FB: Minnesota Intercollegiate Athletic Conference

[johnnie_esq]

Esq-I have to disagree with you about Pat and not figuring in this weekend's games. He specifically states that you would have three two loss teams in the playoffs and he names Bethel as one of those teams.

What if Bethel wins and all else stays the same, all of Pat's best guesses, then do we end up with this:

1. UW-Whitewater (A)
2. St. John’s (A)2. Central (A)
3. St. Norbert (A)
4. Bethel (A)
5. SJU (C)
6. Redlands (C)
7. Whitworth (C)
8. Cal Lutheran (A)

With Redlands and Witworth playing each other, UWW and Cal Lut. Then Bethel and SJU can't play each other, so Bethel goes to Central and SJU goes to St. Norberts. Wouldn't be too bad.

Agreed, but I disagree with PC's conclusion that BU would be among the best two loss teams.  I have to think St. Olaf's losses to an undefeated SJU and a bubbling BU beats BU's losses to an undefeated SJU and a mediocre at best BVU.  Their schedules otherwise are pretty much the same, though should BU's win over a very mediocre Simpson team give them a head over STO's win over Valley City State (NAIA)?

Since STO doesn't show up on the regional rankings, I have to think the committee is looking at UWEC pretty strongly here if they win out.  In a head to head comparison, I have to think UWEC looks better than Bethel, so a Bethel loss this weekend, given my reasoning above, should drop BU behind UWEC.

The one thing is for sure, however-- The Oles better be cheering for the Johnnies this weekend-- if BU wins, SJU takes a pool C and St. Olaf's playoff hopes are pretty much over unless some other schools can lose twice this weekend.

The kicker about objective criteria is that it is subjectively weighted.  In other words, they can disregard the Strength of Schedule index; they can pretty much disregard the region opponents; or they can use that almost exclusively.  The committee simply needs to use those criteria to come up with a field.  NCAA rules do not specify how they are to be used, however, so the subjectivity comes into play.

[Pat Coleman]

Agreed, but I disagree with PC's conclusion that BU would be among the best two loss teams.  I have to think St. Olaf's losses to an undefeated SJU and a bubbling BU beats BU's losses to an undefeated SJU and a mediocre at best BVU.  Their schedules otherwise are pretty much the same, though should BU's win over a very mediocre Simpson team give them a head over STO's win over Valley City State (NAIA)?

Their schedules and records are pretty much the same in that scenario, except Bethel beat St. Olaf head to head! Don't forget that important detail.

[johnnie_esq]

Agreed, but I disagree with PC's conclusion that BU would be among the best two loss teams.  I have to think St. Olaf's losses to an undefeated SJU and a bubbling BU beats BU's losses to an undefeated SJU and a mediocre at best BVU.  Their schedules otherwise are pretty much the same, though should BU's win over a very mediocre Simpson team give them a head over STO's win over Valley City State (NAIA)?

Their schedules and records are pretty much the same in that scenario, except Bethel beat St. Olaf head to head! Don't forget that important detail.

Negligible... See Steve Johnson, 1992.   

I further clarified my thoughts on this under the Pool C discussion.  Basically, I am thinking that UWEC should look stronger than both.

[Pat Coleman]

1992 is so irrelevant to the way things are done today it's not even funny. Come on now.

[johnnie_esq]

1992 is so irrelevant to the way things are done today it's not even funny. Come on now.

I know...just enjoyable in light of the relevance of the Johnnie-Bethel game.    Hence the emoticon.

As long as I have you, how are you seeing UWEC head up versus Bethel?  Are you basing that straight up on D3/non D3 wins?  Slippery slope there for the WIAC/MIAC...

[repete]

1992 is so irrelevant to the way things are done today it's not even funny. Come on now.

Hey, it's Bethel week. Esq. would have been disbarred from Johnnie-land had he passed on that shot -- gratuitous and irrelevant or not. +k for the barrister anyway.

[Pat Coleman]

1992 is so irrelevant to the way things are done today it's not even funny. Come on now.

I know...just enjoyable in light of the relevance of the Johnnie-Bethel game.    Hence the emoticon.

As long as I have you, how are you seeing UWEC head up versus Bethel?  Are you basing that straight up on D3/non D3 wins?  Slippery slope there for the WIAC/MIAC...

Yes -- after this week's games get played, if they play out with Bethel losing and UWEC winning, we'll see what the numbers are and they could drop further.

[janesvilleflash]

johnnie_esq- evidently your question is too hard. I've seen it asked in two places now, and no answer, and nobody's ego will let them say "I don't know".

[johnnie_esq]

johnnie_esq- evidently your question is too hard. I've seen it asked in two places now, and no answer, and nobody's ego will let them say "I don't know".

I just think it is ironic that a MIACer is standing up for the WIAC versus anybody not named Mount Union!

It certainly seems like a West region thing because of the historical ties between D-2 NSIC/NCC and WIAC/MIAC/IIAC; not to mention NAIA/NWC.  That's not to say it doesn't happen out East or down South, but given how many WIAC squads had to schedule NSIC/NCC opponents just to get games this year alone, it certainly seems more of an issue out here.  And if WIAC squads are hurt because of it in favor of someone out East, that is a problem.  That it may be Bethel this year certainly benefits the MIAC, but in the long run such a policy hurts the whole region.

[Touchdown Tommy]

johnnie_esq- evidently your question is too hard. I've seen it asked in two places now, and no answer, and nobody's ego will let them say "I don't know".

BOL  8) 8) 8)

[janesvilleflash]

Right esq, the defender of the WIAC. Or could it be that if the UWEC games hurt them, you think WW's loss should drop them and put SJU in the #1 seed?

[Touchdown Tommy]

I received a call last evening from Veek.  Apparently he is 50/50 on being in attendance for the biggest game of the year to date.  Couple this with The Sizzle being up North hunting for wild game and the celebrities are dropping like flies.  I do however have it under good recognizance that Mr. Bethel (cough OneArmedScot cough) will be in the house doing the Gyro Jump from the aluminum bleachers on the Royal side.  I trust Veek will schmooze his way into his first ROAD game appearance of 2007 and pick TDT up around 8am for the trip to Arden Hills (backup plan with TC is pending). 

Ritzy: TDT is a go for the events of Saturday evening.  I trust you have lots of tomfoolery in store.

Dusty: What is the over/under on the number of your brood you'll have in tow on Saturday?

[johnnie_esq]

Right esq, the defender of the WIAC. Or could it be that if the UWEC games hurt them, you think WW's loss should drop them and put SJU in the #1 seed?

Therein lies the slippery slope!   

[Lone Auggie Backer]

Do you put a LB to spy on him? 

I don't know what they're gonna do.  I haven't seen enough of him to know, but I have some idea.  I guarantee they don't put a "spy" on him, though.

With the SJU D pretty solid vs. the run, and with the SJU corners being some of the best in the conference, And, with Bethel's relative lack of production in the passing attack (vs. their strong running attack) If I were the Johnnie D-coordinator, I would walk one safety into the box, essentially playing a 4-4.  Let the DE's play run game, take away their outside contain responsibility, press the OLB/SS into outside run support, forcing the pulling Bethel Guards to get across the field quicker (vs. having to pull to get a corner, an OLB appears much quicker.  I think the SJU corners are good enough, and also are facing a passing attack that is not the strentgh of their opponent, that the corner/remaining safety could play a soft 3 with still giving them the opportunity to take away the slant/dig routes with the OLB's presence at the snap.  This way, you don't need to play a spy, you get 8 guys in the box, you shorten the gap for the pulling guards (something Bethel does VERY well!) and you take away/limit the 3-step game.  Still, though, Wetzel's biggest scare for the Johnnies will be moving the pocket/sprinting out - forcing the OLB to either play run or pass.  Here, the passing attack will acutally depend HIGHLY on the MLB's getting over the the sprinted to side of the field, allowing the OLB to take away the initial throw, and then coming up to force Wetzel to throw.  He is very dangerous on his feet.  

I would agree, they are a vastly different team without their starting running back. For being a freshman, he is a great back.  The fact that we were able to stop them twice in the green zone, when their starting back was out of the game, suggests the significant drop off that exists between their starter and the senior back-up.  Certainly, their senior will have much more game knowledge, and will give his all in such a momentous game, but, if their freshman back isn't able to go, or go at 100% their gameplan will have to change dramatically.  

[Touchdown Tommy]

Buckman quit lurking and say something humorous....BTW: Will you be bringing the crew your Jello Shots or should TDT make a last minute audible to the one and only Raiderguy??

Fellas: If SJU beats Bethel on Saturday they are NOT going to the playoffs.  You heard it here first.