.  I'm not saying the Tommie players are lying about what they think happened.  All I'm saying is there are holes in the logic due to the bias of the people he's citing for evidence.

In no way, shape or form does what I wrote insinuate that he's a liar.  Does it make him a fan with a stake in the call, yes.  I'm sure ROR is a fine human being, I actually think I've met him at a few Stift tailgates.  But lets not pretend anyone cheering for one team has a totally neutral opinion in these matters.

If we want to talk about integrity and honesty, how about not completely going off the handle and read something into my post that was never there to begin with.

Come on Oz, you were absolutely, totally putting words in my mouth.  But wow, talk about stirring the pot...