MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Mr. Ypsi]

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

Knowing nothing about UVS (or Meyerhoff, for that matter), my guess would be that if he was likely to be a force in the CCIW, he may be the best player on his 'D1' team!

[sac]

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

This is just pure hyperbole. Lets come to our senses here.......

http://www.wolverinegreen.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/utva-m-baskbl-sched.html
Utah Valley went 17-11 last season with a roster that goes 6-7, 6-8, 6-9, 6-7, 6-8, 6-6

Utah Valley is coached by Dick Hunsaker

[Mr. Ypsi]

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

This is just pure hyperbole. Lets come to our senses here.......

http://www.wolverinegreen.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/utva-m-baskbl-sched.html
Utah Valley went 17-11 last season with a roster that goes 6-7, 6-8, 6-9, 6-7, 6-8, 6-6

Utah Valley is coached by Dick Hunsaker

I just looked at their schedule.  With the possible exception of Utah State (who crushed them) I don't see a 'real' D1 team all season.  I'll lean towards augiefan.

UVS is tall, but can they walk and chew gum at the same time?

[sac]

You guys are amazing sometimes. 

D3 went 1-35 vs D1 this year........and those are all "real" D1 teams on Utah Valley's schedule.


According to massey's ratings........Utah Valley comes in at #219 ahead of about 128 other D1 programs including a few from the MAC you might recognize Ypsi.......Ball St, Easter Michigan, Central Michigan, Western Michigan, Toledo.   Not only are there no D3 teams rated ahead of them (or even close) there's only 1 D2 school rated ahead of them, Findlay.

http://mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2009&sub=I&mid=6


Chances are pretty good that not only would they win the CCIW 14-0, it would probably be done so rather easily and they would probably beat WashU or any other D3 rather easily as well.

[izzy stradlin]

...continuing the Augustana thread, but with a more positive spin...

Another very nice addition to Augie's recruiting class. Jonathan DeMoss from St. Charles North. He's an athletic (also a very good football player) 6-4, 195-pound wing who played through a pretty serious elbow injury as a senior. He had surgery on it after the season. He was recruited by several CCIW schools and had D1 interest from UW-Green Bay, Western Michigan, Eastern Illinois and Miami of Ohio (where his dad played).

http://basketball.dailyherald.com/story/?id=287896

http://www.kcchronicle.com/articles/2009/03/12/16717515/index.xml

This is a really great recruit for Augie.  Jonathan was a 4 year starter and St Charles North and played AAU ball at the highest level with the JG Rising Stars and Illinois Stars where his teammates have included Jereme Richmond, DJ Richardson, Cully Payne etc.   He is a superb athlete who can defend at the D1 level.   During the AAU season, he was consistently put on the opposing teams number 1 offensive player.

Along with a slight dip in his numbers during his senior season (likely due to his elbow injury) what kept him from good D1 offers was his inconsistency on offense and a subpar outside shot.  This is something he may be able to develop more, however, when he concentrates on one sport.  

Jonathan was actually also Wheaton's number 1 target, but unfortunately the admissions office did not cooperate.  

Should be a great player for Augie.  I know Giovanine is really high on Jonathan and I expect him to get on the court early because of his ability to defend.    

[Ralph Turner]

Ditto sac who beat me to Massey

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

This is just pure hyperbole. Lets come to our senses here.......

http://www.wolverinegreen.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/utva-m-baskbl-sched.html
Utah Valley went 17-11 last season with a roster that goes 6-7, 6-8, 6-9, 6-7, 6-8, 6-6

Utah Valley is coached by Dick Hunsaker

UVSU is #219 at mratings.com in D-1

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2009&sub=I&mid=6

Wash U is #230 overall and UVSU is  #235.

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&mid=

[sac]

Ditto sac who beat me to Massey

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

This is just pure hyperbole. Lets come to our senses here.......

http://www.wolverinegreen.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/utva-m-baskbl-sched.html
Utah Valley went 17-11 last season with a roster that goes 6-7, 6-8, 6-9, 6-7, 6-8, 6-6

Utah Valley is coached by Dick Hunsaker

UVSU is #220 at mratings.com in D-1

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2009&sub=I&mid=6

Wash U is #230 overall and UVSU is  #235.

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&mid=

My apologies I read the massey chart incorrectly, St. Thomas was rated higher than UVSU and WashU was closer than I thought.

[Above The Rim]

Izzy, Gregory, & USee---

Thanks for the insight re Wheaton recruiting.
JMHO--and I could be wrong, but--

Note--I've heard that there is one specific player who was being recruited by WC, AC, NCC, & EC (and possibly other midwest schools) who is not able to get into Wheaton for whatever reason.

...continuing the Augustana thread, but with a more positive spin...

Another very nice addition to Augie's recruiting class. Jonathan DeMoss from St. Charles North. He's an athletic (also a very good football player) 6-4, 195-pound wing who played through a pretty serious elbow injury as a senior. He had surgery on it after the season. He was recruited by several CCIW schools and had D1 interest from UW-Green Bay, Western Michigan, Eastern Illinois and Miami of Ohio (where his dad played).

http://basketball.dailyherald.com/story/?id=287896

http://www.kcchronicle.com/articles/2009/03/12/16717515/index.xml

This is a really great recruit for Augie.  Jonathan was a 4 year starter and St Charles North and played AAU ball at the highest level with the JG Rising Stars and Illinois Stars where his teammates have included Jereme Richmond, DJ Richardson, Cully Payne etc.   He is a superb athlete who can defend at the D1 level.   During the AAU season, he was consistently put on the opposing teams number 1 offensive player.

Along with a slight dip in his numbers during his senior season (likely due to his elbow injury) what kept him from good D1 offers was his inconsistency on offense and a subpar outside shot.  This is something he may be able to develop more, however, when he concentrates on one sport.  

Jonathan was actually also Wheaton's number 1 target, but unfortunately the admissions office did not cooperate.  

Should be a great player for Augie.  I know Giovanine is really high on Jonathan and I expect him to get on the court early because of his ability to defend.    

BINGO!

[Ralph Turner]

Ditto sac who beat me to Massey

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

This is just pure hyperbole. Lets come to our senses here.......

http://www.wolverinegreen.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/utva-m-baskbl-sched.html
Utah Valley went 17-11 last season with a roster that goes 6-7, 6-8, 6-9, 6-7, 6-8, 6-6

Utah Valley is coached by Dick Hunsaker

UVSU is #220 at mratings.com in D-1

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2009&sub=I&mid=6

Wash U is #230 overall and UVSU is  #235.

http://www.mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&mid=

My apologies I read the massey chart incorrectly, St. Thomas was rated higher than UVSU and WashU was closer than I thought.

Basically, he is going to a comparable program.  He is just getting a scholarship and Park City is just an hour away!  

[Gregory Sager]

Acceptance of DI offers fulfills many high school players dream of playing at the highest level and, in these difficult economic times, is certainly a financial godsend to the family finances. However, as in this case, it takes the player far from home, places him at a school even many who follow the sport closely haven't heard of, robs his parents of the chance to see him play regularly, and virtually casts him into a black hole as far as local press coverage and ever hearing of the player again. Lastly, and most importantly, there is no guarantee of any significant playing time which would have been virtually a certainty in DIII.

It's true that Meyerhoff, and other not-quite-blue-chip players who accept scholies to play at obscure D1, D2, or NAIA outfits in remote parts of the country, will have to play far from home as a result. But attending school far from home is not always considered to be a negative by college students; many, in fact, prefer to attend school out-of-state, even if it then becomes an onerous task for the family to see his or her games if the student happens to be an athlete. North Park and Wheaton, for example, have very high percentages of out-of-staters in their student bodies.

As far as the "places him at a school even many who follow the sport closely haven't heard of" and local-press-coverage-black-hole drawbacks, this also describes D3 basketball to a T. How many basketball fans have ever heard of Washington University of St. Louis? Augustana? North Park? Illinois Wesleyan? Wheaton? Elmhurst? Not that many, I can assure you. And one thing that we all know very well is that press coverage of D3 basketball is practically nonexistent, save for the schools in towns big enough to have a daily paper but small enough to not have much local sports competition (e.g., Carthage, Illinois Wesleyan, Millikin, Hope, Wooster).

The "no guarantee of playing time" drawback, while true, is also true of a player who chooses to go to a bigger-name school where the competition is even keener. It's all part and parcel of selecting a school that plays on a higher level, regardless of whether it's Utah Valley or a Big Ten or Big East school.

You guys are amazing sometimes. 

Don't tar us all with the same brush. Only two CCIW partisans, augiefan and Chuck, have expressed a belief that Utah Valley would've fallen short to Wash U and wouldn't have won the CCIW. They don't speak for everyone here in that regard -- certainly not me, that's for sure. Let's keep in mind that you've seen a lot more CCIW teams play over the past twenty years than has Chuck.

Jon DeMoss is another potentially fine recruit for Augie with good size for guard. He was severely hampered by his FB related elbow injury on a StChas North team with lots of other offensive talent. He'll have to play better defense to get time at Augie, but he's an athlete, so he should be able to get the job done on D once Coach G yells at him a few hundred times.

Should be a great player for Augie.  I know Giovanine is really high on Jonathan and I expect him to get on the court early because of his ability to defend.

Let the "Is Jon DeMoss a good defender?" debate begin!

[Mr. Ypsi]

You guys are amazing sometimes. 

D3 went 1-35 vs D1 this year........and those are all "real" D1 teams on Utah Valley's schedule.


According to massey's ratings........Utah Valley comes in at #219 ahead of about 128 other D1 programs including a few from the MAC you might recognize Ypsi.......Ball St, Easter Michigan, Central Michigan, Western Michigan, Toledo.   Not only are there no D3 teams rated ahead of them (or even close) there's only 1 D2 school rated ahead of them, Findlay.

http://mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2009&sub=I&mid=6


Chances are pretty good that not only would they win the CCIW 14-0, it would probably be done so rather easily and they would probably beat WashU or any other D3 rather easily as well.

As happens occasionally (but you're only the 318th person to call me out on it!) I didn't do my homework.  I confess that I assumed that UVSU was roughly equivalent to SIU-E (who was the 1 of the 1-35 and was beaten by CCIW 6th place Millikin), but I'll stick with my point that their schedule was not exactly 'murderer's row'.

But I'll only grant them 12-2 (or maybe 14-2: who we gonna kick out? ), not 14-0.

[dansand]

You guys are amazing sometimes. 

D3 went 1-35 vs D1 this year........and those are all "real" D1 teams on Utah Valley's schedule.


According to massey's ratings........Utah Valley comes in at #219 ahead of about 128 other D1 programs including a few from the MAC you might recognize Ypsi.......Ball St, Easter Michigan, Central Michigan, Western Michigan, Toledo.   Not only are there no D3 teams rated ahead of them (or even close) there's only 1 D2 school rated ahead of them, Findlay.

http://mratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2009&sub=I&mid=6


Chances are pretty good that not only would they win the CCIW 14-0, it would probably be done so rather easily and they would probably beat WashU or any other D3 rather easily as well.

Gotta agree with Sac on this one (although not necessarily because of UV's size). While Utah Valley is by no means a D1 power, they're better than some are giving them credit for. True, they were beaten badly by NCAA tournament teams Utah State (30-5, lost to Marquette by 1) and North Dakota State (26-7, lost to Kansas by 10), but they split with Binghamton who also made the tournament (23-9, lost to Duke by 24). I doubt that any D3 teams would beat those teams too often.

We all love our respective programs and get frustrated when we lose recruits, but I think we need to be a little more objective with these assessments. I can see the frustration in Sac's posts: "Oh great, more arrogant claims from the CCIW posters..." But I will say I'd bet against 14-0 in the CCIW.

That said...It sounds like the kid from Benet was probably a reach.

[Above The Rim]

My guess is that Utah Valley State would not have won the CCIW title last year nor would they have beaten Wash U. Just a guess but bottom feeder DI programs are usually doormats used by established DI programs to pick up easy wins.

This is just pure hyperbole. Lets come to our senses here.......

http://www.wolverinegreen.com/sports/m-baskbl/sched/utva-m-baskbl-sched.html
Utah Valley went 17-11 last season with a roster that goes 6-7, 6-8, 6-9, 6-7, 6-8, 6-6

Utah Valley is coached by Dick Hunsaker

I just looked at their schedule.  With the possible exception of Utah State (who crushed them) I don't see a 'real' D1 team all season.  I'll lean towards augiefan.

UVS is tall, but can they walk and chew gum at the same time?

Considering the number of bigs on the UVS roster, as referenced above by Sac, even more likelihood that Meyerhoff will either have to red shirt, or that he will occupy the 15th seat at the end of the bench.
Utah Valley probably him play once all year, likely against Neuqua Valley where he had his career game, and made the offer.
Tell me this kid would not have been better off at a DIII school that recruited him all year!!! Of course, family financial considerations probably played a significant role.

[Gregory Sager]

Considering the number of bigs on the UVS roster, as referenced above by Sac, even more likelihood that Meyerhoff will either have to red shirt, or that he will occupy the 15th seat at the end of the bench.
Utah Valley probably him play once all year, likely against Neuqua Valley where he had his career game, and made the offer.

Utah Valley is playing Neuqua Valley High School next year? Wow, that is a weak opponent for a D1 school!

Tell me this kid would not have been better off at a DIII school that recruited him all year!!! Of course, family financial considerations probably played a significant role.

Well, we're all D3 partisans here, and I think it's fair to say that the vast majority of CCIW fans believe strongly in the merits of a small liberal arts college education. After all, that's what CCIW schools are. But the "recruited him all year" thing is pretty irrelevant, and your points generally hold true about any student-athlete who chooses any scholarship school over a CCIW school, regardless of the scholarship school's level of competence and exposure. The only difference in that regard is that a Missouri or a Kansas or a Seton Hall gets more media attention than a Utah Valley -- but the flip side of that is that a 6'8 kid with marginal D1 ability has a much better chance to see the floor at some point in his career for a Utah Valley than he does for a Missouri or a Kansas or a Seton Hall.

[Above The Rim]

Considering the number of bigs on the UVS roster, as referenced above by Sac, even more likelihood that Meyerhoff will either have to red shirt, or that he will occupy the 15th seat at the end of the bench.
Utah Valley probably him play once all year, likely against Neuqua Valley where he had his career game, and made the offer.

1. Utah Valley is playing Neuqua Valley High School next year? Wow, that is a weak opponent for a D1 school!

Tell me this kid would not have been better off at a DIII school that recruited him all year!!! Of course, family financial considerations probably played a significant role.

2. Well, we're all D3 partisans here, and I think it's fair to say that the vast majority of CCIW fans believe strongly in the merits of a small liberal arts college education. After all, that's what CCIW schools are. But the "recruited him all year" thing is pretty irrelevant, and your points generally hold true about any student-athlete who chooses any scholarship school over a CCIW school, regardless of the scholarship school's level of competence and exposure. The only difference in that regard is that a Missouri or a Kansas or a Seton Hall gets more media attention than a Utah Valley -- but the flip side of that is that a 6'8 kid with marginal D1 ability has a much better chance to see the floor at some point in his career for a Utah Valley than he does for a Missouri or a Kansas or a Seton Hall.

1. Appears I omitted the word "saw"
2. Of course he has a better chance to play at Utah Valley, but play how much??
He would never be offered by schools like MO, KS, or The Hall.