FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[art76]

How many years is St. Thomas already committed to in the MIAC? I know they are on the schedule for this fall (2020), but what's the word for 2021?

[jknezek]

If this is a temporary moratorium, I suspect the most likely path is to put together an independent schedule for one year and keep working the D1 process. The concerns are driven by what should be short term concerns, so if UST had comfort that this would have been approved before, taking an 8-12 year path through D2 doesn't really make sense.

I certainly wouldn't mind jumping to the WIAC instead, as I had noted early on but I don't think that is happening.

I'm going with the first part of this. But I think this crisis, if it drags into football season. will kill UST's shot. They may not seem related, but it's just going to be something no one wants to deal with given everything else that's happening. When you are trying to figure out how to survive you aren't going to devote mental energy to something that seems so far out on the perimeter. While this is important to UST, it's not important to almost ANYONE else in D1 (though maybe of mild importance to one of the welcoming conferences). And it certainly not something most D1 schools want to encourage anyway...

Kill for the long term or delay?
I can certainly see that this COVID impacts the long term landscape of the NCAA and many schools, exacerbating something that has already been there, but I see these D1 proposals as more of a short-term fix. A year from now, if things are back to normal, I don't see why it wouldn't be possible.

And of course the WIAC possibility would have to be a long-term thing. I don't think there is anyway it's going to happen, absolutely not for a 2 year stopover en route to D1.

I don't know. Unsubstantiated opinion: I think  that if something happens to football season revenue at the D1 level, like playing in front of reduced crowds or empty stadiums, this isn't a short term problem. The revenue gap would cause huge problems. If the mid-majors start cutting non-revenue sports beyond the minimum number required, and you know many of the SEC schools will follow so they can devote more resources to revenue sports, it starts to become a self-fulfilling prophecy to keep up.

The PAC-12 is already at a huge disadvantage thanks to their idiot media strategy for example. With all that going on, who is going to focus on a school trying to get an exception to a rule they put in place specifically to prevent more marginal schools from joining DI? I think it's more likely you'll actually see the long rumored split between the Power 5 and the other conferences. And then all the revenue consequences of that will consume people.

UST's issue could easily get tossed to the side simply because it's inconvenient. A victim of bad timing. But who knows? I'm just spitballing.

[jamtod]

If this is a temporary moratorium, I suspect the most likely path is to put together an independent schedule for one year and keep working the D1 process. The concerns are driven by what should be short term concerns, so if UST had comfort that this would have been approved before, taking an 8-12 year path through D2 doesn't really make sense.

I certainly wouldn't mind jumping to the WIAC instead, as I had noted early on but I don't think that is happening.

I'm going with the first part of this. But I think this crisis, if it drags into football season. will kill UST's shot. They may not seem related, but it's just going to be something no one wants to deal with given everything else that's happening. When you are trying to figure out how to survive you aren't going to devote mental energy to something that seems so far out on the perimeter. While this is important to UST, it's not important to almost ANYONE else in D1 (though maybe of mild importance to one of the welcoming conferences). And it certainly not something most D1 schools want to encourage anyway...

Kill for the long term or delay?
I can certainly see that this COVID impacts the long term landscape of the NCAA and many schools, exacerbating something that has already been there, but I see these D1 proposals as more of a short-term fix. A year from now, if things are back to normal, I don't see why it wouldn't be possible.

And of course the WIAC possibility would have to be a long-term thing. I don't think there is anyway it's going to happen, absolutely not for a 2 year stopover en route to D1.

I don't know. Unsubstantiated opinion: I think  that if something happens to football season revenue at the D1 level, like playing in front of reduced crowds or empty stadiums, this isn't a short term problem. The revenue gap would cause huge problems. If the mid-majors start cutting non-revenue sports beyond the minimum number required, and you know many of the SEC schools will follow so they can devote more resources to revenue sports, it starts to become a self-fulfilling prophecy to keep up.

The PAC-12 is already at a huge disadvantage thanks to their idiot media strategy for example. With all that going on, who is going to focus on a school trying to get an exception to a rule they put in place specifically to prevent more marginal schools from joining DI? I think it's more likely you'll actually see the long rumored split between the Power 5 and the other conferences. And then all the revenue consequences of that will consume people.

UST's issue could easily get tossed to the side simply because it's inconvenient. A victim of bad timing. But who knows? I'm just spitballing.

I don't like this scenario but +k for a well-reasoned case.

[wif]

I've wavered between Covid being "overblown" to "it will fundamentally change our society for years to come." On the fundamentally changed side of the ledger, I am concerned for all of college athletics. They've already lost the NCAA basketball tournament, and if they lose significant/all revenue (stadium attendance and TV $$) from football in the fall of 2020, the house of cards could collapse.

I could be wrong, but my impression of the big revenue schools (Texas, Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, etc..) are that they spend it as fast as they bring it in through coaches salaries and facilities. It's not like they have a balance sheet with equity to fall back on to ride out anything like what we are experiencing. If you have a budget with $15 million in expenses, and basically $0 in revenue, and you are a state university (or a private institution with a Board of Trustees concerned about the future), at some point some pretty radical changes (for at least the short term) would have to implemented. "I'm sorry Joe Taxpayer, I know you've been sucking it up for 6 months, your 401K is in shambles, but by golly The Football Coach needs his $5 million salary, even if we aren't playing this year."

The down the line impact is concerning as well, as I believe revenue from the Div 1 mens basketball tourney provides much of the funding for all other NCAA championships at non-revenue sports (see D3 football playoffs). If the kitty is empty due to no revenue, everything is on the table for rationing expenses.

Maybe a vaccine gets developed in the next 3-4 months and all of this goes away, but short of that semi-miracle, I'm having a hard time envisioning college athletics being anything close to business as usual in the fall of 2020.

[OzJohnnie]

SJU Football Leads Division III With 19 Hampshire Honor Society Inductees

Saint John's University led NCAA Division III with 19 student-athletes named to the 2020 National Football Foundation & College Football Hall of Fame Hampshire Honor Society on Wednesday, April 15.

A total of 1,432 student-athletes from 364 schools (FBS, FCS, Division II, Division III and NAIA) qualified for membership in the society's 14th year.

[MUC57]

SJU Football Leads Division III With 19 Hampshire Honor Society Inductees

Saint John's University led NCAA Division III with 19 student-athletes named to the 2020 National Football Foundation & College Football Hall of Fame Hampshire Honor Society on Wednesday, April 15.

A total of 1,432 student-athletes from 364 schools (FBS, FCS, Division II, Division III and NAIA) qualified for membership in the society's 14th year.

o

Oz

That's really quite an honor. Speaks well for a Catholic school in Collegeville, Minn.
No wonder your teams win so much - they're smarter than their opponents!
G'day mate. 🇺🇸 🇦🇺  🍺

[hazzben]

If the moratorium were to gain some legs it would impact Augustana's move as well. D2 would not be a reasonable option for a lot of reasons. Independent D3 or back to the MIAC for another year or two would be the only reasonable options. The WIAC would have no interest in extending a helping hand to take a temporary member for 1-2 years that might take away postseason opportunities for existing members.

And I'm still a little lost on where UST conspired against them MIAC since the announcement Hazzben. ... Plus coaches like Tauer and Caruso have continued to laud the competition and camaraderie for eh conference in the media and on their team social media over the past 12 months.

That view would not be shared by people in MIAC athletic departments.

[SagatagSam]

Rejoin the MIAC.

I'd love to see this. But this would also require St. Olaf, et al Coalition of Losers to agree that they want UST back in.

Fixed it.

[SagatagSam]

If the moratorium were to gain some legs it would impact Augustana's move as well. D2 would not be a reasonable option for a lot of reasons. Independent D3 or back to the MIAC for another year or two would be the only reasonable options. The WIAC would have no interest in extending a helping hand to take a temporary member for 1-2 years that might take away postseason opportunities for existing members.

Augie is in an arguably worse position with respect to making the D1 jump. The Summit League hasn't extended an invite yet, despite the League office being practically on the Augie campus green in Sioux Falls. Plus, Augie has a tiny endowment with which to make this transition ($67 million), especially when compared to U$T's $519 million.

As there is no room in the NSIC (I doubt NSIC wants to become a 15-team conference in football--even after losing SCSU and UM-Crookston--and a 17-team conference in all other sports), UST would likely have to go somewhere else in D2. That's why I think D2 is a highly unlikely path for them.

[OzJohnnie]

I'd love to see this. But this would also require St. Olaf, et al to agree that they want UST back in.

Money, or the lack of it, does wondrous things.  The MIAC was born out of a group of local liberal arts colleges that had found an affordable way to add athletic competition to their curriculum.  The lockdown will put extreme pressure on higher education and if all the MIAC schools survive then big budget DIII sports will not be the same, that's for sure.  A return to a local conference first, perhaps only, and national ambitions second, if at all, is certainly possible I would think.  And if that's the case, the MIAC could very much have a change of heart, as could UST, and a return to the fold may happen.  We would be hack here in 20 years or less but until then...

[Texas Ole]

This could make things really interesting for our friends on the corner of Cretin and Summit:

"A letter from the commissioners of the American Athletic Conference, Mountain West, Mid-American Conference, Sun Belt and Conference USA to NCAA president Mark Emmert asked for temporary relief from financial aid requirements, along with average football attendance. The request was made on behalf of all 350 Division I schools. The commissioners also asked that a moratorium be placed on schools moving into Division I for the length of the waiver."

https://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/29037022/five-fbs-conferences-including-aac-c-usa-ask-ncaa-relax-division-requirements

First the UST to D1 vote gets moved back because of COVID-19, now some schools are looking for a moratorium on transitions to D1.

I think a huge difference is what UST is looking do with its D1 move.  I don't think UST is looking at FBS which helps.  The FBS G5 schools might work to end the FCS schools from playing the "body bag" games, but FBS is very different than FCS.  There are rules that govern FBS that don't govern FCS.  It does mean UST will likely face more scrutiny with its finances in regards to this move.

The G5 schools can struggle with some of the NCAA rules regarding FBS.  Schools like SMU and Rice with large endowments can move through these times with little risk.  Rice has even considered dropping to D3, but baseball runs that school.  There are other schools that struggle financially especially when they have smaller endowment ratios.  There are several who have taken out large amounts of debt to pay for facilities in recent years.  There is a Big 12 school on I35 between DFW and Austin that just announced it was slashing its budget by $80 million.  One of the Dallas radio stations gave the percentage revenue based on ticket sales between college and the NFL.  College needs to host games with fans to make it viable.

I am a big TCU fan.  I remember 25 years ago reading an article about how people were making $25k donations a year for the opportunity to buy certain parking spots for football games.  You can imagine what those numbers are today.  That didn't include the other mandatory donation to buy season tickets.  There are schools that are doing great, but others are struggling.

I've wavered between Covid being "overblown" to "it will fundamentally change our society for years to come." On the fundamentally changed side of the ledger, I am concerned for all of college athletics. They've already lost the NCAA basketball tournament, and if they lose significant/all revenue (stadium attendance and TV $$) from football in the fall of 2020, the house of cards could collapse.

I could be wrong, but my impression of the big revenue schools (Texas, Alabama, Ohio State, Michigan, etc..) are that they spend it as fast as they bring it in through coaches salaries and facilities. It's not like they have a balance sheet with equity to fall back on to ride out anything like what we are experiencing. If you have a budget with $15 million in expenses, and basically $0 in revenue, and you are a state university (or a private institution with a Board of Trustees concerned about the future), at some point some pretty radical changes (for at least the short term) would have to implemented. "I'm sorry Joe Taxpayer, I know you've been sucking it up for 6 months, your 401K is in shambles, but by golly The Football Coach needs his $5 million salary, even if we aren't playing this year."

The down the line impact is concerning as well, as I believe revenue from the Div 1 mens basketball tourney provides much of the funding for all other NCAA championships at non-revenue sports (see D3 football playoffs). If the kitty is empty due to no revenue, everything is on the table for rationing expenses.

Maybe a vaccine gets developed in the next 3-4 months and all of this goes away, but short of that semi-miracle, I'm having a hard time envisioning college athletics being anything close to business as usual in the fall of 2020.

Texas has an endowment that basically prints money, and A$M is not far behind with its endowment.  The problem they have is that state money cannot be used to fund their athletic departments with a few exceptions.  It is not uncommon for a fired coach at one of these schools to be one of the 5 highest paid state employees.  Most of that money comes from boosters and at times just a single booster.  There are plenty of boosters that will pay unbelievable amounts to get their way in those athletic department.  The late Joe Jamail who was known as #1 by athletic department staff once asked how he could get his name on the field at Texas.  All jokes aside there was a check written quickly.  That was one of many checks.  These two schools have boosters where money is no object.  The insanity behind those programs baffles the mind.

As for UST returning to the MIAC it is not going to happen.  Remember it wasn't just a minority of schools that wanted St. Thomas out of the MIAC.  It was almost every school that voted them out of the conference.  St. Thomas has made their move.  They have begun promoting themselves as a D1 program.  They have outgrown the MIAC.  It is time to say  goodbye as they enjoy their courtesy lap thanks to the MIAC. 

[BDB]

If the competition is "name the worst rock song of all time," I'm coming at you with "We Built This City" by Starship every time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1b8AhIsSYQ

Terrible song with terrible lyrics backed up by a terrible video. Let's see someone take on the challenge.

[jknezek]

If the competition is "name the worst rock song of all time," I'm coming at you with "We Built This City" by Starship every time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1b8AhIsSYQ

Terrible song with terrible lyrics backed up by a terrible video. Let's see someone take on the challenge.

"Sussudio", Phil Collins (1985) No one will ever convince me otherwise. It's absolute garbage. The last 2 verses...

"Just say the word
Just, just, just say the word
Ooh hoo just say the word
Su-Su-Sussudio
Su-Sussudio
Ah Su-Sussudio
Su-Sussudio
Sudio
Su-Sussudio
Just say the word
Su-Sussudio
Say the word oh
Just say the word
Just, just, just say the word"

If that doesn't make your brain bleed I don't know what will.

[SagatagSam]

If the competition is "name the worst rock song of all time," I'm coming at you with "We Built This City" by Starship every time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1b8AhIsSYQ

Terrible song with terrible lyrics backed up by a terrible video. Let's see someone take on the challenge.

"Sussudio", Phil Collins (1985) No one will ever convince me otherwise. It's absolute garbage. The last 2 verses...

"Just say the word
Just, just, just say the word
Ooh hoo just say the word
Su-Su-Sussudio
Su-Sussudio
Ah Su-Sussudio
Su-Sussudio
Sudio
Su-Sussudio
Just say the word
Su-Sussudio
Say the word oh
Just say the word
Just, just, just say the word"

If that doesn't make your brain bleed I don't know what will.

[57Johnnie]

If the competition is "name the worst rock song of all time," I'm coming at you with "We Built This City" by Starship every time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1b8AhIsSYQ

Terrible song with terrible lyrics backed up by a terrible video. Let's see someone take on the challenge.

Obviously you have never heard me sing:
Won't You Ride in my Little Red Wagon.