MBB: Midwest Conference

[jeffp]

And of course we ALL know, because that conference has had mediocre success in the D3 Tourney (solid, but a bit narrow definition of conference quality, don't you think? Oh, what the heck. I'll let you keep that definition of success just for shorts and googles) that Mr Sager's statistics show emphatically that the IIAC has absolutely NO chance of  being an above mediocre conference from henceforth., including this year...

[Gregory Sager]

Not just the D3 tourney, jeffp. I mentioned the d3hoops.com poll as well. Sure, that's more subjective ... but it's also cumulative, as the poll's been going on for more than a dozen years now. The IIAC simply hasn't produced a team at the top of its standings, much less two or three in a season, that have stood out on the national stage. The Buena Vista teams of about a decade or so ago were about as close as I've seen an IIAC team come in that respect, and they still would've been second or third in the WIAC or CCIW.

Scoff all you want about the history. But that history involving the IIAC and D3 is now 40 years long. That's a lot of accumulated evidence. I think that the burden of proof is upon you, not me.

[AppletonRocks]

Lawrence dispensed with that Buena Vista team in Storm Lake in the tourney, I remember, I was there.   The locals were friendly but they forced us to take cabs back to our hotels from the night spots, claiming that "drunken walking" was a crime in Storm Lake.   We were afraid that Cooter was out back waiting to bust us so we paid the taxi fee.

[jeffp]

Gregory, I'm not scoffing at history, I'm merely pointing out that history isn't always an accurate predictor of future success. Take Grinnell as an example. Yup, their Tourney record is 0-2, but if ANYONE would have suggested they would ever even make it to the tourney (after its 1st 20 or so odd years) they would have been laughed outta the gym based on their previous history. Further, NO ONE would have or could have predicted the success Grinnell has had in conference over the last 20 years based on their record over the previous 20. All I suggested was that perhaps a re evaluation might be in order, if only for this year. Or maybe not, who knows. I noted that the two bottom dwellers looked pretty damn good against Grinnell suggesting that the conference may be on the upswing, I didn't try to overturn history.

[scottie]

jeffp:  Don't let Gregory get your goat.  History is all he's got....  He's more stuck in the 70s and 80s than Leif Garrett and Molly Ringwald combined!   

[jeffp]

Oh, don't worry Scottie! The Goat is still firmly in place and attached directly to my chin. I am a little baffled, however, that Mr Sager feels obligated to denigrate a rather innocuous  personal observation. If his assumptions are correct, perhaps we should just go to a D3 Tourney composed of teams from the historically (statistically?) best conferences in the country and ignore the posers who might challenge them. It certainly would be a lot easier than worrying about teams from outside those conferences and would keep the riff raff from the IIAC and other mediocre conferences from screwing up the D3 Tournament....

[AppletonRocks]

Lawrence bullied the Blueboys 82-62 at Alexander Gym.  It got closer towards the end.

[Gregory Sager]

jeffp:  Don't let Gregory get your goat.  History is all he's got....  He's more stuck in the 70s and 80s than Leif Garrett and Molly Ringwald combined!   

Yeah, right.  Here I just mentioned that the d3hoops.com poll's been going on for about a dozen years now, and yet I get a shot from you about the '70s and '80s. Let's have another go at the math with that Monmouth education of yours, scottie, and see if "a dozen years" takes us all the way back to the eras of knit leg warmers or vans with shag carpeting.

Over the past five years, the IIAC has gone 1-5 in D3 tourney play, with an average point spread of -9. That recent enough for you?

Oh, don't worry Scottie! The Goat is still firmly in place and attached directly to my chin. I am a little baffled, however, that Mr Sager feels obligated to denigrate a rather innocuous  personal observation.

I was not denigrating your observation. That's too strong and personal a term to describe my reply to you. I was simply making a point about the IIAC in response to your assessment. The concluding sentence of that assessment, "Whoever made that statement about conference strength may need to re evaluate," appeared to be directly inviting a reply.

If his assumptions are correct, perhaps we should just go to a D3 Tourney composed of teams from the historically (statistically?) best conferences in the country and ignore the posers who might challenge them. It certainly would be a lot easier than worrying about teams from outside those conferences and would keep the riff raff from the IIAC and other mediocre conferences from screwing up the D3 Tournament....

Your sarcasm aside, anyone who regularly reads d3boards.com knows that I have always been a very strong supporter of the NCAA policy of open tournament access. I am not one of those people who believe that the tournament should be constructed in such a way that the 62 best teams in the country get in. Quite the opposite. The little-known teams from low-profile conferences with automatic berths add color and variety to the field, and they serve the important purpose of guaranteeing equity in terms of championship access for each and every member school and conference of the NCAA.

If an IIAC team (or a SCIAC team, or a SLIAC team, or a representative of any of the other leagues that regularly fare poorly in March) were to go on a deep tournament run this year (or any year) I'd probably be rooting for it. I certainly enjoyed Lawrence's tourney runs during the Chris Braier era, because the historical lack of success of MWC teams in the dance made LU a bona-fide underdog when it went up against the likes of Gustavus Adolphus, UWSP, and Illinois Wesleyan -- and, like a lot of people, I enjoy rooting for an underdog.

[jeffp]

Oh. Ok.

[scottie]

"North Park Vikings: Nat'l champs, 1978-79-80-85-87"

I can almost picture every day at the Sager manse beginning with Gregory rolling out of bed and pressing PLAY on the cassette player, and having Bruce Springsteen's "Glory Days" as a soundtrack as he makes his way over to the coffee pot.   

[scottie]

Anyway...... since this is not an IIAC board, nor a CCIW board, NOR a Gregory Sager board.....

As we reach the holiday break, I'd like to request nominations for surprise team in the MWC so far as well as early favorites for COY and POY.  I'll start with my nominations:

Team:  Monmouth College Fighting Scots, aka "the good guys" or "the frosh/sophs"
COY: Todd Skrivseth, Monmouth College
POY: Jack Taylor*, Grinnell College*

I expect most of the responses to be "ditto," "ditto" and "ditto*."   

[jeffp]

Ok, Scottie, I'll bite. It's a bit early, but what the hey.

Team: Illinois College (Not in a good way)
          Monmouth College (3-2? NO way...but in a good way  )
COY: Grzesk*
POY: Cerroni*

*based on St Norbert running the table in the MWC; if they don't I'm changin' my votes.

[AppletonRocks]

SNC signed a local kid from Seymour, Dakota Oskey, yesterday.  This kid is good enough to play up in D2 but wants to stay close to home I guess.  Wish he would have gone south to LU. 

[sncdangler]

SNC signed a local kid from Seymour, Dakota Oskey, yesterday.  This kid is good enough to play up in D2 but wants to stay close to home I guess.  Wish he would have gone south to LU. 

Besides yourself, a former staffer from within the conference now coaching in his high school conference wanted him to go to LU too, based on his phone call to him saying don't go to SNC. Can't ever say I've heard of such a maneuver before...

[The Roop]

You'd be surprised. It happens more than you think.