MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Gregory Sager]

Interesting night of basketball last evening at the Toolshed.  I was very impressed by Wheaton. If the question was, "Which is most likely the real Wheaton: The Wheaton that got bombed by Manchester on opening night, or the Wheaton that blew the doors off of perennial WIAC power UW-Whitewater a few days later?", then, based upon last night, the answer would be the latter. Although the game was defense-free on both sides in the first half, Wheaton clamped down nicely on the Knights in the second half while running their own offense to perfection. It's probably too easy to make too much out of last night's game -- Calvin looked like a lost and bewildered bunch of freshmen and sophomores, which is not far off from what the Knights actually are -- but, given that Calvin's last game was a very impressive win over Cornerstone, this 22-point win definitely counts as a feather in Wheaton's cap. Mike Schauer really seems to have maximized his practice time with his team; they're running his offense at peak efficiency, and the hustle factor is off the charts.

Carthage was another story. The Red Men dominated Hope for the first twelve or thirteen minutes, but from then on Hope outhustled and outworked the hosts for most of the game. Hope is a smart, sound team that runs its offense well and really gets after it on the boards, and they made the Red Men look like they were playing in work boots. The conditioning factor with Pierce and Guzman is going to be a serious problem for Carthage, IMO -- it not only affects their ability to get up and down the floor and to stay in the game for protracted minutes, it appears to be affecting their defense and rebounding as well. If I'm Bosko, I'm slapping my forehead at those 14 offensive rebounds Hope picked up and the Dutch's overwhelming 33-22 rebounding advantage -- that's just a case of the other team wanting it more and working harder for it. When your off guard (Max Cary) leads your team in rebounds with four, you've got a problem.

Carthage came from six down in the last five minutes and won the game because Superman put the boys in white on his back and carried them to victory. Steve D. scored the team's last nine points, and even though Hope knew exactly what was coming the Dutch seemed helpless to stop him. (The Dutch didn't help themselves, either; they looked a little panicky and made some big mental and physical errors down the stretch.) Those of us who have seen Carthage play over the past three-plus years have all seen this movie before: The Red Men are struggling, the Red Men all step aside and let Steve D. do his thing, Steve D. does his thing, Carthage pulls out the narrow win. If I'm a Carthage fan, the alarming thing about it all was that this was what the Red Men were forced to resort to in previous years when the long-term expectations of the team were not as high as they are now. As good as Steve D. is, he's not good enough to singlehandedly carry Carthage to victory in Salem next March. There's no denying that the Red Men have some good alternate pieces -- Mitch Thompson continues to impress me, and I thought that Malcom Kelly played very well, too -- but you can't just simply rely upon Steve D. to pull your chestnuts out of the fire like that everytime. Carthage is going to face better teams than Hope down the stretch (Hope itself might be one of those teams, once it has Bunn and Venema back), and this scenario may not always be possible.

Steve D. was very understated about breaking the school's all-time scoring record last night. He's a nice kid, so I felt good for him, but he's all about winning ballgames rather than breaking personal records, which is as it should be. I spoke to Jason Wiertel after the game about his school scoring record being broken, and he was pretty philosophical about it. "I knew from the first game he played that he was going to break the record," he said, and I tend to agree with him.

Lest this all sounds as though I'm now very high on Wheaton and not high at all on Carthage, keep in mind that the circumstances and the opponents were different. At this point, it looks to me that Hope is a better team than Calvin, so I think the Red Men were challenged more. (That may change down the road, though, so I hope all the Knights fans who are reading this don't get their undies in a bunch.) It's still early, and the Red Men still have time to work out the kinks. I certainly wouldn't bet against them. But Wheaton honestly looked like it was in mid-season form in the second half of last night's game.

[coebball70]

Greg, very well written review!  I agree with ALL of your observations but would like to add two of my own.  When was the last time you observed a D3 game where the same player recorded four thundering slams like Carthage's Mitch Thompson?  Thompson sure has some "hops."  Also, I believe Hope played without two senior starters from last year out with injuries (like IWU) ... although I am not totally sure about that statement.  The Dutch will be contenders at season's end.  Hope vs Wheaton should be a good matchup today.  Wheaton is getting some good play from their freshmen but their lack of depth will hurt them in the long schedule grind of the CCIW.  Four starters played more than thirty minute apiece last evening.  

[oldknight]

At this point, it looks to me that Hope is a better team than Calvin, so I think the Red Men were challenged more. (That may change down the road, though, so I hope all the Knights fans who are reading this don't get their undies in a bunch.) It's still early, and the Red Men still have time to work out the kinks. I certainly wouldn't bet against them. But Wheaton honestly looked like it was in mid-season form in the second half of last night's game.

No undies bunched here. Your comments are--to borrow what is now a cliche'--fair and balanced. Calvin is a work in progress and their fans need to be realistic about the fact that raw talent alone won't win games. With so many new and inexperienced players, there will be times when they look lost. That has happened before and will happen again. Lessons are painful but necessary.

[Gregory Sager]

Greg, very well written review!  I agree with ALL of your observations but would like to add two of my own.  When was the last time you observed a D3 game where the same player recorded four thundering slams like Carthage's Mitch Thompson?  Thompson sure has some "hops."

Thompson is definitely one of the best leapers I've seen in this league over the past decade. As he continues to fill in other areas of his game, I suspect that he's going to become a great CCIW player.

Also, I believe Hope played without two senior starters from last year out with injuries (like IWU) ... although I am not totally sure about that statement.

Yep, Peter Bunn and Andy Venema. I mentioned them here:

Carthage is going to face better teams than Hope down the stretch (Hope itself might be one of those teams, once it has Bunn and Venema back)

... and the Hope consensus is that Bunn's their best player. He led the Dutch in scoring last year by a wide margin, averaging 16.0 ppg. If he was playing last night, there's no question as to which Hope player would've had the ball in his hands during those last confused eight seconds of the game. I'm not all that familiar with Hope, but I'm guessing that a David Krombeen fadeaway jumper from eighteen feet out is not Coach Neil's ideal scenario for a game-deciding shot.

Wheaton is getting some good play from their freshmen but their lack of depth will hurt them in the long schedule grind of the CCIW.  Four starters played more than thirty minute apiece last evening.

Very good observation, although it should be noted that Wheaton, too, is suffering from some injury problems. Jon DeMoss was in street clothes last night, due to a concussion suffered earlier this week, and guards Stephen Pierotti and Nate Serenius are out for extended periods as well. Serenius is an unproven player, although Wheaton folks seem to be very high on him, but Pierotti is a veteran member of the rotation and a respectable defender and minutes-eater.

[Gregory Sager]

Calvin is a work in progress and their fans need to be realistic about the fact that raw talent alone won't win games. With so many new and inexperienced players, there will be times when they look lost. That has happened before and will happen again. Lessons are painful but necessary.

"Work in progress" must be the cliche du jour, because last night about five different Wheaton or Carthage folks asked me about NPU, and each time I described the Vikings as "a work in progress." We must've hired the same scriptwriter, OK.

The ominous thing for me is that Calvin runs the same offense as NPU -- and the Sonic Atmospheric Disturbance handled it with aplomb. I'm hoping that Mike Schauer's boys forget all about their game against your Knights by the time January 15 rolls around.

[oldknight]

Carthage is going to face better teams than Hope down the stretch (Hope itself might be one of those teams, once it has Bunn and Venema back)

... and the Hope consensus is that Bunn's their best player. He led the Dutch in scoring last year by a wide margin, averaging 16.0 ppg. If he was playing last night, there's no question as to which Hope player would've had the ball in his hands during those last confused eight seconds of the game. I'm not all that familiar with Hope, but I'm guessing that a David Krombeen fallaway jumper from eighteen feet out is not Coach Neil's ideal scenario for a game-deciding shot.

I saw last night's game only by video and am curious what those of you present at the game thought of Coach Neil's decision to call a timeout with only 8 seconds left. At the time I thought it a curious choice to wait so long to set the final play. The announcers indirectly criticized it by casually and correctly mentioning that as long as Carthage could force the entry pass back towards center court, Carthage would only need to defend Hope for a couple of seconds making the task much simpler. If Neil wanted to call a timeout after getting the ball in the front court, he should have done so with 15 seconds on the game clock, not 8. Maybe Coach Neil's first coaching gaffe?

[Gregory Sager]

Carthage is going to face better teams than Hope down the stretch (Hope itself might be one of those teams, once it has Bunn and Venema back)

... and the Hope consensus is that Bunn's their best player. He led the Dutch in scoring last year by a wide margin, averaging 16.0 ppg. If he was playing last night, there's no question as to which Hope player would've had the ball in his hands during those last confused eight seconds of the game. I'm not all that familiar with Hope, but I'm guessing that a David Krombeen fallaway jumper from eighteen feet out is not Coach Neil's ideal scenario for a game-deciding shot.

I saw last night's game only by video and am curious what those of you present at the game thought of Coach Neil's decision to call a timeout with only 8 seconds left. At the time I thought it a curious choice to wait so long to set the final play. The announcers indirectly criticized it by casually and correctly mentioning that as long as Carthage could force the entry pass back towards center court, Carthage would only need to defend Hope for a couple of seconds making the task much simpler. If Neil wanted to call a timeout after getting the ball in the front court, he should have done so with 15 seconds on the game clock, not 8. Maybe Coach Neil's first coaching gaffe?

A couple of different people I spoke to right after the game were speculating about that very thing. I wonder if it was an error on Coach Neil's part, or if he simply saw something in the Carthage defense with eight seconds left that wasn't there when there were fifteen seconds left. The fact that he called another timeout immediately after the first one, once Carthage had taken the floor and set up its inbound defense, led me to believe that Coach Neil was playing chess with Bosko at that point.

[oldknight]

A couple of different people I spoke to right after the game were speculating about that very thing. I wonder if it was an error on Coach Neil's part, or if he simply saw something in the Carthage defense with eight seconds left that wasn't there when there were fifteen seconds left. The fact that he called another timeout immediately after the first one, once Carthage had taken the floor and set up its inbound defense, led me to believe that Coach Neil was playing chess with Bosko at that point.

Checkmate?

[Gregory Sager]

Just a reminder that there will be another CCIW/MIAA challenge going on this evening at 7:30 pm, this one at the corner of Foster & Kedzie on the North Side. You can watch Trine @ NPU via the webcast by clicking on this link.

Rob's out of town this weekend, so I'm broadcasting the game solo this evening. I did that three times last season, and all three times the game ended up going to overtime. I'm anticipating that scenario by planning to reduce my fluids intake ... but no doubt Pete McB. and others will be stopping by the broadcast table and providing lots of jokes about catheters and Depends and other such nonsense.

[bopol]

Additional Thoughts on Carthage/Hope:

* Raul Guzman didn't get into foul trouble for just about the first time this year and did contribute well.  He has unique skills and should be a contributor every game, so that was good to see. 

* Mitch Thompson let the players he was defending receive the ball way too deep a few times.  He needs to body up better.  Of course, unlike Pierce and Guzman, Thompson is rail thin.  He did play a very good game on the offensive end.

* Carthage was up 14 when Bosko took out Steve D in the first half.  That began the Hope comeback.  Pace Bennett cannot run the point and Carthage looked massively confused.  I think they had cut the lead to 8 when Steve D came back in, but they had their momentum back. 

* Hope fouled up by not pressing to attack the basket when they got the ball back with 25 seconds left down by 1.  They waited until 8 seconds left and called a timeout.  When Hope got the ball in the first place, my thought was, gee, I hope Carthage can rebound a miss and Hope doesn't get multiple shots at the game.  Hope didn't, but it was because the coach decided it; not that Carthage stopped them on the boards.

Carthage was lucky to get the win and they NEED to rebound better or they will never be the team they hope to be.

[petemcb]

Just a reminder that there will be another CCIW/MIAA challenge going on this evening at 7:30 pm, this one at the corner of Foster & Kedzie on the North Side. You can watch Trine @ NPU via the webcast by clicking on this link.

Rob's out of town this weekend, so I'm broadcasting the game solo this evening. I did that three times last season, and all three times the game ended up going to overtime. I'm anticipating that scenario by planning to reduce my fluids intake ... but no doubt Pete McB. and others will be stopping by the broadcast table and providing lots of jokes about catheters and Depends and other such nonsense.

After my catheter experience of a year ago, there will be no catheter jokes cracked under the petemcb moniker.   

[sac]

Hope 80 Wheaton 74

McCrary 22, Jahns 21 for Wheaton

[petemcb]

By the way, I've really enjoyed listening to the Thunder broadcast this afternoon since I couldn't make it back up to Kenosha today.  The announcers have done a really nice job, but I hope under their Christmas tree this year they find a thesaurus with the word "phenomenal" and its alternatives highlighted and the page dog-eared. 

[Titan Q]

Chicago 83
IWU 78

IWU finally pays for one of those long sleep-walking stretches, and for not being able to defend consistently.  Somehow, out of the gait, the formerly 1-5 Maroons (who were pasted by Wheaton this week) led this game 29-10 with about 7:00 to play in the 1st half.  During that stretch it sounded like Chicago was collapsing on IWU's inside players and the Titans were ice-cold from the perimeter.  Obviously on the other end, IWU could not defend at all.

The Titans actually caught up, taking a lead with about 10:00 to play in the game, but then just could not stop Chicago from scoring.  I'd have to go back and look at the pbp, but I'm not sure IWU stopped Chicago one time during the final 5:00 or so.  IWU and Chicago traded 1-point leads a few times in the final 7 or 8 minutes, and a few times it seemed like the Titans were just a couple stops away from taking control...but those stops never came.

Chicago's Matt Johnson carved IWU up.  He finished with 28 points on 10-18 shooting.  The Titans could not stop him.

A really tough and puzzling loss for the Titans.  Starting forwards out or not, this is a game IWU absolutely should not have lost on paper.  Remember, Chicago was playing without its best player, 6-8/240 Steve Stefanou (12.4 ppg, 6.5 rpg last year...broken foot).  The bottom line is that IWU is nowhere near a Top 10 team right now because of its poor defense.  The Titans scored their usual 78 today...but when you give up 83 you don't deserve to win.

A very damaging in-region loss for IWU.  This one is going to sting in some fashion come Selection Sunday.

Credit Mike McGrath and his Maroons, as it sounded like they put on a clinic today in Bloomington.

[augiefan]

IWU's home loss tonight is almost inexplicable, but it does validate what many of us have started to recognize in the early going. The CCIW is simply may not be up to its usual standard of excellence this year. IWU has had previous near misses, Carthage has been less than spectacular. NPU lost at home tonight, Wheaton lost to a rebuilding Hope team at a CCIW venue and Augie barely prevails over a Monmouth team projected for last place in MWC. Let's hope things change for the better, but for now I join Q in the realm of the pessimists.