FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[Retired Old Rat]

A nice article on Roste from Bethel (need a subscription or incognito)

https://www.startribune.com/bethel-qb-finds-meaning-in-helping-others-for-60-hours-a-week/600112165/

Very nice article and seems like a great kid.

But I'm even more confused about the MIAC and grad students. Is there not a rule prohibiting grad students from competing?

I'm guessing it's allowed because he is only in his 4th year of eligibility, not his 5th "COVID" year.

[jamtod]

A nice article on Roste from Bethel (need a subscription or incognito)

https://www.startribune.com/bethel-qb-finds-meaning-in-helping-others-for-60-hours-a-week/600112165/

Very nice article and seems like a great kid.

But I'm even more confused about the MIAC and grad students. Is there not a rule prohibiting grad students from competing?

I'm guessing it's allowed because he is only in his 4th year of eligibility, not his 5th "COVID" year.

Maybe but the article also talks about him potentially coming back for another year

[OzJohnnie]

Assuming BU doesn't get the AQ how much, if any, does playing in the Skyline division help or hurt them now (and possibly long term). Northwoods division on pace to see 3/5 with winning records, 1 with a .500 record unless STO pulls the win against GAC. Skyline has BU above .500, with Augsburg and Concordia getting into most likely .500 territory. Current division matchups are Northwoods with an 8-5 record against the Skyline. 3 more cross division matchups that I see: Carleton vs MAC, CSS vs MAC and HU.

I recognize there are some outliers with Augsburg and Carleton having perhaps an above average season with Concordia having a bit of a down one. I imagine CSS will pick up some wins here in the next few seasons though which could play with the spread.

The division structure is a boost to the AQ program's SOS because it will avoid playing the two lowest performing teams in the other division, replacing those games with a non-conference game and a rematch with the top program in the other division.  The top programs will find that their in-conference play doesn't converge to .500 but will instead be meaningfully higher.  It's a killer to the second placed program, though, as two losses kills any post season hopes.  Only a split amongst the top two will get both in.

One more year and then done.  If a high quality squad misses out on post-season opportunities because of the division structure then I think it will almost certainly die an inglorious death.

[Wdavis5]

@Wdavis5;

Did your son get hurt as you suspected?  If so, hopefully not too bad and he's available for this weekend against MAC.


On another note, I noticed that the CSS QB is from Sublimity, Oregon.  I've never heard of the place but it sounds beautiful.

Yes Sir, Torn UCL done for season.

Damn, that's  shame.  I had to look it up to be sure as that's in the elbow and normally a throwing injury.  Odd injury in a football game, I would think.  Anyways, I'm sorry to hear that and wish him a good recovery.

Thank all of you all for the best wishes.  He was trying to get of the block of #3 and went down awkwardly. #3 got a taunting call on it as well.  He will see a specialist tomorrow and we will see for sure. The trainers yesterday was saying UCL so we will get the official word tomorrow. Ill be up there thursday but will only get to watch one son play now.

On the SJU post game radio show, it was speculated that #3 Alston, not known to be a jackass, was trying to inquire about your kid's situation, and the ref interpreted it as taunting.  I have no idea if that's close to being true - I would guess you do, but thought I'd throw that out there if there was doubt in your mind.

Its all good man. My son nor I have any ill feelings about it. Its football stuff happens and it looked like a clean play from #3 on film. He was just bigger and stronger. It does look like he may have flexed over him a tad but again that's football. I feel Ravi did nothing wrong. Hes a baller.

[GoldandBlueBU]

Assuming BU doesn't get the AQ how much, if any, does playing in the Skyline division help or hurt them now (and possibly long term). Northwoods division on pace to see 3/5 with winning records, 1 with a .500 record unless STO pulls the win against GAC. Skyline has BU above .500, with Augsburg and Concordia getting into most likely .500 territory. Current division matchups are Northwoods with an 8-5 record against the Skyline. 3 more cross division matchups that I see: Carleton vs MAC, CSS vs MAC and HU.

I recognize there are some outliers with Augsburg and Carleton having perhaps an above average season with Concordia having a bit of a down one. I imagine CSS will pick up some wins here in the next few seasons though which could play with the spread.

The division structure is a boost to the AQ program's SOS because it will avoid playing the two lowest performing teams in the other division, replacing those games with a non-conference game and a rematch with the top program in the other division.  The top programs will find that their in-conference play doesn't converge to .500 but will instead be meaningfully higher.  It's a killer to the second placed program, though, as two losses kills any post season hopes.  Only a split amongst the top two will get both in.

One more year and then done.  If a high quality squad misses out on post-season opportunities because of the division structure then I think it will almost certainly die an inglorious death.

Yeah - given the reality of the MIAC today, with SJU being a perennial top-10 team, it's going to end up being pretty rare that the MIAC can get 2 playoff teams.  Bethel historically gets the right group of guys together to beat SJU maybe a couple of times in a 10 year run, but outside those years, whether it's bethel or someone else, the high likelihood is that the 2nd place team will have 2 losses to SJU.

[hazzben]

If the league wants to consistently give it's 2nd place team a shot at the playoffs, it will need to dump the MIAC Championship game. Historically, those Pool C MIAC teams have been capable of pretty deep runs. But setting up a scenario where Bethel gets left out because they lost twice to SJU or SJU and Bethel both get poor seeds, because they both are in at 9-1, isn't good for the conference.

No one on the RAC will look at it this way. But if Bethel loses to SJU again, will they look at Wheaton or Whitworth or UWL/UWO or Hardin-Simmons or ... and wonder what would happen if they played NCC, Linfield, UWW, UMHB, Mount, etc. twice? Of course not, and really they can't prognosticate like that. But that's the weird reality of what Bethel's 2nd loss would entail.

[USee]

Your point is related to a conference championship game I know, but Wheaton actually did play NCC twice in 2016. NCC beat Wheaton by 10 in the regular season and finished 10-0 and then played Wheaton in the playoffs where the Thunder prevailed by 17 before falling in the quarters to MHB in Texas

[hazzben]

Your point is related to a conference championship game I know, but Wheaton actually did play NCC twice in 2016. NCC beat Wheaton by 10 in the regular season and finished 10-0 and then played Wheaton in the playoffs where the Thunder prevailed by 17 before falling in the quarters to MHB in Texas

Honestly, I almost wrote that of that list Wheaton is the one I'd view as most likely to win the rematch. Nothing would be guaranteed in any of those 2nd games, even for Bethel and SJU.

[USee]

I agree with you that an MIAC championship game is bad for the league. Not sure what the purpose is. For Power 5 D1 schools there is massive revenue and huge conferences where east plays west so its the only time they face each other.

[Wdavis5]

On the SJU post game radio show, it was speculated that #3 Alston, not known to be a jackass, was trying to inquire about your kid's situation, and the ref interpreted it as taunting.  I have no idea if that's close to being true - I would guess you do, but thought I'd throw that out there if there was doubt in your mind.
[/quote]

Just talked to my boy. He said he thinks Ravi may have flexed a bit LOL but realized he was hurt and started asking if he was ok and was to get up. 

[GoldandBlueBU]

I agree with you that an MIAC championship game is bad for the league. Not sure what the purpose is. For Power 5 D1 schools there is massive revenue and huge conferences where east plays west so its the only time they face each other.

I think part of the intended purpose was to take an additional beatdown out of the schedule for the lower level teams.

In the old MIAC with UST in the league, in the average year there was a significant gap from the top 3 (SJU, UST, BU) to the 4th and 5th place teams, and then a huge gap to the remaining teams, so those lower tier teams were getting crushed in a pretty ugly manner 3x per year by the top 3.  Now with UST gone, the cellar dwellers only have to play SJU or BU, not both, and obviously not all 3.

[Texas Ole]

Does the rest of the MIAC care about the championship game issues enough with regards to playoffs to scrap it?  A few schools might think that leaving it to one game with a team who knows they are in the playoffs might give them the best shot.  It seems that the only 2 schools really concerned about this issue are SJU and Bethel.  I am sure others have a somewhat vested interest, but it is not a primary concern.  Can SJU and Bethel convince the other schools that this championship game is bad for the conference?  The prudent thing would be to let the championship game play out for a few years to see the overall impact.  I don't think it will be as harsh as people imagine when it comes to the tournament.

My guess is there are at least 3 schools that have no desire to eliminate the current format.  I think St. Olaf is probably indifferent due to Lutheran rivalries. 

[hazzben]

Does the rest of the MIAC care about the championship game issues enough with regards to playoffs to scrap it?  A few schools might think that leaving it to one game with a team who knows they are in the playoffs might give them the best shot.  It seems that the only 2 schools really concerned about this issue are SJU and Bethel.  I am sure others have a somewhat vested interest, but it is not a primary concern.  Can SJU and Bethel convince the other schools that this championship game is bad for the conference?  The prudent thing would be to let the championship game play out for a few years to see the overall impact.  I don't think it will be as harsh as people imagine when it comes to the tournament.

My guess is there are at least 3 schools that have no desire to eliminate the current format.  I think St. Olaf is probably indifferent due to Lutheran rivalries.

Word I've heard is that the coaches and AD's are not a fan, and not just at Bethel and SJU. Any team that has post-season aspirations would rather see it done another way. GAC, Cobbers, St. Olaf and Augsburg all care about that, even if they aren't close to making it matter right now. Those teams are more likely to make a run at 9-1 than they are at beating SJU most years. So which is the easiest route to the playoffs? The new way where they either have to beat SJU for the division or in the MIAC Champ Game, or the old format where they have a shot at Pool C with a 1 loss season, or a 3 way tie breaker going their way for the Pool A bid, IMO.

[Texas Ole]

Does the rest of the MIAC care about the championship game issues enough with regards to playoffs to scrap it?  A few schools might think that leaving it to one game with a team who knows they are in the playoffs might give them the best shot.  It seems that the only 2 schools really concerned about this issue are SJU and Bethel.  I am sure others have a somewhat vested interest, but it is not a primary concern.  Can SJU and Bethel convince the other schools that this championship game is bad for the conference?  The prudent thing would be to let the championship game play out for a few years to see the overall impact.  I don't think it will be as harsh as people imagine when it comes to the tournament.

My guess is there are at least 3 schools that have no desire to eliminate the current format.  I think St. Olaf is probably indifferent due to Lutheran rivalries.

Word I've heard is that the coaches and AD's are not a fan, and not just at Bethel and SJU. Any team that has post-season aspirations would rather see it done another way. GAC, Cobbers, St. Olaf and Augsburg all care about that, even if they aren't close to making it matter right now. Those teams are more likely to make a run at 9-1 than they are at beating SJU most years. So which is the easiest route to the playoffs? The new way where they either have to beat SJU for the division or in the MIAC Champ Game, or the old format where they have a shot at Pool C with a 1 loss season, or a 3 way tie breaker going their way for the Pool A bid, IMO.

I think we are probably in agreement on the 3 that like the current format.

Isn't there a formula where previous seasons are applied to the tournament selection process or is that just a rumor I heard?

[USee]

I imagine teams like the Cobbers would rather get lucky and beat SJU/Bethel in a year than have to replay the game again. This seems to put a lock on the NCAA AQ for StJ and Bethel for the foreseeable future.