MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Naperick]

Also, what are the odds the CCIW gets in 2 teams to the tourney if Augie wins the conference tournament?

Slim and none, and slim is on its way out the door.

Augie is in.  The only way the CCIW gets another team is if Augie does not win the CCIW tourney.

[Naperick]

At the beginning of the season, I thought the CCIW would get 2 teams in.  I thought a 3rd team was possible. 

[Naperick]

Busy moving week here in Lincoln, NE.  The movers unloaded us Monday and since then it's been non-stop box opening and purchasing stuff. 

I was disappointed to hear the Titans lost @ NCC...tough season.  2 must win games left for IWU.

Moving is such a pain!  Good luck with everything!

[Hardwood]

I do know we were a win from the Final Four last year.  At this point though, that's starting to feel a little more like the exception, not the rule in the Rose era.  I'm not going all OurHouse here, I really do like Coach Rose and want him to succeed.  Perhaps attending IWU during the Simich/Crabtree/Neibrugge/etc. era has overly inflated my expectations for IWU basketball, but consistently fighting to merely make the CCIW conference tournament is not what most Titan fans expect from this program.

I think that your "overly inflated expectations" surmise is apt. No offense at all to those great IWU teams of your student era, but the '90s were, for the most part, a downer of an era for the league as a whole. Lots of teams struggled from one year to the next, and the CCIW frequently was barely able to keep its head above water in terms of non-conference play -- and this was in a decade in which fewer and fewer scholarship schools were scheduling CCIW teams than had historically been the case.

With the exception of Wheaton, IWU didn't really have a consistent challenger in the CCIW during the balance of the Simich/Crabtree/Niebrugge era (i.e., after the end of the Augie run with Kirk Anderson, Aben Cooper, etc.). I think that you may have thus developed a somewhat skewed idea of what the CCIW is usually all about, just as a lot of my school peers are perpetually baffled as to why North Park can't rule the world in basketball anymore.

It's an intensely competitive league, with no quarter asked or given, and if you have a single down year in recruiting you may end up paying for it for quite awhile. It's very, very hard to stay on top, and it's easy to get stuck at the bottom because the league is so deep. For example, it may take Millikin five or six more years before the Big Blue are able to compete again, just because the overall strength of the league amplifies the inertia of any program that has fallen upon hard times. As an NPU fan, I've ruefully witnessed that syndrome take place with my alma mater since Bosko left. Bosko's current program is proof of what I'm talking about; as we discussed last week, Carthage went into a trough after the Wiertel/Garnes/McDaniel/Ktistou/Powell era ended, and it didn't re-emerge until Bosko's son started suiting up for the Red Men. Bill Harris is one of the best coaches this conference has ever seen, and yet he went an entire decade without Wheaton winning a CCIW title. Staying on top in this league is extraordinarily difficult.

I think that a lot of the blame being hurled Ron Rose's way is unfair. As Pat implied, any IWU coach is likely to take the fall for not being Dennis Bridges (although Scott Trost earned himself a fund of goodwill among the green-clad faithful with that remarkable Dauksas/Amerlianovich class that he was later able to cash in when his recruiting dried up prior to his departure for Lewis).

But the fact of the matter is that this is not the 1990s anymore. This league is filled with coaches that really get after it who do not coach for Illinois Wesleyan. Your alma mater's program does not operate in a vacuum.

That is well stated GS

[AndOne]

TQ--

1. I only included Edmund in the discussion because he is one of the senior/4th year players. The experienced players I felt might most be able to help were Dan Schouten and Duncan Lawson.
2. To put it another way, the freshmen that Ron Rose employed didn't do squat. So, how much worse could anyone else, especially anyone with some degree of experience including O'Callaghan, have done?
3. The one area he has been most "successful" in is rebounding. Doug Sexauer had his hands full with Landon Gamble, and Wesleyan was losing and lost the rebound battle. Why not put another bigger, taller guy in to help on the boards?
Couldn't hurt.
Believe me, I wasn't championing his cause as much as suggesting that on 1 night, when Wesleyan is fighting for its life just to make the conference tournament, why not try some senior experience, even possibly including Edmund, since the plan Rose employed wasn't working.

With regard to a fondness for controversy and stirring the pot, I suggest you take a look in the mirror.
It seems the person more fond of the aforementioned pursuits is the one who spends an inordinate amount of time dredging up posts from as far back January '09. You really had to dig deep for those tidbits.
So ask yourself------WHO loves controversy and stirring the pot?

Additionally, another activity you have proved adept at as the King Of Swing is bringing up a different and only slightly related issue to take the light off the real issue at hand. The focus of my post was not so much to champion Mr. O'Callaghan's cause, but to point out the fact that it seems Ron Rose has lately employed some questionable substitution patterns and game strategy. And please be advised that this is not just my idea as a fan of an opposing team, but an opinion shared by a seemingly growing faction of Wesleyan fans, and even family.  
As evidence I offer some RECENT posts from Wesleyan fans:

A) DevilDog's post #25070 re Rose's not turning recruiting success into on the court success lately.

B) Always a Titan's post #25074 questioning not playing more experienced players.

C) Lover Of The Game's post #25082 concerning the analysis of a friend of his who has experience as both a player and a coach and his opinion that Rose needs to formulate better defensive schemes to prevent the opposition from being successful 4 times on the same play, and that he might also benefit from doing a bit of tweaking of his rotational pattern.

I think these good Wesleyan fans bring up valid questions. The fact that they are even openly questioning whats going on is noteworthy.

D) Finally, several Wesleyan fans who were actually at the game Monday night made it a point to mention to me afterward that they were, lets say "confused" as to why Coach Rose didn't try other things and other players when it became obvious what he was trying and with whom, wasn't working.

In summary, this was the REAL issue at hand here, NOT what my analysis of a player was over 2 years ago..

And lastly, Bob, I am not the one who recently purposely quoted only a portion of someone else's post in an obvious and deliberate attempt to twist the meaning and sincerity of what that person said and meant.

So I ask again---WHO loves controversy and stirring the pot?  

Perhaps its the gentleman who calls someone who disagrees with his position "arrogant."

You can look it up. 

[Naperick]

I know this is a basketball thread but a great event is coming to North Central in 2013!  I know North Central will do a great job hosting the mens & womens D3 indoor track & field championships in 2013.

http://cciw.org/news/2011/2/16/MITRK_0216112613.aspx

[CCIWchamps]

WHO loves controversy?

I do!  I'll prove it with my next three posts!

[CCIWchamps]

Since no one else has mentioned it yet, the sun came up again on Monday, and Steve Djurickovic won CCIW player of the week honors for the 4th time this season and 14th time in his career.  

If Carthage doesn't make the conference tournament, is there any way he doesn't get the MOP?

Well since nobody mentioned it either, Tim McCrary won CCIW player of the week honors for the 2nd time this season LAST week:
http://athletics.wheaton.edu/news/2011/2/7/MBB_0207111707.aspx?path=mbball

I guess we just focus on the team accomplishments when it comes to the Thunder....




(post #1)

[TitansIWU]

I know this is a basketball thread but a great event is coming to North Central in 2013!  I know North Central will do a great job hosting the mens & womens D3 indoor track & field championships in 2013.

http://cciw.org/news/2011/2/16/MITRK_0216112613.aspx

They picked a good place to have it, the families of those in the event can certainly admire a nicely run city with many dining options and other culture.

Naperville is just a cool place to visit.

[CCIWchamps]

I just feel like if you watch Steve D. play a few times, he just has an extra gear and can take over a game more times than not.

The questions I ask myself to determine who I think is the player of the year are:

1. Who in the league do I most not want to see with the ball when my team is up by 1 with 12 seconds left.

2. What player just does things that make me think... "How did he?"

He has to be the player of the year.

Your criteria are a good start but need to be expanded.  Here are NBA players that fit your 2-point description but would not be MVPs in their league:
1. Steve Kerr, John Paxon, Robert Horry
2. Blake Griffin, Vince Carter, Shawn Kemp

(post #2)

[CCIWchamps]

I know this is a basketball thread but a great event is coming to North Central in 2013!  I know North Central will do a great job hosting the mens & womens D3 indoor track & field championships in 2013.

http://cciw.org/news/2011/2/16/MITRK_0216112613.aspx

Get out of here!!!





(post #3- now lighten up fellas)

[TitansIWU]

Your criteria are a good start but need to be expanded.  Here are NBA players that fit your 2-point description but would not be MVPs in their league:
1. Steve Kerr, John Paxon, Robert Horry
2. Blake Griffin, Vince Carter, Shawn Kemp

I wasn't using my criteria for the NBA, I was using it for the CCIW, and I would pick all of the above mentioned players over Steve D as CCIW MOP, if they played in this conference.

[CCIWchamps]

Your criteria are a good start but need to be expanded.  Here are NBA players that fit your 2-point description but would not be MVPs in their league:
1. Steve Kerr, John Paxon, Robert Horry
2. Blake Griffin, Vince Carter, Shawn Kemp

I wasn't using my criteria for the NBA, I was using it for the CCIW, and I would pick all of the above mentioned players over Steve D as CCIW MOP, if they played in this conference.

Fair enough (!) though I stand by the idea that you need a few more criteria.

A fun side discussion might be:
1) Would Paxon or Kerr in their current forms be MOP of the CCIW?
1b) Would Paxon or Kerr be MOP in their primes?  Maybe D3 POY?
2) Would Shawn Kemp be a great asset or liability to a current CCIW team (in his current form)?
3) Would it be fun to watch VC or Blake G play in a CCIW game, or would it just kill the purity of D3 basketball forever?

[TitansIWU]

Steve Kerr is 45 years old.  

I guess he could park himself in deep three point land, not play defense at all, and just fire bombs every time he got the ball.

According to wikipedia:

He also set a NCAA record for three point percentage in a single season (114-199, 57.3%)

If he could match this, and he shot every time he got the ball, he would be an asset, but still not MOP (unless you use just my criteria)

[CCIWchamps]

Steve Kerr is 45 years old.  

He also set a NCAA record for three point percentage in a single season (114-199, 57.3%)

Whoops. 

I meant to add a 1b) would Kerr or Pax be the MOP in their prime?
Judging by that stat he'd make a great case.  I just wonder if either would be more of a slasher playing against smaller opponents.