MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Mr. Ypsi]

Apologies if this has already been discussed, but I just noticed an oddity at the end of the conference schedule.  The Augie at IWU game, which 'should' have been the 4th game on Wednesday, 2-16, will instead be the only game played the following week (on Tuesday, 2-22).  What's up with that?  (All I can figure is some sort of conflict at the Shirk, but that seems odd during the conference season.)  Anyone know?

(Maybe someone had a hunch that that could be a showdown for 'all the marbles', and wanted to increase the drama! )

It started with this, from Feb 18 last year:

http://qconline.com/archives/qco/display.php?id=480383

"Giovanine was not happy that his kids were playing basketball in finals week and vowed "it will never happen again if I have anything to do with it. Our academic calendar changed, and we have to change with it. We spent the first 15 minutes in a fog. Then I thought we outplayed them for 25 minutes. But we were so bad the first 15 that we couldn't overcome it."


I'm sure it's not easy playing during finals week, but IWU has led Augie for about 79 of the 80 total minutes this season...and maintained leads throughout both games of about 8 points on average.  I'm not sure I buy Coach G's excuse.

The original 2010-11 CCIW schedule had Augustana @ IWU on Wednesday, Feb 16.  Augie asked IWU if they'd be willing to move the game from finals week to another date.  I'm not sure how those negotiations went and who was involved, but obviously, the game was moved to the Tuesday of conference tournament week.

Thanks, Q!  +k

Since both teams will almost certainly be among those playing in the tourney on Friday, I wonder if them playing on Tuesday but the others having off since Saturday will have any impact (positive or negative) on the tourney games.

[Gregory Sager]

I'm running out of pejoratives to hurl at the Vikings. Just a brutal, brutal game last night at Faganal Hall. It's always fun to see a team pull out a win when it has half the talent of its opponent but twice the discipline and mental fortitude -- unless the opponent wears the uniform of your alma mater. It irritates me to no end to see NPU play dumb, chaotic basketball.

OK, so last night the Vikings couldn't throw the ball into Lake Michigan if they were standing on the end of Navy Pier. I get that. It happens. Teams have bad shooting nights. But the Vikings still managed somehow to claw their way back into the game with five and a half minutes to go, reducing what had been an 11-point Elmhurst lead down to four. So the bad shooting night was no excuse. They were within striking distance of an undermanned team that they knew coming in they were supposed to beat.

And then they regressed into the usual pattern of ill-considered one-on-five basketball that has plagued them all season long. And just like that it was all over. To wit:

Elmhurst hit a jumper. NPU missed a jumper. After a Bluejays turnover, the Vikings then proceeded on their next four possessions to turn the ball over three times and have one no-chance prayer shot blocked, each blown possession the result of the ballhandler trying to do everything himself while his four teammates stood around and watched him. Somehow it seems to elude them that the principle of penetration-and-kickout never works if you continuously neglect the "and-kickout" part; EC wisely collapsed on the penetrator and wiped out the play each time, knowing that the Viking with the ball wouldn't look to pass it to a teammate. The Vikings get mad at themselves, they get mad at each other, and you can see them come unglued right before your very eyes. It's a nightmare, and the worst part is that these guys are all seniors and juniors who seem to be getting worse at this, not better.

I've seen NPU teams that were beaten every night because they'd lost their most talented players, and I've seen NPU teams that were beaten every night because their coach had never recruited even a minimal number of talented players to begin with. But this is the first time that I've ever seen a North Park team get beaten every night because it has lots of talented players who don't know how to play together as a team or how to stay calm and focused in the face of adversity.

I like these guys as individual players, but as a team they're an absolute mess. I don't know what it takes to get them all on the same page. Paul Brenegan's tried just about everything, but nothing seems to work.

[Gregory Sager]

When was the last time Stevie D was held to 10 points?

He only scored eight against Cardinal Stritch back on December 12.

People in this room gave NPU all kinds of crap when the Vikings played a zone against Carthage last year and Steve Djurickovic proceeded to have an 8-for-10 night from beyond the arc. Well, this is why Paul Brenegan chose that strategy. If your zone is mobile enough to prevent seams you can take away Carthage's best weapon -- Steve D.'s dribble penetration -- and force the Red Men to beat you with treys. Although the Red Men did shoot 8-22 (36%) from downtown last night against NCC, I'm sure that Todd Raridon considered it well worth the tradeoff. Steve D. only got to the free-throw line three times all night, plus he only drove to the rim three times (maybe four, depending upon whether the two FTs he hit at the end of the first half were on a two-shot foul or a simple one-and-one in which he made both ends of the bonus), making two out of his three layup attempts.

I'll be the first one to say it here: Brian Evans is making a serious case for first-team All-CCIW. He's averaging double figures in points for the second-place team, he's leading the league in rebounding by over a full carom per game over #2 (Tim McCrary), and he's up near the top in assists and steals. On a team loaded with freshmen and sophomores, he's the best example of senior leadership in the entire league.

[Titan Q]

People in this room gave NPU all kinds of crap when the Vikings played a zone against Carthage last year and Steve Djurickovic proceeded to have an 8-for-10 night from beyond the arc.

As one of the crap givers (below), I will simply clarify that I did not necessarily question the concept of playing zone...but rather how NPU played it that particular night.  I remember watching that game, and it seemed like NPU just did not cover any of the Carthage shooters at all.  It seemed like once it was clear zone was not going to work, NPU should have come out of it sooner, or made changes to play it more effectively.

I think that was what I was thinking at the time.

It was one of the most ineffective zones I've ever seen.  I was just watching on video, but Carthage shooters were firing up uncontested 3's with their feet set and all kinds of time.  When NPU came out of the zone, they still couldn't find the Carthage shooters.

[Gregory Sager]

Although the season is going south in a major way for North Park right now, there was some good news from last night. The North Park JV, which upped its record to 7-1 last night (which includes wins over both of the CCIW JV teams it's played thus far), got an impressive new addition: Mike Gabriel, a 6'8, 230 freshman who comes to the Vikings from Lincoln Park HS via Quinnipiac University out in Connecticut. I'm not sure why he chose Quinnipiac when he had a couple of offers out here in the midwest (NIU and Detroit), but he wasn't happy there and decided to give back his scholarship and come home after one semester. He did play in seven of the first eleven games of the season for the Bobcats, averaging 2.7 ppg and 1.7 rpg in about eight minutes per game of playing time, with his best game a 10-point effort against Yale in the season opener. Since NCAA rules allow a student-athlete to play immediately after transferring from a scholarship level to D3, Gabriel became instantly eligible for NPU and holds freshman eligibility status.

It's not often that you see a player go straight from a D1 varsity to a D3 JV team, but considering that Gabriel hasn't even practiced with the Vikings yet (he just cleared his physical two days ago) and hadn't played since Quinnipiac's game against Boston University back on December 29, it's understandable why he wasn't thrown into the fire right away on varsity. In limited JV minutes last night he scored five points, grabbed a couple of rebounds, took two charges (and tried to take a third), and generally looked like a smart, communicative, basketball-savvy kid who knows what he's doing out on the court. I'm hesitant to make predictions about such things, but he looks like he could have a great career as a Viking.

[Titan Q]

Although the season is going south in a major way for North Park right now, there was some good news from last night. The North Park JV, which upped its record to 7-1 last night (which includes wins over both of the CCIW JV teams it's played thus far), got an impressive new addition: Mike Gabriel, a 6'8, 230 freshman who comes to the Vikings from Lincoln Park HS via Quinnipiac University out in Connecticut. I'm not sure why he chose Quinnipiac when he had a couple of offers out here in the midwest (NIU and Detroit), but he wasn't happy there and decided to give back his scholarship and come home after one semester. He did play in seven of the first eleven games of the season for the Bobcats, averaging 2.7 ppg and 1.7 rpg in about eight minutes per game of playing time, with his best game a 10-point effort against Yale in the season opener. Since NCAA rules allow a student-athlete to play immediately after transferring from a scholarship level to D3, Gabriel became instantly eligible for NPU and holds freshman eligibility status.

It's not often that you see a player go straight from a D1 varsity to a D3 JV team, but considering that Gabriel hasn't even practiced with the Vikings yet (he just cleared his physical two days ago) and hadn't played since Quinnipiac's game against Boston University back on December 29, it's understandable why he wasn't thrown into the fire right away on varsity. In limited JV minutes last night he scored five points, grabbed a couple of rebounds, took two charges (and tried to take a third), and generally looked like a smart, communicative, basketball-savvy kid who knows what he's doing out on the court. I'm hesitant to make predictions about such things, but he looks like he could have a great career as a Viking.

Wow.  I'd categorize this as a big deal.

[AndOne]

NCC's Brian Evans had 12 pts and 14 rebounds tonight...

http://athletics.carthage.edu/custompages/men's%20basketball/2011%20stats/ncc1.htm

http://athletics.carthage.edu/news/2011/1/19/Mens_Basketball_0119115351.aspx


"Close but not good enough has become a way-too-familiar refrain," said Carthage coach Bosko Djurickovic. "Good teams win games like these. We've now lost four home games, and we've put ourselves in a very difficult position in the CCIW. North Central plays with nice energy, and we didn't play particularly well. We looked like we had never seen a zone defense in our lives. Malcom Kelly's third foul really hurt us, as well. Steve Djurickovic wasn't very alive tonight, and we seemed to be chasing shots. They really out-rebounded us, 41-22. Brian Evans is a warrior for them. He's a winner, and he really gets the job done. We're finding a way to be short, and given the expectations going into the season, that's disappointing. There was a lot of talk in the summer about how good this team might be—it's not going to happen."   

I'll be the first one to say it here: Brian Evans is making a serious case for first-team All-CCIW. He's averaging double figures in points for the second-place team, he's leading the league in rebounding by over a full carom per game over #2 (Tim McCrary), and he's up near the top in assists and steals. On a team loaded with freshmen and sophomores, he's the best example of senior leadership in the entire league.

I began touting Brian's suitability for all conference status last year. However, as usual, I wasn't taken very seriously. especially given NCC's place in the final standings.
As we all know all-conference recognition is often a function of where a team finishes as much as it is dependent on a player's performance. Accordingly, it was unrealistic to believe a third NCC player would be voted to the all CCIW team last season in light of the deserved election of Derek Raridon and David Twyman.
With Brian's exploits now garnering acknowledgement and recognition from coaches and other posters alike, perhaps the fruits of his labors will come to fruition this year.

As one of only 2 seniors on the team, and the only one seeing regular playing time, Brian is indeed leading by example. In addition to being the league leader in both offensive rebounding and total rebounding, he has lately been dicin' and slicin' his way to the hoop (43 points in his last 4 games), and swervin' and servin' (21 assists in those 4 games).

[AndOne]

Winners are NCC, IWU, Augie and Elmhurst. The only close one at the end was NCC at Carthage, where Carthage missed a FT that would have tied the game with 16 secs. to go. Two NCC FTs wrapped it up 66-63. NCC should be fired up going to Augie with a chance to play for first place on Saturday.

Fired up indeed!
The (western) Vikings are a superior club with a plethora of weapons, outstanding coaching, and a spotless record.
Regardless of the outcome, you'll see a maximum effort from the Cardinals.

[AndOne]

Home win = +0
Road win = +1
Home loss = -1
Road loss = +0


+/- Standings through 1/19
Augustana +2
North Central +2
Illinois Wesleyan +1
Wheaton +0
Carthage -1
Elmhurst -1
Millikin -1
North Park -2

(Usually takes +4 to win the title)


Saturday, 1/22
Carthage @ Millikin
Wheaton @ Elmhurst
Illinois Wesleyan @ North Park
North Central @ Augustana

To the majority of fans NOT associated with North Central who say they're not surprised with the Cardinal's current tie for 2nd place with wins over favored Wheaton and Carthage, and an OT loss to IWU, I'd like to introduce you to my friend Pinocchio! 

[AndOne]

Titan Q .... well at least the color guy didn't say "Crotchnitzky was itching for the ball", hopefully! 

Beautiful!

[AndOne]

http://athletics.carthage.edu/news/2011/1/19/Mens_Basketball_0119115351.aspx


"Close but not good enough has become a way-too-familiar refrain," said Carthage coach Bosko Djurickovic. "Good teams win games like these. We've now lost four home games, and we've put ourselves in a very difficult position in the CCIW. North Central plays with nice energy, and we didn't play particularly well. We looked like we had never seen a zone defense in our lives. Malcom Kelly's third foul really hurt us, as well. Steve Djurickovic wasn't very alive tonight, and we seemed to be chasing shots. They really out-rebounded us, 41-22. Brian Evens is a warrior for them. He's a winner, and he really gets the job done. We're finding a way to be short, and given the expectations going into the season, that's disappointing. There was a lot of talk in the summer about how good this team might be—it's not going to happen."  

When was the last time Stevie D was held to 10 points?  Wow, Carthage is indeed in trouble.  

The NCC win over favored Carthage Wed night was largely a function of 1) stopping the bleeding, 2) superior board work, 3) a failure in recognition on the part of the Red Men, 4) defensive intensity, and 5) poor Carthage FT shooting in the clutch.

1. With 8:07 left in the 1st half and Carthage holding a 13 point lead and threatening to add to that primarily on the hot shooting of Malcom Kelly and the seemingly irresistible inside force of Tyler Pierce, into the breech stepped NCC's Brad Hallstein. In the course of 2 1/2 minutes, Brad hit two 2s and a 3 to stop the bleeding and enable the Cardinals to trail by only 2 at the half after Derek Raridon hit a 3 as time expired. In that last 8:07, the only Carthage points came on 2 Steve D. free throws with 18 seconds remaining.  
2. The Cards outrebounded the hosts by a whopping 41-22. Carthage shot blocker deluxe Mitch Thompson, who doesn't seem to like the rough stuff underneath had only 4 boards, and the Round Mound of Rebound finished with just 2. The lopsided NCC advantage was largely responsible for the Cards 20-3 advantage in 2nd chance points.
3 & 4. As many good basketball fans and analysts know, one of the best ways to bust zone coverage is through quick transition. However, after either a made basket or a defensive rebound, the Red Men seemed content to walk the ball up and start to slowly probe the Cardinal zone rather than quickly advancing upcourt before the Cards could get back and set the defense. Its a little surprising that Bosko didn't at least try more of an up tempo attack.
Instead of one of the "normal" zone configurations. the NCC employed a type of hybrid zone that effective limited Steve D's looks and turned him into a server instead of a scorer for the evening. The Red Men hoisted up 22 3s, many forced against good pressure.
5.) Carthage missed 3 critical FTs in the last few minutes of the game, including one by Malcom Kelly with 16 seconds left that would have tied the game.      

Malcom Kelly was on fire for Carthage in the 1st half, hitting 3 of 4 from downtown. The 3 he successfully banked were things of beauty--great form and release with an almost majestic arc. However, NCC tightened the screws in the 2nd stanza, forcing Malcom into a 3/11 2nd half performance, including 1/7 on threes, and going 0/3 from the line.

Much has previously been made of the shape Raul Guzman and Tyler Pierce are in (or aren't in) with Titan Q and, I believe, some other posters referring to them as an "embarrassment." Guzman played 9 minutes in the 1st half and hit 2/3 threes. For whatever reason, he did not see the court in the 2nd half. Pierce was seemingly unstoppable inside for much of the game and displayed a deft touch from the line. He used to be listed on the Carthage roster as being 230. This has recently been bumped up to 250. However, he looks every bit as big as Guzman who is listed as being 280. In light of his very nice game Wed night, its difficult to imagine how good he might be if he did weigh 230.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Another scheduling oddity I just noticed - the IWU at Elmhurst game will be Friday, 2-4, rather than Saturday, 2-5.  Anyone know why?

[bopol]

From a purely Carthage prospective, this team is just getting darn shallow.

Against North Park, they didn't get any rebounding out of Malcom Kelly or Nick Bauch, who have been the two hitting the boards the hardest.  I'm impressed with Bauch's play of late; more so than I was early in the year, but he only had 2 boards last night.  Kelly does crash the boards, but didn't do as much (maybe because of the foul trouble) and didn't have many against North Park.

The bench was darn shallow.  Max Cary is hurt, and he could have easily covered for Kelly's foul trouble.  Nick Kladis missed the game with migranes, and while his ball handling skills are not great; he does play hard defense and is a good 3-pointer shooter, so he could have covered for Kelly a bit as well.  Guzman has had problems with back spasms, and his shooting could have helped in the second half.  Most of the extra minutes went to Jon Cieski, who had a season high 28 minutes.  

Steve D seemed to be lacking intensity.  I hate to sound like I'm knocking him, because I enjoy watching him play, but he didn't seem to be handling the ball as much as he should have been and didn't seem to be slashing into the basket as much.  He's a notch worse than last year, and Carthage couldn't afford the dropoff in performance.

And Malcom Kelly, who played a very good game otherwise, missed 3 foul shots (including the front end of a 1 and 1 and another chance to tie the game) in the late second half.

Like Bosko said, just good enough to lose a close game.  

[Titan Q]

Home win = +0
Road win = +1
Home loss = -1
Road loss = +0


+/- Standings through 1/19
Augustana +2
North Central +2
Illinois Wesleyan +1
Wheaton +0
Carthage -1
Elmhurst -1
Millikin -1
North Park -2

(Usually takes +4 to win the title)


Saturday, 1/22
Carthage @ Millikin
Wheaton @ Elmhurst
Illinois Wesleyan @ North Park
North Central @ Augustana

[Titan Q]

To me, the story tonight is around 3 road teams...

* Wheaton (2-3) desperately needs a win @ Elmhurst (2-3).  Dropping to 2-4 would really put the Thunder in a difficult early position in terms of finishing in the top 4.

* North Central (4-1), the league's surprise team of 2011 so far, has an opportunity to steal one on the road and really get in great position tonight @ Augustana (5-0).  After this game, NCC will have 4 of 7 road games out of the way...including those vs the preseason top 3 (Carthage, IWU, Augustana).  

* IWU (4-1) cannot afford a loss tonight @ North Park (1-4) - a place the Titans lost last year and won by just 3 in 2009.