MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[veterancciwfan]

2 interesting (to me, at least) IWU stats after 14 games: 1) IWU has 11 players who average at least 12 minutes per game & 2) 10 players who average at least 5 points per game.  Depth is not a problem. If a healthy Marietti is able to play 28 minutes like he did Saturday, IWU should be better in the last 11 games than they were in the first 14.

[Greek Tragedy]

How important do you really think that is (in the current season only)? Whitewater won the National Championship with an 8-man rotation (2 of the 3 non-starters would log double-digit minutes, but rarely all 3 in one game, so 7 1/2-man rotation?). I think depth on a bench is a little overrated.

[sac]

How important do you really think that is (in the current season only)? Whitewater won the National Championship with an 8-man rotation (2 of the 3 non-starters would log double-digit minutes, but rarely all 3 in one game, so 7 1/2-man rotation?). I think depth on a bench is a little overrated.

Depends on the pace you play at, if you're an up-tempo team with a deep bench that deep bench can be very valuable.    It can be very difficult to play up-tempo with a short bench.   But if you play slow and have a deep bench that bench might only help you a lot if you get in foul trouble, and obviously if you play a slower tempo you might not need much of a bench.

There are plenty of successful coaches who swear by an 8 man rotation, plenty of others who adore a deep team.  Plenty of other who shorten their benches depending on the importance of a particular game.

[Pat Coleman]

How important do you really think that is (in the current season only)? Whitewater won the National Championship with an 8-man rotation (2 of the 3 non-starters would log double-digit minutes, but rarely all 3 in one game, so 7 1/2-man rotation?). I think depth on a bench is a little overrated.

If you stay healthy and have media timeouts at your disposal, you can definitely get away with that.

[iwumichigander]

How important do you really think that is (in the current season only)? Whitewater won the National Championship with an 8-man rotation (2 of the 3 non-starters would log double-digit minutes, but rarely all 3 in one game, so 7 1/2-man rotation?). I think depth on a bench is a little overrated.

If you stay healthy and have media timeouts at your disposal, you can definitely get away with that.

But if you have injury problems and/or play at a fast pace you generally need a deeper bench.  If you want to go far into the post season, players 8-10 need to be able to contribute.  It is no fun seeing your team at final four with one or more key players out with injuries or illness.   You are usually done without playing one!

[sac]

Depth can also be subjective.  There are lots of teams that play 9, 10, 11 guys or more, but really are only 6 or 7 players deep.  The rest are really just minute eaters.

I generally prefer teams with more than 8 for the precise reason iwumichigander points out, injuries happen, fouls happen, sickness happens, best to have someone who has played and may be able to contribute than have to go to someone in an important situation who's barely played at all because you stuck with an 8 man rotation.  7 and 8 man teams have always felt restrictive to me in how they can play the game.

[iwumichigander]

Depth can also be subjective.  There are lots of teams that play 9, 10, 11 guys or more, but really are only 6 or 7 players deep.  The rest are really just minute eaters.

I generally prefer teams with more than 8 for the precise reason iwumichigander points out, injuries happen, fouls happen, sickness happens, best to have someone who has played and may be able to contribute than have to go to someone in an important situation who's barely played at all because you stuck with an 8 man rotation.  7 and 8 man teams have always felt restrictive to me in how they can play the game.

I recognize many teams do not have the luxury of a really deep bench.  But when you do, use it.  And, in fairness, I also recognize two of our IWU guys coming off the bench now either saw time as a starter or among first off the bench last season whom had early injuries this season seeing no or limited time in the non-conference games.  Both seeing significant playing time now and why the bench points look so gaudy.

[veterancciwfan]

One other reason depth can be positive: A team might have 5 better than average guards (IWU does). Maybe both starting guards are having off shooting nights. It happens. Even 1st team all-conf. players have bad nights. A team with depth can substitute, allowing a #3-#5 guard to contribute. A team that plays only 8 will have only 1 substitute guard. It's an old argument. Bridges usually preferred an 8-man rotation, especially once conference play began, and he had much success doing it. The other point I'll make is this: If a star starter is playing hard at both ends of the floor in an up-tempo game, that player will be tired after 5-6 minutes. On the other hand, Korey Coon played 40 minutes every night and would play 50 in a double OT game. There is no right or wrong answer. It just comes down to the coach's decision about the best way to win the game.

[cardinalpride]

How important do you really think that is (in the current season only)? Whitewater won the National Championship with an 8-man rotation (2 of the 3 non-starters would log double-digit minutes, but rarely all 3 in one game, so 7 1/2-man rotation?). I think depth on a bench is a little overrated.

IMO,
Having a quality bench helps the overall development of your team. The entire team benefits when you have 5 or more quality kids practicing against your starters day in and day out.

[cardinalpride]

How important do you really think that is (in the current season only)? Whitewater won the National Championship with an 8-man rotation (2 of the 3 non-starters would log double-digit minutes, but rarely all 3 in one game, so 7 1/2-man rotation?). I think depth on a bench is a little overrated.

If you stay healthy and have media timeouts at your disposal, you can definitely get away with that.

But if you have injury problems and/or play at a fast pace you generally need a deeper bench.  If you want to go far into the post season, players 8-10 need to be able to contribute.  It is no fun seeing your team at final four with one or more key players out with injuries or illness.   You are usually done without playing one!

Precisely,
Recent IWU success in the tournament can be contributed to their depth. Because of the D 3 tournament format (weekend quads), teams with quality depth have an advantage if they're fortunate  to make it to day two of the back to back.

[iwu70]

Cardinalpride makes very good points here.  Plus, having depth, experience from one year to the next helps you build your program, a system, and have a team the following year that has a very good foundation of experienced players who have been through the wars -- CCIW and D3 tourney.  A big advantage when returning to those wars year in and year out. 

NCC vs. AC should be a great battle.  I stand by my NCC by 3. 

Sun and clear blue skies have returned to Hong Kong -- it is 65+ today . . . and "winter."  LOL

All best to the CCIW chatster community.

IWU70

[AppletonRocks]

When will the NCAA ask the CCIW to play a showcase conference game in London or Sao Paulo?  It can only be a matter of time.    Does Sager speak any foreign languages so we can get a bilingual call online.

[iwu70]

Of course, I'm hoping for a "showcase CCIW conference game" in Hong Kong some day!  Plenty of good students in the CCIW now from China who could make the call . . . in Mandarin and in Cantonese.  Great food, plenty to see out here . . . on the Far Side. 

Here we go for now -- NCC vs. the Doggies.  May the best team win.

IWU70

[Wildcat]

 Elmhurst is doing well this season,I believe. Because of there depth on the bench, as well as the coaching. They have been building up to something special. Hopefully a berth in the conference tournament. Some teams can play better with a short bench, some can,t. Thats where a good coach like John Baines shines.

[Titan Q]

Illinois Wesleyan (10-4, 2-1) vs Millikin (6-8, 1-2), 7:00pm...

Illinois Wesleyan (10-4, 2-1)
G - Dylan Overstreet, 6-3/180 Sr. (10.9 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 4.9 apg)
G - Jordan Nelson, 6-1/170 Sr. (8.6 ppg, 0.8 rpg, 1.7 apg)
G - Pat Sodemann, 6-3/195 Sr. (7.6 ppg, 2.7 rpg, 2.1 apg)
F - Ryan Coyle, 6-6/208 Jr. (11.1 ppg, 5.3 rpg)
C - Trevor Seibring, 6-8/235 So. (9.4 ppg, 5.3 rpg)

G - Bryce Dolan, 6-0/165 Jr. (9.3 ppg, 1.9 rpg, 2.6 apg)
C - Mike Marietti, 6-8/245 Jr. (7.7 ppg, 4.0 rpg)
G - Andy Stempel, 6-3/180 So. (6.3 ppg, 2.0 rpg)
F - Alec Bausch, 6-6/210 So. (5.6 ppg, 3.7 rpg)
G - Joel Pennington, 6-0/175 Jr. (4.8 ppg)

Millikin (6-8, 1-2)
G - TJ Griffin, 6-0/168 Jr. (16.7 ppg, 2.9 rpg, 2.2 apg)
G - TJ Sims, 5-8/156 Fr. (10.5 ppg, 2.2 rpg, 1.8 apg)
F - Elijah Kenmon, 6-5/195 Jr. (4.5 ppg, 2.7 rpg)
F - Jacob Kueker, 6-5/175 Jr. (6.1 ppg, 3.4 rpg)
F - Brody Bence, 6-8/200 So. (3.2 ppg, 2.7 rpg)

F - Nathan Biggs, 6-6/230 Fr. (6.9 ppg, 4.4 rpg)
G - Nick Novak, 6-1/185 Fr. (5.6 ppg)
F - Zach Long, 6-5/185 Fr. (4.6 ppg, 4.6 rpg)
F - Bryn Agnew, 6-8/220 So. (4.4 ppg, 4.1 rpg)
F - Tommy Pilackas, 6-3/205 Jr. (3.0 ppg)


Pantagraph - http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/basketball/titans-still-looking-to-hit-their-stride/article_f246f6de-23fd-5050-98cd-28f72f4fe3bc.html

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