MBB: Midwest Conference

[The Roop]

I don't know if Hinz graduating is a good thing or not, but it certainly isn't a bad thing. I expect them to run more next year and embrace the perimeter shot. It's hard to assess needs at this point however. Depth will be a concern but it usually is for everybody at this time of year. Two guys were hurt and never played a minute this season. Do they step right in and start next year Who knows.

They will likely be in the hunt again, hopefully the extra year of experience will put them in the tournament.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Roop who's going to go for 50 and 30 against the system next year?

[The Roop]

Shouldn't need numbers like that against the evil "System" next year. I expect "Americas Team" to have several that go for 20 and 10 against it though.

FYI. I always thought the "Grinnell System" was a method for connecting slotted steel pipe anyway.

[Dolph Stanley]

Two guys were hurt and never played a minute this season. Do they step right in and start next year Who knows.

One of the two players who was hurt was from the same high school program as Horton.  He was a  solid player in high school but I do not recall seeing him around at games later in the year.  Can someone in the know tell me if he is still in school?  If he is back he could start at off guard and will battle Crivello and perhaps Bysted  for time at that position.

The second player who was hurt will not be much of a factor unless his game has changed and improved in a huge way.

Unless they have a stellar recruiting class that produces 2-3 players who contribute in a major way right away they will again be below :500 and again miss the playoffs

[mwc4life]

I never bought into the greatness of Josh Hinz.  I know him, he's a great kid, but none of his teams reached the MWC tournament....something is wrong there.  Someone who drops "50 and 30" in a game...i don't know.  Statistics don't always tell the tale.  Beloit players could be too caught up trying to get him touches and forget to just play themselves.  I realize Hinz never had the talent around him like Braier did, but no tourney appearances?  He lacked intensity and whenever your best player doesn't lead, whether its defensively, at practice etc. other players follow.  If you'll notice, the best teams play with a sense of urgency all the time.  It really never looked like Beloit played like that and whether that's Hinz's fault or Youngblood's I don't know.  Now its time for a new identity for Beloit basketball.  The next leader/best player will directly efffect the teams success.

[The Roop]

mwc4life,

Took the words right out of my mouth there. No defined leader, no sense of urgency. They got casual a few times and that's why Knox is going in their place.

Dolph,

To my knowledge Adam Puls was at every game, but in street clothes. As far as his future with the team goes it's anyones guess. Last I heard from Rumor Control was that his injury might prevent him from ever playing again. Two contributing freshmen next year certainly wouldn't hurt. If I had to pick starters right now I think they would have a very good line up but 4 of the 5 are foul prone.

[Sam Johnson]

I can't believe there were no tickets set aside from traveling supporters of Carroll, Grinnell or Knox.  You're gonna tell me that a Grinnell fan is gonna travel x-amount of hours and won't even be guaranteed a ticket??? 

This isn't the case.  Tickets were allotted to each school (don't know #'s).  I've been corresponding with LU AD on this.  This wasn't a duct tape at the last minute policy.  When I have more time after work I'll try and post more details to why LU might have gone with this policy.

[Dolph Stanley]

I never bought into the greatness of Josh Hinz.  I know him, he's a great kid, but none of his teams reached the MWC tournament....something is wrong there.  Someone who drops "50 and 30" in a game...i don't know.  Statistics don't always tell the tale.  Beloit players could be too caught up trying to get him touches and forget to just play themselves.  I realize Hinz never had the talent around him like Braier did, but no tourney appearances?  He lacked intensity and whenever your best player doesn't lead, whether its defensively, at practice etc. other players follow.  If you'll notice, the best teams play with a sense of urgency all the time.  It really never looked like Beloit played like that and whether that's Hinz's fault or Youngblood's I don't know.  Now its time for a new identity for Beloit basketball.  The next leader/best player will directly efffect the teams success.

When a Wisconsin based MWC team lands the best player from a D1 state qualifer they usually have someone very special.  Braier was that player at Wauwatosa East (at least top 2) his Senior Year (Devin Harris was the year before) Stratton was at Wisconsin Rapids his Senior year and Hinz was for Ft Atkinson.  The real key appears to be the other talent assembled around them and the concepts they are asked to buy in to.

While Hinz's individual accomplishments could be downplayed by the lack of team success, it could also be argued that the lack of a supporting cast in some ways made his achievments more difficult.

As a comparison, as a Sophmore, Braier was POY and had a teammate named to the second team as well as HM to go with the Coach of the Year in Tharp.  Hinz was First Team with nothing else.  As Juniors, both were first team.  Briar again had a teammate named to the second team and HM as well as the Coach of the Year while Hinz had a teammate named HM.  This year I look for Briaer to reclaim POY with at least two teammates receiving recognition (I have a hunch they may bypass Tharp this year and give COY to Carroll) while  Hinz will probably not see any teammates or coaching awards.  Tough to play on an Island.

[Sam Johnson]

I must really be missing something on the ticket furor. 
As I stated in an earlier post, the GC/Carroll game is first.  The process, if biased in any way, is towards the GC/Carroll fans.  If they were wanting to bias it towards LU, they would open the ticket window at 8am in the morning.

Sam, no reason to be embarassed on behalf on LU in my view.  Quit beating up yourself.  Seems like a logical approach to me.

I can understand the decision after talking to the AD.  My personal belief is that it negatively affects the chances of anyone outside appleton for getting a ticket.  When the games start doesn't matter that much in my opinion.  LU fans from outside the area would still have trouble snagging tix even if you offered them at 5pm.  Its the "day of at the door" thing that I think creates the most trouble for out of towners.

However, after hearing a more detailed explanation of the reasoning, i think this is really the best way LU could handle it.  They needed to limit seating at 1400 so a completely open door is a no go (the door people have to count then).  LU couldn't take phone orders of any kind (even of the type i suggested - to reserve tix to pick up at the door) b/c they don't have the staff to 1) take phone orders and 2) to organize tickets for distribution to individuals.

Once you take phone ordering out of the equation and you can't have an open door policy, this is what you are left with.  BTW, when I thought more about it this was the same plan used by LU for their NCAA game 2 years ago. 

Basically I think it would have been wise to include an explanation of the ticket policy to avoid looking arbitrary, but that's the beauty of hindsight.

[mwc4life]

Dolph,

See this is exactly what you're missing from my point.  I would think so much more of Hinz if he averaged LESS and his teams made a tourney apperance or two.  With winning comes all those awards you speak of....all the all-conference selections.  Hinz is no where close to Braier's category because of the winning.  Braier could've averaged close to 20/gm his whole career at LU, but I guarentee they wouldn't have won anywhere close to the amount of games.  Braier made his teammates better.  He created a tradition there that will live on after he leaves.  He sacrificed parts of his game for the better of the team.  He used more energy on defense, communication...PRACTICE, instead of getting 20 a night.  Also, LU players all over-achieved (great compliment)....meaning they didn't have the tallest players or greatest athletes...they just outworked everyone by so much more.

I've watched Josh play his whole college career...and with all that ability, it never transfered to wins.  Like I said, there is something wrong with that.  The talent wasn't so bad to never get in the tourney.  It's not all Hinz's fault, but him graduating can only be a good thing.

PS - NO WAY THARP DOESN'T WIN COY...I don't care how many times in a row he has won it!!!

[Sam Johnson]

(I have a hunch they may bypass Tharp this year and give COY to Carroll)

Dolph~
My hat is off to Schultz, but do you really think that Tharp won't win it again after leading his team to 1) An undefeated season, 2) Their 3rd consecutive MWC title (a rare feat for our league), 3) a #1 ranking, the highest for an MWC team in the history of the D-III hoops poll and a feat matched only once by a Beloit team (on the now defunct AP poll for D-III)?

Tharp is COY, Braier is COY.  End of story.

See this is exactly what you're missing from my point.  I would think so much more of Hinz if he averaged LESS and his teams made a tourney apperance or two.  With winning comes all those awards you speak of....all the all-conference selections.  Hinz is no where close to Braier's category because of the winning.  Braier could've averaged close to 20/gm his whole career at LU, but I guarentee they wouldn't have won anywhere close to the amount of games.  Braier made his teammates better.  He created a tradition there that will live on after he leaves.  He sacrificed parts of his game for the better of the team.  He used more energy on defense, communication...PRACTICE, instead of getting 20 a night.  Also, LU players all over-achieved (great compliment)....meaning they didn't have the tallest players or greatest athletes...they just outworked everyone by so much more.

I've watched Josh play his whole college career...and with all that ability, it never transfered to wins.  Like I said, there is something wrong with that.  The talent wasn't so bad to never get in the tourney.  It's not all Hinz's fault, but him graduating can only be a good thing.

PS - NO WAY THARP DOESN'T WIN COY...I don't care how many times in a row he has won it!!!

MWC~
Does it scare you that I'd mistake you for a LU fan if I didn't know any better? 

[Sam Johnson]

Stupid question, but did anyone get a tape of either the ESPN or CBS coverage of LU this weekend?  I'm betting no, b/c if you're like me you had no idea (though I suspected College Gamenight would do something) that anything would show up for sure.  But I figured it'd be worth a shot.

[The Roop]

mwc4life,

Lots of great players never make post season appearances. So I don't buy your "Hey, he's great so his team should be in the tournament" argument. The fact is Hinz never had much (or any, depending on your own opinions) support until this year.

Hinz vs. Braier one on one with a ref, Hinz wins. One on one with no ref Braier wins. Either way, both will likely move on to grad school never having read anything we say about them.

[The Roop]

The next and perhaps most important question is this. "The Roop" really doesn't feel like taking vacation time just to get a ticket to Fridays games. I don't think it will be the mad rush as many have predicted but I'd rather drive there knowing I already had admission. So, can any of the millions and millions of "The Roops" fans get "The Roop" a ticket at 3:00PM

"The Roop" will not pay more than face value for a ticket but "The Roop" doesn't mind buying a $25 commemorative pen that also includes a free game ticket <wink wink>.

Emails and personal messages are now accepted.

[mwc4life]

Like who Roop?