MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[D-3 watcher]

A O  You don't have to worry about my financial portfolio, it's fine. Couple of my businesses are bars and restaurants. Everybody loves great food, and when times get tough, some need a stiff drink. I've got through some bad presidents in the past, I'll get through this one as well. So like I said I'll be ok, I'll still be able to buy you a new pair of pants that fit, those  you wear all the time, the ones that only go to your shins, I don't get it, expecting a flood??

[markerickson]

Why is Mike Gabriel listed on the North Park roster, but does not appear in the team photo and was a DNP in the opening games?

[iwu70]

Gabriel is injured, perhaps out for the season.  (according to Sager earlier).

IWU70

[iwu70]

Yes, getting a bit chippy in here . . . rather silly at times, IMHO.  Oh well, early season chatter, trashy trash talk.

On the Titans first weekend of play, I basically agree with Q's long list of impressions posted earlier.  Titans clearly a work in progress, with lots of potential to develop, get in sync.  I guess we're all surprised that Mayberger is on the floor as much as he is, but glad to see the happy outcome with his key production/play in both early games, confirming Ron Rose's judgement to have him out there.  I'm happy for Mayberger, for sure, after all the injuries, hard work to get back.  As you know from earlier posts, I've had Overstreet at the PG from some time and find it hard to believe now that he will be dislodged from that starting position in coming weeks or months, no matter.  Dylan does have good length, handles the ball well and does add a greater scoring potential from threeland and slashing as the PG.  I also think as time goes by that it will be harder and harder to dislodge Eric Dotch from the 2 as well, given his excellent perimeter D, slashing, rebounding, some scoring, just making plays all over the place, even with his offensive shortcomings.  I could see longer term some kind of defensive/offensive switching, with Dortch starting, then Zimmer/Sondemann at the 2 when more offense, perimeter shooting is needed (along with Mayberger and Oswald, too).  My only difference with Q is how well Victor Davis played this first weekend . . . we'll just have to agree to disagree on that . . . (that's why this space is called "chat" instead of "spin").  I think we got pretty much what was expected, hoped for from all the others = Zman, Reed, Musselman, Oswald and Anderson.  Nelms still finding his way, too, no scoring from him yet . . . he had some troubles on the perimeter in the second half of the Loras game when he was at PG, mainly due to an excellent, pesky Loras defender (#20) at PG on Nelms.  Gave us a bit of trouble for a time in the middle of the second half. 

As Q has mentioned, there are lots of moving parts still, a very long and complex rotation, and things will take time for everyone to be on the same page, moving in the ways Ron Rose has in mind.  It will come, but perhaps take 4-5 more games, more experimentation and effort to see how it all fits best together (or not) by late December.  I'm optimistic about it all as much talent, many useful combos are there. 

It will be interesting to see how it all goes in game #3 vs. the Blue Boys, Tuesday night at home, @The Shirk.  First weekend jitters will be gone and everyone can play more smoothly, more loosely in the coming few games.  Agree there may be a different top scorer (among 7-8 guys) each game, each night.  I hope the strong defensive intensity and the pounding rebounding is a consistent characteristic of this Titan team all year, every game.   

And, we'll get to see the women play at home this coming weekend too -- against some of the finest DIII women's teams in the nation -- as Coe, DePauw, and Wash U come into the Shirk for another tip-off-type tournament event.  A big challenge for the post-Olivia Lett era Titans.  "Run and jump" will surely be on display.

Happy Thanksgiving to all the CCIW chatsters . . . have a blessed, happy and safe holiday break.  We can all count our blessings . . . not least our enjoyment of loyalties to family, friends, college and country . . . and our life-long friendships through education and sports.

Be well, perhaps go out and see the exceptional new film, "Lincoln."   It is outstanding. 

IWU70

[AndOne]

IWU70--

Wouldn't worry about Davis. He is too good to continue posting the type of numbers he has over the first 2 games.
I think the focus should be on the development of the guard rotation.

[AndOne]

And before you also mention it again I DO also remember that you ARE the guy with the private jet and personal pilot who has made it to Salem every time the Titans have participated. By the way, hows the recent election result looking as far as your future taxes are concerned?   

D-3 watcher, I could use a pickup Tuesday here in Lincoln, NE for the Illinois College game.  Can you send the jet?  E-mail me...thanks.

Also, I know a good tax guy here in Nebraska -- per AndOne, it sounds like you have some Obama-based tax problems.  I can have him jump on the plane and maybe you guys can chat at the Shirk while the Titans face the Blue Boys?  Let me know.

Very good. 

[AndOne]

A O  You don't have to worry about my financial portfolio, it's fine. Couple of my businesses are bars and restaurants. Everybody loves great food, and when times get tough, some need a stiff drink. I've got through some bad presidents in the past, I'll get through this one as well. So like I said I'll be ok, I'll still be able to buy you a new pair of pants that fit, those  you wear all the time, the ones that only go to your shins, I don't get it, expecting a flood??

D-3,

I'm not worried at all. Even after you pay those higher taxes you'll still be a rich guy.
But I do worry that you may have consumed too many of you own stiff drinks.
And congrats--I hadn't previously realized that fashion critic was one of your many talents.
I guess when you're used to wearing those extra baggy old man pants that drag on the ground, everything seems short.
By the way, I wasn't wearing pants Saturday night!! Those were my longer winter boxers. I lost my pants earlier in the day filming a TV commercial:  http://www.progressive.com/commercials/pants-on-fire.aspx

Alas, No mas pantalones!  

[AndOne]

I posted this in the CCIW football room, but as I suspect most all the IWU dual football/basketball posters have transferred their attention to the basketball side, I've copied that post here as the situation pertains to all players who fall under the same circumstances, no matter what the sport they participate in.

CCIWers--

If I remember my conversation with Mr/Mrs Gallik before the IWU/NCC football game correctly, this is the week that their son, IWU QB Rob was probably going to have reconstructive surgery on his knee. If so, heres hoping for a successful procedure, coupled with a full recovery. Good luck to Rob.

[iwu70]

AO, I'm not worried about Victor Davis as I know he's a really good player.  I'm sure he'll have a great season.  Perhaps he's just a slow starter, and will come on stronger as the season progresses, like he did last year.  It's early.  I actually am also very optimistic about the IWU perimeter situation, as I think Overstreet and Dortch have played pretty well, all things considered, this early.  Of course, will be nice to have Sodemann and Zimmer back and healthy.  I saw Sodemann in the G/W scrimmage and liked his game, before he went down with the groin issue.  Zimmer will have to get fully healthy, get back his game legs and full-time game conditioning.  We know he can shoot it, slash, and extend the floor . . . I think only a matter of time, assuming he's healthy.  Not as sure on Molinari coming back, contributing, as I think Overstreet pretty much has the PG situation in hand, with Nelms filling in for now.  We'll see.  IWU bigs are going to have some big games . . . perhaps a different one each game, perhaps more than one.  Will be great when the Titans are fully healthy and hitting on all cylinders.  Then we'll truly see the great potential of this deep team.

I agree on Gallik . . . hope he and all the other CCIW injured footballers have good treatments, surgeries and full healing, recovery as soon as possible.

Happy Thanksgiving to all.

IWU70

[martin]

We all remember this about U. of Chicago's big recruiting news a year ago...

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2011/11/a_true_recruiting_coup.html


It certainly looks like 6-4 guard Jordan Smith (Whitney Young H.S.) is the real deal.  Through his first 3 collegiate games he is averaging 18 ppg.

http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-bios-2012-13/mbk-bio-2012-13-smith.htm

http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/teamcume.htm


Mike McGrath's Maroons could be a big-time sleeper in the UAA and Midwest region this year.

I watched the Maroons play today. I have to agree with toooldtohoop; right now the Maroons are playing a lot of one-on-one ball. It's quite a shock to the system for those of us who over the years have gotten used to watching Chicago play some of the most meticulously-patterned basketball in the region (with the triple post set, in particular). Now the Maroons are very wide open and try to beat you off the dribble -- no surprise, when you consider that they have Whitney Young alumnus Jordan Smith, Westchester St. Joe alumnus Wayne Simon (who played two years of D1 ball at American), and the fleet-footed Royce Muskeyvalley on the team, all of whom are excellent slashers. Kudos to U of C coach Mike McGrath for recognizing that he has more perimeter athletic talent right now than he's ever had before -- or is ever likely to have at 56th and Ellis -- and adjusting his team's style accordingly.

And, yeah, they do look unimpressive on defense. But that's a function of their youth. Smith and fellow former Whitney Young Dolphin Nate Brooks are freshmen, as is sharp-shooting guard John Steinberg, and Muskeyvalley's only a sophomore. It's a young team, and young teams usually don't defend well.

Jordan Smith has had a great start - 17.7 ppg and 4.7 boards - in three games.  It is rare for freshmen to have an impact.  I do not count Steve Djurickovic - he never really was a freshman.  Adam Dauksas started as a freshman and was good but on a good team where he could blend in.  The last CCIW freshman to have a big impact was Drew Carstens in 2000-1. 

Is it easier for a guard than a big man?  I think Chicago's Nate Brooks has enormous potential but is not at Smith's level yet.  Keelan Amelianovich did little as a freshman - played limited minutes in 18 games.  As a sophomore he was MOP in the CCIW.  But then Derek Reich was UAA Player of the Year all four years.

Maybe the point is that it takes a special player to have an impact as a freshman.

[AndOne]

We all remember this about U. of Chicago's big recruiting news a year ago...

http://blogs.suntimes.com/hoopsreport/2011/11/a_true_recruiting_coup.html


It certainly looks like 6-4 guard Jordan Smith (Whitney Young H.S.) is the real deal.  Through his first 3 collegiate games he is averaging 18 ppg.

http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/mbk-bios-2012-13/mbk-bio-2012-13-smith.htm

http://athletics.uchicago.edu/mensbasketball/teamcume.htm


Mike McGrath's Maroons could be a big-time sleeper in the UAA and Midwest region this year.

I watched the Maroons play today. I have to agree with toooldtohoop; right now the Maroons are playing a lot of one-on-one ball. It's quite a shock to the system for those of us who over the years have gotten used to watching Chicago play some of the most meticulously-patterned basketball in the region (with the triple post set, in particular). Now the Maroons are very wide open and try to beat you off the dribble -- no surprise, when you consider that they have Whitney Young alumnus Jordan Smith, Westchester St. Joe alumnus Wayne Simon (who played two years of D1 ball at American), and the fleet-footed Royce Muskeyvalley on the team, all of whom are excellent slashers. Kudos to U of C coach Mike McGrath for recognizing that he has more perimeter athletic talent right now than he's ever had before -- or is ever likely to have at 56th and Ellis -- and adjusting his team's style accordingly.

And, yeah, they do look unimpressive on defense. But that's a function of their youth. Smith and fellow former Whitney Young Dolphin Nate Brooks are freshmen, as is sharp-shooting guard John Steinberg, and Muskeyvalley's only a sophomore. It's a young team, and young teams usually don't defend well.

Jordan Smith has had a great start - 17.7 ppg and 4.7 boards - in three games.  It is rare for freshmen to have an impact.  I do not count Steve Djurickovic - he never really was a freshman.  Adam Dauksas started as a freshman and was good but on a good team where he could blend in.  The last CCIW freshman to have a big impact was Drew Carstens in 2000-1. 

Is it easier for a guard than a big man?  I think Chicago's Nate Brooks has enormous potential but is not at Smith's level yet.  Keelan Amelianovich did little as a freshman - played limited minutes in 18 games.  As a sophomore he was MOP in the CCIW.  But then Derek Reich was UAA Player of the Year all four years.

Maybe the point is that it takes a special player to have an impact as a freshman.

Martin,

There has been at least one freshman to have made what I would call a big impact since 2001.
If you will remember, at the conclusion of the 2009-2010 season CCIW member North Central player Derek Raridon was named the D3 National Freshman Of The Year. I think it can be said he made a fairly big impact. Since then he has been named to the All-Region team, and this year he was named a pre-season All-American.
Another pre-season All-American this season, Landon Gamble, was all-conference, all-region, and the regional freshman of the year in 2010-2011.

I think you're certainly correct though when you you say it takes a special player to have an impact as a freshman.
Not only is it rare for a freshman to make a "big" impact, but if I'm not mistaken, I don't think its usual for more than a handful of freshmen to even start each year in the CCIW. Others would know the specific numbers better than me.

[devossed]

Final from the airplane hangar:

NCC 60
Hope 49

Derek Raridon had 21 and Landon Gamble had 10 for NCC.

It was back-and-forth until the last five minutes or so, at which point Hope stopped scoring and the Cards slowly opened up the lead.

It was a real foulfest, too. All four NCC bigs finished with four fouls apiece. Hope's star inside player Nate Snuggerud, who had four fouls in the first half alone, fouled out while only playing about ten minutes all night, while 6'10 Nate VanArendonk and west suburban product Brock Benson had four fouls apiece for the Dutch.

http://miaa.org/mbb/stats/1213/mbk02.htm
NCC held Hope to 1 FG in the games final 10 minutes........which was one less than the number of FG's NCC scored in those same minutes.  From 46-44 it was nearly all Ft's for both teams. 

Sort of an unusual finish to a game.

An unusual finish to be sure.

However, much more well played by NCC than Hope in that the Cardinals dictated play by going right at Hope.
Over the last 3:52 of the game, NCC went to the line 7 times, making 6, as compared to no FT attempts by Hope. This was a tactical error by the visitors as in addition to creating a chance or chances from the line, they could have disqualified one or more of the Cardinals, 4 of whom had 4 fouls apiece by that time. No NCC player wound up fouling out.

Any reason that Landon Gamble did not start?

So, anyone know why he didn't start? Wasn't he a preseason all-american?

[Titan Q]

Article from the Pantagraph leading into the IWU/Illinois College game...

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/basketball/men/iwu-s-mayberger-has-confidence-of-coach-with-quick-start/article_5c44f130-32d1-11e2-b8e2-0019bb2963f4.html

Key players for the Blue Boys:

G - Spencer Campbell, 5-8 Jr - 9.0 ppg, 2.5 rpg, 4.5 apg - http://www.illinoiscollegeathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1032&path=mbball
G - Nathan Koehler, 5-11 Jr - 15.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 4.5 apg - http://www.illinoiscollegeathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1045&path=mbball
G - Justin Smith, 6-3 Jr - 2.0 ppg, 1.5 rpg - http://www.illinoiscollegeathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1036&path=mbball
F - Brandon Berry, 6-5/205 Jr - 11.5 ppg, 5.5 rpg - http://www.illinoiscollegeathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1052&path=mbball
C - Isaac Grapperhaus, 6-6/240 Sr - 8.5 ppg, 7.0 rpg - http://www.illinoiscollegeathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1047&path=mbball

G - Zeke Light, 6-1 Jr - 9.5 ppg, 3.5 rpg - http://www.illinoiscollegeathletics.com/roster.aspx?rp_id=1038&path=mbball


Illinois College (1-1) beat Blackburn 80-41 and lost to Dubuque 60-66.

[martin]

Martin,

There has been at least one freshman to have made what I would call a big impact since 2001.
If you will remember, at the conclusion of the 2009-2010 season CCIW member North Central player Derek Raridon was named the D3 National Freshman Of The Year. I think it can be said he made a fairly big impact. Since then he has been named to the All-Region team, and this year he was named a pre-season All-American.
Another pre-season All-American this season, Landon Gamble, was all-conference, all-region, and the regional freshman of the year in 2010-2011.

I think you're certainly correct though when you you say it takes a special player to have an impact as a freshman.
Not only is it rare for a freshman to make a "big" impact, but if I'm not mistaken, I don't think its usual for more than a handful of freshmen to even start each year in the CCIW. Others would know the specific numbers better than me.

I forgot about Derek Raridon.  He is too recent.  I may need to worry about early onset dementia - you remember things from the distant past but have a harder time with more recent events.  A case can also be made for Landon Gamble.  Raridon had many of the nature/nurture advantages that Steve Djurickovic had.

The strategy that John Calipari uses is very high risk.  I think Calipari is a jerk but have no objection to him building his teams around "one and done" players.  I object more to the NBA making them wait a year before they can start their chosen profession.  It is hard to win with a bunch of freshmen no matter how talented they are. Calipari has shown that it can work.  You just need to get almost all of the NBA ready players who are forced to spend a year in college before moving on.  But if there are not that many of those players in a given year and you do not get enough of them, you will not be very good. 

[kiko]

Jordan Smith has had a great start - 17.7 ppg and 4.7 boards - in three games.  It is rare for freshmen to have an impact.  I do not count Steve Djurickovic - he never really was a freshman.  Adam Dauksas started as a freshman and was good but on a good team where he could blend in.  The last CCIW freshman to have a big impact was Drew Carstens in 2000-1. 

I don't know that it is fair to dismiss Steve Djurickovic so easily unless you are simply aiming to narrow the conversation enough to bubble all of your Maroons to the top of the list.  Yes, he basically grew up on the court, and came in with a rarified level of ability and court sense.  But to have an 18-year-old's body and dominate as much as he did amongst 21/22-year-olds is no easy feat.  To his credit, there wasn't really any transition period in which he struggled.