MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[izzy stradlin]

Regardless of the depth of their rosters, it seems that Schauer/Harris seem to tighten up their rotations as the games get bigger. 

I think a lot of the depth in Wheaton's program right now is not seeing varsity time.   

[wheels81]

               Wheaton's Starting 5     
                        GP-GS Min/G   FG%  3PT%    FT%  R/G    A/G  STL BLK PTS/G
                            6-6   37.5  .607  .000      .745    8.8     2.5  12   5    22.8
                            5-4   30.8  .404  .143      .762    3.2     3.6   4   2     12.0                 
                            6-6   28.0  .565  .000      .630    5.7     0.7   1  10    11.5
                            6-6   30.3  .333  .350      .625    2.5     1.3   6   0     8.5
                            6-6   33.7  .483  .467      .750    3.8     3.7  10   1    7.3
       IW's starting 5
                         GP-GS Min/G   FG%   3PT%   FT%  R/G    A/G  STL  BLK  PTS/G
                            6-6    29.8   .469   .388     .870    2.7    1.2    3      1     16.5
                            6-6    22.7   .396   .154     .700    4.3     1      3      3       9.0
                            6-6    25.8   .579   .000     .381    6.3     1.5   5      3       8.7
                            6-6    29.8   .326   .182     .625    2.7     2      6      1       6.7
                            6-6    29.8   .412   .467     .611    2.7     4.2   7      0       7.7


Conference Stat's only.
So from criteria posted earlier by Q then I would say that Wheaton's starters are more than a tad better than IW's starters.
Just saying IF Wheaton went deeper on their bench more often I believe they would match the numbers posted by IW bench.    They definitely have the talent just hard to fix what's not broken.  Watch out for Peter Smith and the rest of the youngsters as season goes through 2nd round of conf. play.

[Titan Q]

Augustana 70
Wheaton 46


A really rough night in Rock Island for the Thunder.  Wheaton struggled mightily on both ends of the floor in this one.

Augie looked great.  Brian DeSimone had a great 1st half for the Vikings as they opened up a huge lead. 

Only 519 fans tonight at the Carver Center for this huge game. 

http://www.augustana.edu/athletics/mbasketball/stats/2011-12/12mbb18.htm

[Titan Q]

Illinois Wesleyan 75
Millikin 53


* Jordan Zimmer: 22 pts, 3 reb
* Victor Davis: 19 pts, 8 reb
* Andrew Ziemnik: 12 pts, 8 reb


A misleading final score as IWU's lead hovered around just 11 or so most of the game.  IWU went on a 15-0 run from about the 7:00 mark to 1:00 in the 2nd half.  The game was never in doubt, but it was not a blowout either.

http://www.iwusports.com/custompages/MBB/MBB2012/HTML/iwmbk18.htm

[Titan Q]

North Central 73
North Park 54
http://northcentralcardinals.com/custompages/MBK/mbk1112/Mbk18.htm


Carthage 77
Elmhurst 58
http://athletics.carthage.edu/boxscore.aspx?id=1508

[Titan Q]

Standings through 1/24
Illinois Wesleyan: 6-1
North Central: 6-1
Wheaton: 5-2
Augustana: 4-3
Carthage: 3-4
Elmhurst: 3-4
North Park: 1-6
Millikin: 0-7

+/- standings through 1/24 (no movement tonight as 4 home teams won)
(+1 for road wins, -1 for home losses)

Illinois Wesleyan: +2
North Central: +2
Wheaton: +2
Augustana: +0
Carthage: +0
Elmhurst: -1
North Park: -2
Millikin: -3

Saturday, 1/28
Millikin @ Augustana
North Central @ Carthage
Illinois Wesleyan @ Wheaton
Elmhurst @ North Park


IWU and North Central with a couple huge road games Saturday, with 1st place on the line.  With Wheaton's loss tonight, I'd say the Thunder are in a "must win" situation Saturday vs the Titans.  Should be a great game at King Arena.

[iwu70]

I guess Wheaton was just a little unlucky tonight. 

Titans had a pretty good game, though MU had a plan to slow everything down, keep the game close and take their shots only in the last 5-7 seconds of the shot clock.  It did keep them close.

Zimmer 22, Davis a very strong game with 19.  Molinari back and he and Musselman are in the regular rotation for some minutes tonight.  Kman is in a slump it would appear.  Ziemnik also had a strong game with 12, good rebounding, "pounding the post."  Lots of contributions in other ways by other bench / rotational players.  IWU is very deep, now the rotation is 11.

More tomorrow. 

Congrats to the Titans on holding home court and staying in first place along with NCC.

IWU70

[iwumichigander]

Good road win last night in a game the Titans expected to win against Millikin. 

Lots of contributions in other ways by other bench / rotational players.  IWU is very deep, now the rotation is 11.

I don't get too excited when the Titans go 11 deep against a struggling team.  A good opportunity to get the bench some playing time, see them in a rotation with starters and rest your starters.  A good coach just does not miss that opportunity when it presents itself.  I don't expect that a little further down the road if the Titans ( like maybe Saturday).

Sure would like to see that +2 become a +3 after the weekend.

[iwu70]

Seems Augie "righted the ship" quite admirably last night. 

IWU game was at a very un-IWU pace, with Millikin pulling the ball back, not taking any shots until late in the shot clock.  Millikin was better than I expected them to be, given all accounts and their record.  Long season for their new coach.  But, they just don't have the horses, the size, the overall offensive patterns and skills to compete with IWU's scheme, speed and especially size.  Their 6'9" guy is pretty good, and will develop into a very good CCIW player, IMHO.  Needs muscle and the summer weight room.   

Strong games last night by Zimmer, Davis, and Ziemnik.  Really seems Kman is in a slump, a funk of some sort.  He hasn't played very well since the Augie game.    Musselman and Molinari are into the rotation now, if that is Rose's decision, so 11 deep.  Musselman didn't make any major contributions last eve, and Molinari looked a bit out of pace, a bit rusty from his long lay-off.  I'm sure both will make further contributions this season, as needed.  Perhaps Oswald, too, in key situations where trey shooting is needed.  In big big away games upcoming, I'm sure Ron may well shorten the rotation, and lengthen the minutes of the key 7-8 guys who are playing well, have had rest up to now.  Surely more bigs needed vs. Augie, more quickness needed vs. WC.  Don't think a single Titan appears in the chart of "minutes played" in the CCIW stats pages -- all season or in CCIW play.  Depth and careful rotation management will do that.  Another advantage as we hit the stretch run, the key games between contenders upcoming.  Fresher legs.

Crowd of about 1100-1200 last night, not really full, but a pretty good week-day crowd.

Big game at Carver on Saturday.  Hope the Titans can get one of these key away games and go to +3.

GO TITANS!!!

IWU70

[unanimous22]

Good road win last night in a game the Titans expected to win against Millikin. 

It was at the Shirk

[Hardwood]

Seems Augie "righted the ship" quite admirably last night. 

Here's the local reports confirming the "righting" and "sinking" of the respective ships in last nights contest in Rock Island:

http://qctimes.com/sports/college/augustana/augie-men-make-statement-with-rout/article_862ac72a-470b-11e1-b921-0019bb2963f4.html

http://qconline.com/archives/qco/display.php?id=578720

[omaha]

Check out the brutal missed shot clock violation call at the end of the NYU @ Wash U women's game...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEgn-L8MKZQ&feature=youtu.be


What a tough way to lose a game!

Wow, there is just no excuse for missing that.

That's the worst blown call I've seen in years.


Actually, I think it was the right call.  Check the scoreboard in the background when the player shoots the ball from outside---there were more than three second left on the clock when she shoots and the red light on the backboard lights up (but the horn does not sound) when the ball hits the rim.  It appears to be a mistake from the scorer's bench.  The winning shot was made as the horn was going off.

[augie_superfan]

Check out the brutal missed shot clock violation call at the end of the NYU @ Wash U women's game...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bEgn-L8MKZQ&feature=youtu.be


What a tough way to lose a game!

Wow, there is just no excuse for missing that.

That's the worst blown call I've seen in years.


Actually, I think it was the right call.  Check the scoreboard in the background when the player shoots the ball from outside---there were more than three second left on the clock when she shoots and the red light on the backboard lights up (but the horn does not sound) when the ball hits the rim.  It appears to be a mistake from the scorer's bench.  The winning shot was made as the horn was going off.

There is clearly only 1 second left on the shot clock when the first shot from 3 pt is taken so it was definitely a shot clock violation.  There were about 4 seconds on the game clock when she took the 3 pointer.

[Gregory Sager]

Last night at the airplane hangar was another one of those instances in which NPU hangs around against a superior team for thirty minutes or so and then just fades away down the stretch. NCC was only up by nine with eleven minutes to go in the game, and the Cards still only had a ten-point lead as the clock went under the 8:00 mark. But then Aaron Tiknis made a pair of treys on consecutive possessions to bump the NCC lead up to 16, and that was all she wrote.

North Park shot 17-49 from the field (.347) and 5-22 from downtown (.227), and that tells you everything you need to know about this game. The Cardinals simply doubled down on the post on every NPU possession and dared the Vikings to shoot from outside. And, as everyone and his brother knows by now, the Vikings simply don't have the shooters to make anyone pay for that strategy. Take away the two stars, Mike Gabriel and Mark Holmes, plus Emanuel Crosby -- who never shoots from outside of five feet -- and the Vikings were 5-26 from the field as a team.

Gabriel (17 pts, 7 rebs) did have a solid game in spite of the double teams. His performance from the FT line (8-11) was especially encouraging. And Holmes (15 pts, 8 rebs) was strong as well, as he attacked the basket more than usual. The NPU coaching staff is pushing him to do that more often, as it is both the best use of his considerable gifts and the sort of tactic that will free up his jumpshot.

Landon Gamble (18 pts) led North Central last night. The reason why he's the best center in the league is because he's the quickest center in the league, as time and again he was able to get off his patented six-foot lefty baby hook by using that lightning-quick first step of his. Derek Raridon (15 pts) found his sweet spot -- the fourteen-footer coming off a screen while drifting left -- time and time again down the stretch, and C.J. Goldthree (15 pts) was effective as well. Charlie Rosenberg (10 pts) played well off the bench, and, although Tiknis and Kevin Gillespie didn't have strong shooting nights, NCC had more than enough clicking to pull away from the outmanned visitors.

NPU played hard last night, but, to repeat myself for the umpteenth time, it's simply a team that has too many holes to hang with a first-division CCIW team for forty minutes.

[Gregory Sager]

On my Metra trip to the airplane hangar last night I rode in a Quiet Car for the first time. I loved it. For the entirety of my 35-minute ride from Union Station to Naperville (I took the express), the only human voice I heard was the conductor's when he was taking tickets. I'd love to see the CTA put Quiet Cars on the el ... but on el trains they'd have to be called Shut The Hell Up Cars.

Guess I really got a rise out of you fine, oft-posting gentlemen with my comment about WC being "luckiest."  Of course, Wheaton is a fine program, strong team.  This is very evident.  But, they were lucky to face NCC with Goldthree out, and NCC with other injuries.  Goldthree really hurt the Titans in our game with them @NCC.  And, we all know that some games come down to a few plays, a few possessions, even one call, or one bounce of the ball, and that can, in the end, make or break a conference championship drive.  As Greg indicated, the Cardinals tried some things, supposedly correct things, at the end of regulation and in OT, and, unlucky for them, they didn't work out.  Of course, Wheaton's play probably had something to do with it, but we all know you need to be good, and, sometimes, lucky too, to win a championship.  Yes, some say you make your own luck, but sometimes you are just lucky.  (IWU women were lucky to beat Carthage at home with that last second improbable trey by Bilek, as Carthage was ahead by nine and had outplayed the Titans in most ways during almost all of the second half).  That play may be the one that wins the conference for the Titans.  Perhaps Wheaton's win in OT vs. NCC will be the key play that wins the conference for the Thunder.  I fully respect the Wheaton program and team, as I saw how good they are, how hard they play etc. -- you can check back and see my posts at the time of that game and my comments about McCrary and Garriott and their crisp, effective offense, comparing them overall to Wash U.  But, I stand by my comment, as I think any team that comes out on top this year will clearly "earn" it and also have to have, at some key moments, a little bit of "luck," too.  This is not to "discredit" anyone or any program, but just stating the reality that sometimes you can "earn it" and still lose.  Sometimes you don't earn it, and still win.  Isn't that "luck?"  (The Chinese would say "fate.").   Things sometimes just don't break your way.  Look at NYU and their loss to Wash U.  Bad luck, lousy refs.  This element of competition is one of the reasons we love it so, why it is so compelling, unpredictable, and at times wholly enjoyable and others frustratingly maddening. 

Good luck to all teams this evening, except for Millikin.  By all evidence to date, they are going to need much more than luck. 

IWU70

Luck is better left to describe events that occur in sports outside the players skill.  For example  a golfer who hits it into the trees then ends up on the green because it bounced off two squirrels fighting over an acorn is more lucky then skillful.  The players cause things to happen in basketball  being in the right place at the right time, releasing the ball,etc... that calling it luck takes credit away from their effort.  Hockey has an addage in that you keep putting puck on goal some will get it, it's not luck at all but effort.  So leave luck to the tree climbing rodents and to lottery participants.  It has no business in describing college students playing sports.

The whole "luck" thread here brings up a funny (at least to me) memory.

In 1990 I was playing and coaching football (the American variety) over in England.  Not surprisingly the sports culture there is very, very different from the US.

The second week of the season we lost a tough fought game to a team from Coventry, 12-6.  We played the exact same team 2 weeks later and were thrashed 77-3.  Upon stepping onto the bus one of my fine English teammates said, "Unlucky mate."

Unlucky?  Unlucky?       

We crossed the 50 yard line once the entire game!  We turned the ball over 8 times!  The American running back on the other team ran for 359 yards on 19 carries.  I about lost my mind.  Exactly where did luck factor in to the outcome of that game?  Unlucky that we didn't lose by 60?

I didn't know at the time, but it was very much a culture context statement.

He probably meant "unlucky" in the "now we have a two-hour busride ahead of us before some barmaid back home can pull us some pints, mate" sense of the word.

Augustana 70
Wheaton 46


A really rough night in Rock Island for the Thunder.  Wheaton struggled mightily on both ends of the floor in this one.

Augie looked great.  Brian DeSimone had a great 1st half for the Vikings as they opened up a huge lead.

I am absolutely floored by the fact that Augie held the McCrary/Garriott combo to 13 combined points on 5-21 shooting. The ten-spot ties McCrary's season low and is one off of Garriott's season low. But to play that kind of D against them simultaneously is really remarkable.

Out of curiosity, I looked up what McCrary has done against other CCIW teams throughout his career in terms of scoring. Here's his ppg against the other seven schools:

Augustana	12.0
Carthage	20.0
Elmhurst	13.6
Illinois Wesleyan	15.6
Millikin	15.9
North Central	14.4
North Park	17.9

(The low ppg against Elmhurst is somewhat misleading, because McCrary didn't score in the CCIW tourney championship game against the 'jays his freshman year. But he only took two shots in that game, which Wheaton won. Kent Raymond, Andy Wiele, and Jon Panner combined for 39 shots between them in that game. Even Jake Carwell and Andrew Jahns attempted more shots than McCrary that night. Take away that game, and McCrary's averaging a more typical 15.6 ppg against the 'jays.) Only 519 fans tonight at the Carver Center for this huge game. It was worse at the airplane hangar. Granted, NPU is not the sort of opponent that's gonna bring Cardinals fans out of the woodwork, and the Park doesn't travel well these days (there were a hardy dozen and a half of us there rooting for the royal blue and gold). But the listed attendance of 350 must've included about 150 people disguised as empty seats, because I took a head count before tipoff -- yes, the crowd was sparse enough for me to take a head count -- and I counted 151 people present who were what's normally considered to be attendees (i.e., people who are not players, coaches, training staff, or event staff). That 151 included North Central's cheerleaders, dance squad, pep band, color guard, glee club, what have you. Even if you count the people who trickled in after the opening jump, there were still no more than 200 people present. I don't get that. You'd think that this very good Cardinals team would draw more than 200 fans for a conference home game. Illinois Wesleyan 75 Millikin 53 * Jordan Zimmer: 22 pts, 3 reb * Victor Davis: 19 pts, 8 reb * Andrew Ziemnik: 12 pts, 8 reb A misleading final score as IWU's lead hovered around just 11 or so most of the game.  IWU went on a 15-0 run from about the 7:00 mark to 1:00 in the 2nd half.  The game was never in doubt, but it was not a blowout either. http://www.iwusports.com/custompages/MBB/MBB2012/HTML/iwmbk18.htm Why didn't the big fella, Brock Von Nordeck, play for the Big Blue? Anybody know? Granted, there was no way, shape, or form that Jimmy Millikin was going to win that game, under any circumstances, but the Big Blue would've certainly been more competitive if it had Von Nordeck. Not only is he the only MU player who has any size at all, he's also the team's leading scorer at 10.3 ppg.