MBB: Midwest Conference

[pgkevin]

But then again, the fact that the poster who posted those remarks has only one post makes me think he is just a fan of one of those aforementioned U of W insert name here schools that feels a little spurned...

[pgkevin]

Looking ahead to the All MWC team, I checked the stats from the league and was a little surprised to see how senior dominant the stats are this year.

Could we have an all senior first team MWC? I'm guessing not, but Hoch might be the lone exception.
Horton, Kroeger, Ladwig, Grotberg, Long, Arseneault, Gillingham, Gould, Page, Kadison, Zimmerman, Apelgren...all gone after this year. You could create a pretty solid All-Star team from that group. My apologies if I forgot someone. I was getting those quickly.

7 of the top 10 scorers are seniors.
The top 4 in rebounds are all seniors.
Every individual stat except FT % and 3-pt % are lead by seniors.

Makes you wonder what the league will be like next year. 

My sentiments exactly...

After a quick look through various rosters I think the two teams most affected by the graduating seniors will be (obviously I think) Lawrence and Grinnell.  Its almost staggering what these two teams lose, and it will be tough to imagine it not being more than a year or two process to rebuild.

Carroll seems to be okay, as this team has shifted to complete revolve around Hoch, thus minimizing the loss of seniors Ladwig and Gould.

After those top 4 teams and the amount that they lose, it opens up quite nicely for the 6 sitting at home right now...2 in particular.

I think the two wildcards to watch next year will be Lake Forest (as I previously mentioned) and Monmouth.  As is the case with underclassmen it will be all about the work ethic in the offseason, but the amount that both of these two teams relied on freshmen and performed adequately in the league this year is actually pretty remarkable

[The Roop]

Hate to be a buzz kill but I'm not sure that the top 4 will be any different next year. Order might change but it looks like the same 4 to me.

[systemfan86]

Are there any locks for All-MWC team? Grotberg, Hoch and Kroeger for sure right?

I'm not sure I'd want to call anyone a lock, but if any of those three weren't there, I'd be shocked.

I think Horton has a pretty solid shot at being on the team. Fifth in scoring and first in rebounding.

But that last position would appear to be open to any number of players. And any number of considerations could go into filling that slot. You could look to the two conference co-champs and take Long, Page, or Kadison.
You could go for balance and see if you could make a case for a StN player - I can't make one, but perhaps it could be done. And Gillespie still had a solid year and was second team last year.

I'd put money on the first four, but I have no solid feel on the last one; but whoever it is will be subject to the "why Player A instead of Player B?" posts here on the board.

[schwanman]

My top five would be Grotberg, Kroeger, Horton, Hoch and Long.

As for Monmouth being a threat next season, they do return a lot of solid players. Perhaps no game in, game out go-to guys, but a group including outside players Grant, Gruber and Tanney and post players Ott and Cogdill. All five started in double-digit games this year. However, in somewhat a statistical oddity, no one averaged double-figure points.

Robbie Hinkle also emerged as a solid player, and there are a number of others currently on the roster who, with a little work, can make the jump to consistent contributors.

And, Monmouth will still be young, as only one of those six players (Ott) will be a senior next year. I would like to think that either next year or 2010-11, Monmouth can crack the top four.   

[titan2000]

Kroeger, Hoch, Long, Kafzkey (w/o him SNC is nada) and Horton.  I think all these players stir the drink on their respective teams.

Grotberg, Page, Ladwig, Kadison,  and Gillespie (still BDTR) second team. 

HM to Apelgren, Perrine, and to Beloit for their defeat of Carroll.  Now we get to go to Iowa.  WTF.

[scottie]

Another statistical oddity:  Scottie is co-champion of the pick-em league with the extent of his 2008-2009 MWC game-watching being about 21 online minutes of the MC-SNC game.  8)   

[titan2000]

Another statistical oddity:  Scottie is co-champion of the pick-em league with the extent of his 2008-2009 MWC game-watching being about 21 online minutes of the MC-SNC game.  8)   

I only watch the Scots when they play LU and then only because its free.     I do try to enjoy a Glenlivet to celebrate the victory after those games, however, so I haven't completely sold out on the Scots.

[systemfan86]

Kafzkey (w/o him SNC is nada)

And, unfortunately for Grinnell, reports are that he will back for the tournament this weekend. Putting aside the standard "we want to beat their best" comment, I'd rather have Grinnell play the team without Kafzkey that went 2-4 down the stretch.

[systemfan86]

For those interested...

Midwest Region
1. Wheaton (Ill.) 22-3 18-3
2. Washington U. 22-2 21-2
3. Elmhurst 19-6 19-6
4. Transylvania 19-5 16-3
5. Lawrence 17-6 17-6
6. Augustana 18-7 17-7
7. Carroll 16-7 16-7
8. North Central (Ill.) 16-9 14-7

And Larry is joins the Top 25 at #25. 

[pgkevin]

Hate to be a buzz kill but I'm not sure that the top 4 will be any different next year. Order might change but it looks like the same 4 to me.

I realize that this year isn't concluded so this talk is premature, but to say its the same 4 to you seems relatively insane to me, especially when it comes to Grinnell and Lawrence.  I could see Carroll and Norbert's back in the picture, and probably see Carroll as the favorites.  A few things to consider about Grinnell and Lawrence...

Grinnell graduates
73 % of scoring
75% of assists
50 % of their minutes

This is a large number for a regular school, but for a school that runs the System it is a tremendous hit.  The statistics speak for themselves, but for anyone who watched a Grinnell game this season it was obviously that Arsenault, Long, and Grotberg were the sole focuses of the opposing defenses.  A player like Skelley or Chalupa, who got open looks as the 4th option on the floor, will certainly not see any open looks when being guarded by the oppositions best defender.  So there will be an adjustment period where Grinnell players have to figure out how to create their own shots, something that no one on that roster has had to worry about in 4 years...

[pgkevin]

Hate to be a buzz kill but I'm not sure that the top 4 will be any different next year. Order might change but it looks like the same 4 to me.

Sorry decided to divide this into two posts.
Lawrence is the other school that I feel is simply graduating too much production to sustain much next year.

62% of scoring
68% of assists
47% of rebounding
51% of steals

Once again I think the same argument applies here as it did with Grinnell.  Kroeger and co. have really been intently focused upon by other teams defenses allowing for others to have alot of open shots.  I think Lawrence will struggle next year with no Kroeger, no Kadison running the show, and no big body like Page's occupying the low post.  And lastly I just don't think Lawrence responds well when they graduate a ton of talent.  I will admit I do not have much to base this off of, but the only example I can remember is when they graduated Briar after that deep NCAA run and the next year finished 8-8 and outta the tournament.  8-8 is not a bad record by any means, but when you finished the previous year at 16-0, it is quite a fall.

Lastly, while looking over the roster, the fact that they only have 3 freshmen and 3 sophomores concerns me.  I can remember the days when you'd watch a LAwrence game and see about 30 guys on the bench.  So, not only are they graduating alot, they really don't seem to have a lot of bodies in general to replace them.

Only my opinion, just interested by the numbers, don't mean to offend anyone.

[iltsilts]

Hate to be a buzz kill but I'm not sure that the top 4 will be any different next year. Order might change but it looks like the same 4 to me.

Only my opinion, just interested by the numbers, don't mean to offend anyone.

No offense taken here, pgkevin,  but - Thus Spake The Roop.  What else do we need to know? 

[The Roop]

8-8 will sometimes get you in the tournament. This season 8-8 was 4 games back of the final spot. Meaning that the top 4 will have 3 or 4 games to play with next year. Barring a total collapse I don't see how anyone else is going to improve that much to knock somebody out. 

Graduation isn't exactly going to help IC. Not sure how much Ripon will be effected but then there is a noticeable fall off to the bottom 4. I'm sure they will still play the season though. Not sure if there will be  many changes however.   

[pgkevin]

No offense taken here, pgkevin,  but - Thus Spake The Roop.  What else do we need to know? 

Exactly why I felt I needed to step so carefully around the issue.  Its almost like committing treason to do so. 

Like Patrick Henry, and I'm just paraphrasing here, "Give me liberty, or at least give me a Roopacino"