MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[True Basketball Fan]

Thanks D-dog for the insightful take on the right subject of this forum.

I am actually not surprised.  With all of the DI games I've seen over the past several years, most DI schools, especially at the high levels, place a great responsibility on the utilization of their superior athleticism, and not as much on execution.  I'm not putting them down, if I had the athletes like they have I wouldn't be putting the handcuffs on them and making them run a rigid offense with limitations (save that for the lower levels).  Thus, my point is, I'm sure IWU didn't have to prepare for that killer attack of double screens, basket cuts, and backscreens, as one might see with Hanover, Augustana, or Wheaton (three teams that beat them last year).  All they had to worry about was how they were going to keep Dee Brown from the paint, U of I's size off the glass, and the myriad of athletes at all of the other positions from being too athletic.  Amazingly, they may have more trouble playing man to man against the three teams I mentioned earlier (except Wheaton, they have no chance this year) than they did against U of I the other night.  On the other hand, they may be improved in that area......and if that's true........ WOW!  It could be a decent year (sarcastically).

[Gregory Sager]

Eric, the Vikings aren't scrimmaging UWW until this coming Tuesday afternoon. Their scrimmage against Dominican is next Saturday morning.

Incidentally, we might have another HOFer in the house on Tuesday. Ralph Turner's going to be in town, and he might accompany me on the el up from downtown to watch the Vikings and Warhawks play. So those of you present may get the chance to meet the dean of ASC sports (and the master of complicated Posting Up graphs) in the flesh.

[devildog29]

TBF, I agree that the NBA's style of one on one, individualistic basketball has made it's way into D1 college hoops as well.  Although, I would say that if anyone does run any semblance of a traditional offensive "set" it would be Bruce Weber and Illinois.  In his 2 years at U of I, he's made quite a national name for himself with his motion offense.  I thought I heard Q or Jim mention it more than once during the broadcast of how fun it was to watch Luther Head run around all kinds of screens last year in that offense.  That being said, I did not see the game, I only listened to Q's broadcast of it, so I cannot say for sure what offense the Illini were running.  I'm sure Q could give us more technical insight in that area. 

All in all, I think everyone learned that if IWU brings that performance to the DIII level, there's no telling how dominant they might be.  Another pleasant irony to the game I thought was indeed that defensive execution.  Before the game, Scott Trost had mentioned they hadn't had a lot of time to work on the defensive end of the court.  Once the ball went up though, it sounds to me like the defense was excellent, while the offense and free throws were the rusty areas.  I'm sure nerves played a huge role in that, but I think if most people were to point to IWU's weakness, it would be on defense, not offense.  I'm sure the offense will be rolling when the season gets here, and with that kind of defense every night, look out.  Sky's the limit.

[tjcummingsfan]

Oh, thanks Greg, I don't know where I got the idea that the UWW scrimmage was today.  Well then, Tuesday, I will be excited to hear your observations!

[Titan Q]

Yes Devildog, as I mentioned during the broadcast that I think Bruce Weber's offense is a thing of beauty to watch when a) he has the right personnel and B) it's clicking.  Like the entire 2004-05 Illinois season. 

I've never been a huge Illni fan, but I would watch them play last year just to watch that motion offense in action.  The way Luther Head would work off the ball was fun to watch.  He was in constant motion and the Illini's ability to always get him a good look from beyond the arc - even when the opponent knew that is what they were trying to do - was impressive.

I read comments on occasion here on the D3hoops.com message boards where people suggest that Division I basketball is all about size and athleticism.  While those factors are clearly what separates D1 from D3, there are a bunch of D1 programs out there which run great offensive sets, just like the top D3 teams have to.  Illinois is one of these programs.  Any fan of Division III basketball would have appreciated watching last year's Illini play in my opinion.

IWU faced that same Bruce Weber offense Thursday evening, it's just that the personnel is different.  Luther Head and Deron Williams are in the NBA and they're trying to find their new cast for 2005-06.  Against IWU, another difference is that they didn't start 3 guards as they did last season.  They started a more traditional lineup of two guards (Dee Brown, Rich McBride), a wing (Brian Randle), a power forward (Warren Carter), and a center (James Augustine).  They certainly didn't have that same efficiency, which is to be expected at this point I think.  (The way freshman 2-guard Jamar Smith looked, I'll bet they're considering a 3-guard offense once again.)

Regarding IWU's defense, as mentioned, the Titans played man-to-man the entire 1st Half.  And to stay within 6 points of the Illini playing 'em straight up - regardless of the fact they were working with a new cast - was really something (especially considering IWU was a horrendous 7-15 from the FT line during that half).  Afterall, Illinois features a D1 1st Team All-American and another guy expected to go pretty high in the draft too in Augustine.  In the 2nd Half, IWU started zone at it was during the zone stretch the Titans got it tied up at 41 and was within 1 with 13:00 to play.

One thing to remember about IWU's defense is the fact the Titans led the CCIW last season in points allowed (67.5) and FG% defense (.429) in conference play.  They led these statistical categories on the overall season as well (65.3 ppg, .404 opponent FG%).

http://www.cciw.org/winter_bball_m/2005mbbcciwonlystats.php

http://www.cciw.org/winter_bball_m/2005mbbcciwoverallstats.php

[Mr. Ypsi]

Considering how long the Titans held even with the Illini, and only fell out of it when their big men wore out/fouled out, does anyone else fantasize about what 'might have been' if the Titans had had a 'normal' game at the line plus a healthy Cory Jones?

I realize that 'what ifs' are often the fall-back position for 'losers', but I keep having this scenario in my mind of one of the all-time great upsets!

With decent FT shooting, instead of tied at 14 to go, they're AHEAD by 6-7 (or maybe more; I don't know how many of those misses were the front-side of a 1 and 1); with Cory healthy, the loss of Zach and Chris is much less painful (and might never have happened, due to substitution when a player gets in foul trouble).

I realize it is only a fantasy, and doesn't change the reality (which is already NOT that shabby!), but I pity those who can't enjoy my fantasy world!

[pcarr]

Well, all that hullabaloo, and North Park beat Wheaton anyway.  1-0 final.  Judging strictly from the radio webcast, it sounded like they had a decent contingent of fans too.  Congrats to the Vikes.  Represent the CCIW well in the NCAA tournament. 

[tjcummingsfan]

I know this is a basketball board, but if anyone would be willing to offer up some observations on the NP/Wheaton soccer game I would greatly appreciate it!

[Jim Matson]

Not so fast, Paul.  Wheaton still has a shot at a Pool C bid.  In the final NCAA Regional Poll, Wheaton was #2 and that helps.

The match this afternoon was a great one to watch.  As I had said earlier, North Park had the edge in this one and they cashed in on it.  Congrats to the Vikes for a great win.  They really deserved it.

North Park had 2 things that were obvious; speed and desire.  And they had an awesome goalie, a great Covie kid from Omaha.  Wheaton had 2 or 3 great chances, but overall, could not penetrate the North Park defense (unlike the football game played earlier today ).  Coach Born had a great game plan and they executed it well.

Many very vocal Yellowbeards showed up and added to the very special atmosphere for North Park tonight - their first ever trip to the NCAA post-season.

[pcarr]

Oh yeah.  I completely forgot that Pool C was expanded this year.  That goes into effect for basketball too, right?  So how many bids are there now for hoops? 

[Pat Coleman]

Story on that is still on the front page.

[pcarr]

Wow, I knew I was being lazy asking that question, but I didn' t think I was THAT lazy.  The expanded Pool C is fantastic.  Five years too late for a couple Wheaton teams, but still fantastic.

[David Collinge]

I'm sure Dennis thinks the Wheaton administration will tamper with the space-time continuum in order to rectify those past slights, Paul.   

[Mr. Ypsi]

David,

And your point is ... ?

Heck, I want another crack at Wooster for the 2004 season - who do I see about this space-time continuum?

(And another shot at Hanover, 2005, would be good, too!)

[b_holmgren]

Paul -
I caught one of your sportscasts on the radio last month. Kix106 I think? Good to hear another Wheaty in Kansas.