FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[miac952]

I'm told Glenn was introduced on field before the Vikings game. When it comes to coming up short, UST football & the Vikings have more in common than just the color purple.

Glenn must be absolutely exhausted because he has been running through your mind for a few months now. You post twice as much about him than your alma mater.

[sfury]

Good article by Reusse this morning. Much to think about.

http://www.startribune.com/tommies-rest-of-miac-have-same-challenge-they-have-to-get-better/363026221/

Patrick should have had someone proof read it for him.  I'm not an English or Journalism major but I can see where there are words missing in the story.  He claims in the story that he did a read through looking for errors...oops.

"I don't the complainers have been St. John's fans. It's more the do-gooders, people who think if St. Thomas beats Carleton 80-3, it is Caruso's problem, not Carleton's."

.
What gets me was the speed. I knew it would be elevated from Mount, but it really wasn't close. And this was a UST defense that was considered very fast. They looked very pedestrian last night. And what does that say for the Confernce. I think it validates teams having to dabble outside the state for guys here and there because you can't match a team with Ohio as its primary recruiting grounds and Florida as its secondary market. I don't know that MN high school football can give you that. Not suggesting Meidt style recruiting, but Fasching and Caruso going after guys out of state that are the right fit here and there makes sense

Great point.  No doubt speed makes a huge difference. UMU and some other programs have been able to tap into Florida and other areas and secure some gifted and fast athletes to complement their normal recruiting bases.

Congrats UST on a great playoff run.

I'm not sure if UST needs to look too far from home, as they can find some good athletes in the Chicago area. I believe this is where UWW gets a lot of their players. In the past few years, UST has been hitting this area pretty hard as well.

I've also noticed that a few JUCO kids have been following UST's twitter page this year. It will be interesting to see if some of them transfer to UST next season.

A few years ago I mentioned a desire for SJU to recruit more JUCO players. I say that partly because I was a Juco'er myself before transferring to St. John's so have a soft spot. There are a lot of really good players at that level who could immediately help MIAC teams when they transfer. Especially in today's world of ludicrous college costs you'll have a lot of kids going to JUCOs because of financial reasons. Has nothing to do with grades or anything like that (obviously there are kids who do go there because of that but plenty don't). I think many MIAC teams, whether at the top or bottom of the conference, could benefit.

[faunch]

Good article by Reusse this morning. Much to think about.

http://www.startribune.com/tommies-rest-of-miac-have-same-challenge-they-have-to-get-better/363026221/

Patrick should have had someone proof read it for him.  I'm not an English or Journalism major but I can see where there are words missing in the story.  He claims in the story that he did a read through looking for errors...oops.

"I don't the complainers have been St. John's fans. It's more the do-gooders, people who think if St. Thomas beats Carleton 80-3, it is Caruso's problem, not Carleton's."

.
What gets me was the speed. I knew it would be elevated from Mount, but it really wasn't close. And this was a UST defense that was considered very fast. They looked very pedestrian last night. And what does that say for the Confernce. I think it validates teams having to dabble outside the state for guys here and there because you can't match a team with Ohio as its primary recruiting grounds and Florida as its secondary market. I don't know that MN high school football can give you that. Not suggesting Meidt style recruiting, but Fasching and Caruso going after guys out of state that are the right fit here and there makes sense

Great point.  No doubt speed makes a huge difference. UMU and some other programs have been able to tap into Florida and other areas and secure some gifted and fast athletes to complement their normal recruiting bases.

Congrats UST on a great playoff run.

I'm not sure if UST needs to look too far from home, as they can find some good athletes in the Chicago area. I believe this is where UWW gets a lot of their players. In the past few years, UST has been hitting this area pretty hard as well.

I've also noticed that a few JUCO kids have been following UST's twitter page this year. It will be interesting to see if some of them transfer to UST next season.

A few years ago I mentioned a desire for SJU to recruit more JUCO players. I say that partly because I was a Juco'er myself before transferring to St. John's so have a soft spot. There are a lot of really good players at that level who could immediately help MIAC teams when they transfer. Especially in today's world of ludicrous college costs you'll have a lot of kids going to JUCOs because of financial reasons. Has nothing to do with grades or anything like that (obviously there are kids who do go there because of that but plenty don't). I think many MIAC teams, whether at the top or bottom of the conference, could benefit.

I'll play a little bit of devil's advocate on this one.
Having been around a high school program for number of years I believe there a many reasons that student / athletes attend a JUCO school.

In no particular order.
1.  A player that didn't get recruited to play D1 FBS / FCS or D2 ball and is still holding out hope for an "offer."
2.  Academic issues that precluded them from being eligible to play college ball.  Many of these kids are chuckle heads that really aren't good candidates for the academic rigors of an MIAC school.
3.  Financial issues.

I agree there are JUCO players that could really contribute to teams in the MIAC.
The problem is that many of these kids will not meet entrance requirements to most of the MIAC schools.  Combine that with tuition and room and board that range from $44-53K.  It's highly unlikely that many of these kids will play in the MIAC. 
http://www.startribune.com/minnesota-private-colleges-try-to-soften-the-sticker-shock/333639781/

I know that MIAC schools provide financial assistance but how much aid is a kid that had academic difficulties throughout high school going to qualify for?  And how many JUCO credits are going to transfer to U$T, BU, SJU or any of the other MIAC schools.  And if the kid did get in would he attend and play for another 2-3 years?  Even with some financial aid he would still likely rack up $20-40 or more in debt. 


Maybe I'm wrong and I'm generalizing based on kids that I know have played JUCO ball. 
IMO a kid that went to a JUCO because of academic issues in high school isn't likely to qualify for

[stanbob]

Two extra years to reach maturity makes a world of difference for some folks, I would have been one of them..., I better clarify, not as a athlete but student wise.

[OzJohnnie]

Two extra years to reach maturity makes a world of difference for some folks, I would have been one of them..., I better clarify, not as a athlete but student wise.

Hey, Stanbob, it's good to see you drop by. It's been a while since you last posted.

I agree on maturity.

[OzJohnnie]

For those looking to while away a few hours, I've found a YouTube channel where someone has loaded quite a few hHawthorn games, mostly Grand Finals, with different commentaries in full 1080p HD. One game he loaded is the 2013 Preliminary Final against Geelong. It was a hard game right to the end.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=M4aie1NeYew

[sfury]

Faunch, good points, but I do think you're leaning a little too much on the JUCO/Community TV show stereotypes.

I've been around junior college athletics for a long time because of family involvement and have known a lot of kids who could have done great at MIAC schools, and some who have gone on. And that's just ones I've known personally, obviously countless more out there who would be in similar boat.

Most of my experience involves hoops, but I think while with football you might have a few more academically challenged folks, because there's larger numbers you're also inevitably going to have kids who would be good candidates in that sport as well. Just thinking of my hoops teams at Worthington CC. The starting five all went on and played college hoops, and four of them were outstanding students, definitely would have been fine at MIAC. I was sixth man, tried out for team, would have been JV, quit, which I regret, even though it did help lead to an IM dynasty led by our own coach, Robert Zimmerman. Academically, I think if a kid proves he's a good student at a JUCO over two years he's going to be absolutely fine at MIAC. It's not MIT. Just with me, I had no trouble because like at WCC, at SJU I was primarily writing papers. Testing was fine. My GPA was same at both places. Now obviously Sciences and Math would have been horrific for me at SJU but they were at Worthington too. In other words, if a kid is a really good math and science student at a juco, he's going to do fine, in most cases, at MIAC school. They prove over those two years that they can do it and want to do it.

Now, many prove they can't really do it, they skate by with Cs (or worse) in juco, which means they would not be good candidates for MIAC. No doubt about that.

Financially of course it is still going to be a huge burden for two years but again, just from personal experience, many families are much more willing to take that bite for two years compared to four. If they have proven themselves academically, they should be able to get some help financially. It might have changed in 18 years but for me the credits were easily transferrable. I arrived to SJU as a junior, which I was, even if they did put me in sophomore housing. D'oh. I did have to take one cake summer class at MSU after junior year to make sure I was fully caught up.

And location decides the situation for a lot of juco kids. Depending on the school. Worthington gets a ton of kids from s'west Minnesota (being from Janesville I was furthest away; now the men's team recruits from across the nation but that's coaching change and change in philosophy). For two years those kids did want some comfort and to be close to home but they were more than capable of playing at a D3 or NAIA school and in many cases D2. And academically they were outstanding. So after two years, though, many of those kids are now ready to expand horizons a bit and maybe go to Central Minnesota or the Cities, etc.

Again, I'm not saying some MIAC team is going to become all powerful if they become the dominant pipeline for JUCO schools. But I think there are some players who go missing that could make tremendous contributions, and with the increased emphasis on recruiting at SJU, for instance, I hope those types of kids get a bit more attention. The ones who are fine academically and have proven it for two years, are willing to take on financial burden for two years if not four, and athletically are more than capable of helping out. And just from a physical standpoint, they've matured those two years, compared to high school kids coming in.

[D O.C.]

Most of my experience involves hoops, but I think while with football you might have a few more academically challenged folks

Not a stereotype.

[badgerwarhawk]

Good article by Reusse this morning. Much to think about.

http://www.startribune.com/tommies-rest-of-miac-have-same-challenge-they-have-to-get-better/363026221/

Patrick should have had someone proof read it for him.  I'm not an English or Journalism major but I can see where there are words missing in the story.  He claims in the story that he did a read through looking for errors...oops.

"I don't the complainers have been St. John's fans. It's more the do-gooders, people who think if St. Thomas beats Carleton 80-3, it is Caruso's problem, not Carleton's."

.
What gets me was the speed. I knew it would be elevated from Mount, but it really wasn't close. And this was a UST defense that was considered very fast. They looked very pedestrian last night. And what does that say for the Confernce. I think it validates teams having to dabble outside the state for guys here and there because you can't match a team with Ohio as its primary recruiting grounds and Florida as its secondary market. I don't know that MN high school football can give you that. Not suggesting Meidt style recruiting, but Fasching and Caruso going after guys out of state that are the right fit here and there makes sense

Great point.  No doubt speed makes a huge difference. UMU and some other programs have been able to tap into Florida and other areas and secure some gifted and fast athletes to complement their normal recruiting bases.

Congrats UST on a great playoff run.

I'm not sure if UST needs to look too far from home, as they can find some good athletes in the Chicago area. I believe this is where UWW gets a lot of their players. In the past few years, UST has been hitting this area pretty hard as well.

I've also noticed that a few JUCO kids have been following UST's twitter page this year. It will be interesting to see if some of them transfer to UST next season.

A few years ago I mentioned a desire for SJU to recruit more JUCO players. I say that partly because I was a Juco'er myself before transferring to St. John's so have a soft spot. There are a lot of really good players at that level who could immediately help MIAC teams when they transfer. Especially in today's world of ludicrous college costs you'll have a lot of kids going to JUCOs because of financial reasons. Has nothing to do with grades or anything like that (obviously there are kids who do go there because of that but plenty don't). I think many MIAC teams, whether at the top or bottom of the conference, could benefit.

I'll play a little bit of devil's advocate on this one.
Having been around a high school program for number of years I believe there a many reasons that student / athletes attend a JUCO school.

In no particular order.
1.  A player that didn't get recruited to play D1 FBS / FCS or D2 ball and is still holding out hope for an "offer."
2.  Academic issues that precluded them from being eligible to play college ball.  Many of these kids are chuckle heads that really aren't good candidates for the academic rigors of an MIAC school.
3.  Financial issues.


I agree there are JUCO players that could really contribute to teams in the MIAC.
The problem is that many of these kids will not meet entrance requirements to most of the MIAC schools.  Combine that with tuition and room and board that range from $44-53K.  It's highly unlikely that many of these kids will play in the MIAC. 
http://www.startribune.com/minnesota-private-colleges-try-to-soften-the-sticker-shock/333639781/

I know that MIAC schools provide financial assistance but how much aid is a kid that had academic difficulties throughout high school going to qualify for?  And how many JUCO credits are going to transfer to U$T, BU, SJU or any of the other MIAC schools.  And if the kid did get in would he attend and play for another 2-3 years?  Even with some financial aid he would still likely rack up $20-40 or more in debt. 


Maybe I'm wrong and I'm generalizing based on kids that I know have played JUCO ball. 
IMO a kid that went to a JUCO because of academic issues in high school isn't likely to qualify for

I would just add a fourth that I've been aware of  which would be maturity.  Some kids need a year or two to get bigger, stronger, faster, whatever.  Some probably also fall into the "holding out" category but I've been aware of a couple of athletes who wanted to play collegiately (sp?)  and who went this route just to grow up some. 

[OzJohnnie]

Saw it. Was good. Worth the ticket price.

The stain of Jar Jar Binks has been erased.

[SJUrube]

Re: JUCOs

I saw Rochester CC scrimmage UST a couple of years back. If I have my years right it was 2013 and UST did not make the playoffs that year. However, RCC was totally overmatched and they've typically had a good JC program. It's possible they had a player or two on that team that could contribute to an MIAC team but I didn't see any that day - though I wasn't neccesarly in a scouting mode.

[faunch]

Re: JUCOs

I saw Rochester CC scrimmage UST a couple of years back. If I have my years right it was 2013 and UST did not make the playoffs that year. However, RCC was totally overmatched and they've typically had a good JC program. It's possible they had a player or two on that team that could contribute to an MIAC team but I didn't see any that day - though I wasn't neccesarly in a scouting mode.

Xactly...MIAC / D3 are better off targeting players that went D1 or D2 but overshot their coverage.  Coaches should be keeping tabs on these kids.  Figure out a way to convince them they will have a great time dominating and will get a great education at a D3 school.(SJU!!!!)

[art76]

I would just add a fourth that I've been aware of  which would be maturity.  Some kids need a year or two to get bigger, stronger, faster, whatever.  Some probably also fall into the "holding out" category but I've been aware of a couple of athletes who wanted to play collegiately (sp?)  and who went this route just to grow up some.

This was my experience. Literally, I put on 70 pounds of muscle between the spring of my senior year in high school when I was running the mile and 2 mile in track and the fall of my second (of three years) at Bethel. I went to a school that had no football program, so when I transferred in I was immediately eligible and had three great seasons of D3 football. I was definitely a late bloomer.

[DuffMan]

I remember James Schaefer, a CB off of our 2001 squad, was a transfer from ND State College of Science, but that's the only JUCO guy I can recall at SJU.

[desertcat1]

Maybe they'll let us keep sitting at the cool kids table.' 

So you're saying we're the cool kids?!

Clearly in Linfield's mind 

And just for the record DC1 & DOC, I'm a Bethel alum/fan, not a UST backer. But even through my Royal tinted glasses it was obnoxious yesterday. A post or two, fine, whatever.1. But after a dozen, y'all need to get a life.2 Or at least post it on your own board or over on the OAC board (3). I've been on here for quite some time and I don't ever remember the fans of a defeated team setting up camp on another board like that, to take jabs and gloat.(4) That said, I have no delusions about anything I've said affecting your behavior. Self-awareness is a difficult lesson to learn, and if not mastered by the mid-twenties, it's usually a lost cause.

hazzben,   

For the record I disagree with you again 

see if you  can keep up with this ? First bold, (1) I was listening to the game audio and posting as it was being played ..Hence many posts. Which i have done since the cats have entered the Ncaa back in 90's...  (2) I did not get the memo about ONLY posting on MY board .. That's not going to happen unless controlled by The Guru, (which has been done too )
so if you don't like the facts i write about or commit on DON"T read it. 
3. Jabs and Gloat,   I see as FACTS and Commits., that's what i do ,never have been one to color in the lines. NOT just on YOUR board but all the boards..  North, East,South and West.  (4)    Your right here bro  lost cause ,   Sorry Charlie... I still have a seat at the kids table.....   
Better luck next year after your 4-4 MIAC...   Get over it ... This is just a BOARD ... C'mon man.... if it gets to hot in the kitchen get out... 


Mele Kalikimaka