MBB: Midwest Conference

[Greek Tragedy]

BTW, I was shocked when I saw that Norbs was 2-4 down the stretch. What happened?!

My first thought that they had to play Lawrence twice and Carroll once...two tough MWC teams...but if you look closely, they're probably lucky to go 2-4.

They had to win in OT vs. Lake Forest and they only beat Ripon by 5.  That beating at home against Lawrence must have done something to them.  I mean, they had just recently topped Carroll in Waukesha when Carroll hadn't even lost a league game yet.  I know Carroll has been on a slide since Ladwig has been out, but has St. Norb's lost anyone of significance?

[systemfan86]

Still, a great deal of the Pool C has to do with whether the 4 or 5 teams above them get their auto bids. If memory serves, the selection process for Pool C involves putting the top available team from each region up for consideration against the other teams. When a selection is made, a team from the region selected is promoted and the process repeats. The longer it takes to get to the table, the harder it is to get a Pool C, presumably.    

Presumably is a good word! lol...That's usually the case, but as discussed in the Pool C board, the Atlantic Region totally missed out on any Pool C bid while the Northeast Region got SIX! 

Pool C in Blue
Pool A (AQ) in Red

Atlantic Region
1. Richard Stockton  18-6  18-5 .511 .521 (NJAC):  Def. Ramapo 60-59 in NJAC semis; def. William Paterson 67-66 in NJAC final.
2. William Paterson  18-6  18-6 .526 .516 (NJAC):  Def. Monclair State 71-61 in NJAC semis; LOST to Richard Stockton 67-66 in NJAC final
3. Farmingdale State  20-5  19-4 .466 .477 (SKY):  Def. SUNY-Maritime 84-69 in Skyline semis; def. St. Joseph's (L.I.) 91-71 in Skyline final
4. York (N.Y.)  20-8  18-7 .539 .502 (CUNYAC):  LOST to John Jay in CUNYAC final 68-54.
5. St. Joseph's (L.I.)  20-5  19-5 .433 .477 (SKY):  Def. Yeshiva 73-52 in Skyline semis; LOST to Farmingdale State 91-71 in Skyline final


Northeast Region
POOL C 1. Amherst  23-2  23-1 .601 .553 (NESCAC):  LOST to Bowdoin 65-64 in NESCAC semis
POOL C 2. Mass-Dartmouth  23-2  23-2 .530 .529 (Little East):  Def. Mass-Boston 131-63 in LE quarters; def. Southern Maine 75-69 in LE semis; LOST to Rhode Island College 55-52 in Little East final
POOL C 3. Brandeis  19-5  18-5 .610 .580 (UAA): def. NYU 58-44
POOL C 4. Worcester Tech  20-5  19-4 .535 .495 (NEWMAC):  def. Babson 60-59 in NEWMAC semis; LOST to Coast Guard 82-66 in NEWMAC final
POOL C 5. Bowdoin  20-5  20-5 .571 .533 (NESCAC):  Won at Amherst 65-64 in NESCAC semis; LOST to Trinity (Conn) 74-55 in NESCAC final
6. Rhode Island College  19-6  19-6 .545 .529 (LEC):  Def. Plymouth State 77-58 in LEC quarters; def. Keene State 68-63 at UMass-Dartmouth in LEC semis; def. Mass-Dartmouth 55-52 in Little East final
7. Trinity (Conn.)  19-6  17-5 .615 .549 (NESCAC):  def. Middlebury 72-63 at Amherst in NESCAC semis; def. Bowdoin 74-55 in NESCAC final
POOL C 8. Middlebury  19-6  18-5 .596 .528 (NESCAC):  LOST to Trinity 72-63(Conn.) at Amherst in NESCAC semis
9. Emerson  22-3  21-3 .442 .499 (GNAC):  Def. Daniel Webster 93-70 in GNAC quarters; def. St. Joseph's (Maine) 79-75 in GNAC semis; LOST to Lasell 86-72 in GNAC final
10. Elms  19-6  17-5 .512 .483 (NAC):  Def. Maine-Farmington 79-65 in NAC quarters; def. Becker 78-53 in NAC semis; def Lesley 72-65 in NAC final

Fair enough, but in your example, while Middleburry received consideration at #8 (and was the sixth team from their region to get considered), York (#4) and St Joseph (#5) were never discussed as Pool C possibilities because William Patterson wasn't considered better than the teams from the Northeast and from all the other regions. There in lies the rub: you have to hope all the teams ahead of you in the region get selected just so you can be considered.

Using your earlier post

Midwest Region
1. Washington U. 21-1 20-1 (UAA) BEAT Carnegie Mellon, LOST to Rochester
2. Wheaton (Ill.) 20-3 16-3 (CCIW) WON at Carthage, BEAT North Central
3. Elmhurst 17-6 17-6 (CCIW) WON at North Central, BEAT Carthage
4. Transylvania 17-5 14-3 (HCAC) BEAT Mount St. Joseph, WON at Anderson
5. North Central (Ill.) 16-7 14-5 (CCIW) LOST to Elmhurst, LOST at Wheaton
6. Lawrence 15-6 15-6 (MWC) BEAT Beloit
7. Augustana 17-7 16-7 (CCIW) WON at Illinois Wesleyan
8. St. Norbert 18-4 17-4 (MWC) LOST to Carroll

Washington is in, and let's say Wheaton and Transylvania win. If Larry is in consideration for Pool C, then presumably they won one, lost one (hopefully to Grinnell in the final  ). That makes them 16-7.

For Larry to get the Pool C, they have to have both Elmhurst and North Central (presuming they stay ranked ahead of Larry) get selected as Pool C entries. Then, if they even get considered, the committee has to say that a 16-7 team is better than the best option from the other regions.

Color me VERY skeptical. I'd even venture to say that in this scenario, it is late before Larry gets to the table because they have to wait for the CCIW to get their third team in the tournament. Human nature says the committee goes with many other teams before picking a third team from one conference.

I don't think we're necessarily disagreeing here; you are simply more open to the possibility than I am. 

[Mr. Ypsi]

sf86, note, however, that NCC lost twice last week - LU will certainly be ahead of them in this week's rankings.

[larry_u]

sf86, note, however, that NCC lost twice last week - LU will certainly be ahead of them in this week's rankings.

Its true.  it should be fairly obvious that LU should move up into the 5 slot, where depending on what happens this weekend they will only need to get Elmhurst off the board.  Honestly if LU loses in the MWC Championship game, the best possible senario for them is for Elmhurst to win the CCIW, because Wheaton will be grabbed ASAP for a pool C, and then LU, assuming they are the next highest ranked team in the midwest will be on the board for quite a while, which theoretically should help, but not guarantee anything.

[carrollfan]

the carroll v lawrence game should be a great game. wish i could make the drive down from the twin cities area.  If carroll finds a way to beat LU i think they would rather pull grinnell in the final, carroll would rather play a high speed game, if LU wins they would perfer SNC and would definately pick LU over SNC.
LU- playin great
SNC- on the downward spiral
CU - puttin sh1t together
GC-  just playin like GC, who knows

Love MWC basketball, good luck too all teams!

Oh yeah im drunk. wont remember this post tomorrow

[Gregory Sager]

the carroll v lawrence game should be a great game. wish i could make the drive down from the twin cities area.  If carroll finds a way to beat LU i think they would rather pull grinnell in the final, carroll would rather play a high speed game, if LU wins they would perfer SNC and would definately pick LU over SNC.
LU- playin great
SNC- on the downward spiral
CU - puttin sh1t together
GC-  just playin like GC, who knows

Love MWC basketball, good luck too all teams!

Oh yeah im drunk. wont remember this post tomorrow

It's great to see that the fine Carroll tradition of booze-fueled posting is being taken to heart by a new generation of CU fans.

[larry_u]

the carroll v lawrence game should be a great game. wish i could make the drive down from the twin cities area.  If carroll finds a way to beat LU i think they would rather pull grinnell in the final, carroll would rather play a high speed game, if LU wins they would perfer SNC and would definately pick LU over SNC.
LU- playin great
SNC- on the downward spiral
CU - puttin sh1t together
GC-  just playin like GC, who knows

Love MWC basketball, good luck too all teams!

Oh yeah im drunk. wont remember this post tomorrow

Hmmm drunk in the Twin Cities at 2:15 on a Monday afternoon.  You either work at a Museum or don't have a job.  I'm probably voting the latter.

I'm pretty sure the LU/Carroll winner would want to play SNC either way.  Not playing a team on thier home court, with momentum, and playing a team that is not used to playing the system who should be tired after running up and down for 40 minutes...its just common sense. 

[Greek Tragedy]

That or the fact that LU smoked SNC by a combined 50 points in their two meetings. 

[systemfan86]

Hmmm drunk in the Twin Cities at 2:15 on a Monday afternoon.  You either work at a Museum or don't have a job.  I'm probably voting the latter.

I was thinking the same thing. Add to that the odd choice to access D3Hoops and post a message when you are drunk at 2:15 on a Monday afternoon. Shouldn't he be harrassing an old girlfriend or something?

Given the economy, I not going to bust someone's chops for being out of a job. Just glad I have mine!

[larry_u]

That or the fact that LU smoked SNC by a combined 50 points in their two meetings. 

Well yes there is that....

But as they always say it's tough to beat a team 3 times in one season.

[Greek Tragedy]

Don't be lame, join the NCAA Tourney Fantasy League...you know you want Grotberg if Grinnell is in it!

[Mr. Ypsi]

Don't be lame, join the NCAA Tourney Fantasy League...you know you want Grotberg if Grinnell is in it!

Even with Grotberg, my first pick is Raymond!   (Besides, Wheaton should get more games than Grinnell.)

[titan2000]

The Grotberg fascination level here is sickening.  

How many points would he have scored if he wasn't the Jammer for Grinnell?  I mean he wears those longer socks to signify himself as the Jammer.  I'm suprised he doesn't wear fishnets.

You guys think the Rolller Derby moniker was staged; check out the definitions below and let me know if you think I'm close. All defined terms are underlined in this post.

I do know that Penalties are not called as often as they should be against Grinnell Roller Derby.  

http://www.sydneyrollerderby.com/mod/glossary/view.php?g=1

[titan2000]

Don't be lame, join the NCAA Tourney Fantasy League...you know you want Grotberg if Grinnell is in it!

Even with Grotberg, my first pick is Raymond!   (Besides, Wheaton should get more games than Grinnell.)

Wheaton just got by LU last year, and it was only because we clanked some free throws. Raymond put them on his back.  I agree, a lot better than Grotberg.   

[Mr. Ypsi]

T2K, the fantasy league is purely stats; 'system' or no is irrelevant.  IF someone thinks Grinnell can last more than a game or two, Grotberg is an obvious potential pick.