MBB: Midwest Conference

[Old Fighting Scot]

chris hebeler at MC is getting 11pts. a game.  he is very quick off the dribble, and can shoot the three (hit 12 in a game this year).  in the system he would be un-guardable, he would score 27-30 a night in the system, he would be leading the conference and/or the country in scoring if he played in the system.  he plays for a very underachieving MC team and he scores 11pts. a game.  

MY POINT!

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

How many shots does he get per game?  PPG mean nothing without shot numbers.  If a kid is a good shooter and he gets 26 shots per game, he can score 30, no matter what system he's playing in (evidenced by Myrick, very comparable to Grotberg).

[systemfan86]

 i would guess grotberg didnt get 20 a game in h.s. so what makes you think he would get 20 a game in one of the best D3 (very top heavy admittedly) Conferences in america?

Apparently, you would guess wrong.

http://detnews.sportshuddle.com/FanPages/Sports/basketball/Common/SeasonStats_Team.asp?TeamID={A017A0BA-BEE6-4C59-893A-7F6F4CAC17E5}&setTeamType=6&setAffiliate=DetN&setSeason={95FBF98B-58E3-4488-A3EF-25BA61E50481}

[hjmphelp]

mwc4life-
don't mistake me for jeffdc- he is the one who picked up on your 'decent' comment. We agree to disagree here. But I am old enough (56) and have been around this program long enough (since 1954) to say what I do with just a teeny bit of knowledge to back it up.

OFS-
hyperbole won't make your arguement, sir. Only common sense will. I gave you two names that would score 20, not 30 and I didn't mention every last player to put on a Grinnell uniform. Only 2. Give it a rest, will ya? You are gonna embarass yourself  again!

[titan2000]

Here's the ESPN link on LU:

http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=darcy/060127

[Old Fighting Scot]

no coach on any team in the mwc would let any player shoot 26 times a game, outside of the system of course.  that is just the style of play in the league.  guards like steve kohl, becker, glasgow, garcia (not even he shot that much), never shot 26 times a game.  in the mwc it is generally the "big man" that gets the rock.  
i reiterate, saying grotberg or wood wouldnt get 20 a game is not the same as saying they suck, it means that generally in the MWC (outside of the system) versatile big men (inside/outside) score 20 a game.  thats it.  then you have a stud guard or two that just lights it up, and that would be it.

[Old Fighting Scot]

 i would guess grotberg didnt get 20 a game in h.s. so what makes you think he would get 20 a game in one of the best D3 (very top heavy admittedly) Conferences in america?

Apparently, you would guess wrong.

http://detnews.sportshuddle.com/FanPages/Sports/basketball/Common/SeasonStats_Team.asp?TeamID={A017A0BA-BEE6-4C59-893A-7F6F4CAC17E5}&setTeamType=6&setAffiliate=DetN&setSeason={95FBF98B-58E3-4488-A3EF-25BA61E50481}

that john grotberg played at crane, the one that plays for grinnell played at ann arbor-pioneer...  use your own judgement....

[Early]

always amazing to hear how fantastic everyplayer to ever put on a GC uni could get 30 just by stepping on the court....  thats just idiotic, why dont u try to reverse the question and ask how many players on other teams would be getting thirty a night in "the system."

Clap, clap, clap 

[hjmphelp]

Grotberg didn't play his senior year. He had a knee injury. Go back to 03-04 stats. He still averaged over 20 pts per game.

[hjmphelp]

JG also led the Detroit area in 3pt shooting as well.


Sorry to see you have the clap, Early!

[TeeDub]

I wonder if this plays into it...

Grinnell averages nearly 100 attempts per game as a team...that is a ton of trips up and down the floor.  Other teams don't get that many trips.  Knox for example averages only about 60 attempts per game...and some are probably even less than them.  Grotberg probably would have a hard time getting 22 - 28 attempts up in a System that only gets 60 attempts a game.  Not to mention that of the attempts he did manage to get, many of those probably wouldn't be for "3". 

I think scoring 18 - 20 points a game in a more traditional style in the MWC would be a major achievement for Grotberg or anyone else for that matter.

Just something to consider....

[systemfan86]

Garcia is a good example thanks for bringing him up. Can't find the numbers on shots per game the year he averaged 22.7/game (in 2001-2002), but it does indicate that 28% of his points (or 6 pt/game) came from the FT line. We all over looked that component of scoring 20 a game. From the field Garcia scored 16pt/game. Is Grotberg capable of that in a traditional system? Maybe, but we'll never know.

My biggest issue with your statement is that you picked a number (20pt/game) that a very small number of players in the MWC have achieved. Why hold GC players to that number when over the last five years none of the players from half the teams in the league (including your Scots) have achieved that? Seems like an unfair standard to me. Hell, everyone agrees Braier may be one of the best players ever in the league and he's never sniffed a 20pt/game average for the year.  

[hjmphelp]

Our John Grotberg played at Bloomfield Hills Cranbrook, BTW.

[scottie]

If memory serves, Garcia averaged about 47.3 shots a game.     He was about the only athletic player on most of those teams, and never met a shot he didn't like. 

[systemfan86]

So the link I posted was valid? Thanks. I couldn't Google that much info from a high school players junior year.