MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Dennis_Prikkel]

Conference play is orientated with the 1st goal of the member teams being to win the conference. The 2nd goal is to make the conference tournament---which only the top 4 teams do. Everyone knows this is how play within the conference goes. During the conference portion of the season the coaches and players focus 1st on winning the conference and 2nd, on making the tournament. If you don't make the tournament the best you can call yourself is the FIFTH place team.

*As far as giving anything I say credence, Bob seems to have developed an aversion to doing so. If I said "El Hombre Rotundo fell hard, and hit the floor like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup," Bob would probably say it was jello rather than vegetable soup!      

The three teams had 9 wins - so they tied.  It's really not that tough.  9 wins = 9 wins = 9 wins.  You don't even need to take off your socks to figure out that one.  Which would be good, because based on your continued immaturity, I can only assume that you are a result of inbreeding and probably have 12 toes.

taken his nasty pills he did this morning 

[bopol]

Conference play is orientated with the 1st goal of the member teams being to win the conference. The 2nd goal is to make the conference tournament---which only the top 4 teams do. Everyone knows this is how play within the conference goes. During the conference portion of the season the coaches and players focus 1st on winning the conference and 2nd, on making the tournament. If you don't make the tournament the best you can call yourself is the FIFTH place team.

*As far as giving anything I say credence, Bob seems to have developed an aversion to doing so. If I said "El Hombre Rotundo fell hard, and hit the floor like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup," Bob would probably say it was jello rather than vegetable soup!      

The three teams had 9 wins - so they tied.  It's really not that tough.  9 wins = 9 wins = 9 wins.  You don't even need to take off your socks to figure out that one.  Which would be good, because based on your continued immaturity, I can only assume that you are a result of inbreeding and probably have 12 toes.

bopol---

Although I disagreed with you, I didn't resort to lowering myself to the point of assailing your family heritage.     
I can hear the oinks emitting from your pen from here.

You lowered yourself when you posted your little nickname for Raul Guzman again. 

I just didn't bother not to lower myself this time. 

[mwunder]

Have to agree that someone spouted a lot of baloney in their post.  I do not like baloney one bit, not even slapped between two pieces of bread, so I'll take this portion and see what I can make of it.

bopol- Why are you so worried about Steve being gone?

Speaking for myself as a Carthage fan, I'm worried about replacing the 22 PPG and the 6.6 APG as well as the on-court leadership.  I'd bet that is part of Bopol's worry as well.

With him gone, Carthage will be more of a team than a one man show. Last year, he would clearly go up to Malcom Kelly and other guards when they had the ball at the top of the key to get it himself. That isn't basketball. The man shot 85% of the time.

I won't even go into the lack of math here, but clearly a player who had 165 of the team's 338 assists was not shooting the ball 85% of the time (472 shots out of 1945 = 24%).  He did CLEARLY go to the top of the key and get the ball, I would agree, but it was a part of the offense.  He could create his own shot out of nothing, or draw multiple defenders to himself to create an open look for his teammates.  No one else on the team could do that.

I mean if the man is shooting that much everyone else isn't going to want to do the dirty work for him while he takes all the glory.

Someone doesn't understand the concept of a TEAM sport here.  You had a kid who set career and season records in scoring and ASSISTS.  Wake up!



I also don't understand the "sharing the ball" more argument that is being bandied about.  Passing the ball around to pass it around is one thing, but getting it to a teammate where he can do something with it is quite another.  Steve could work the court to do that.  Steve had 649 career assists.  By comparison, Adam Dauksas, from IWU, had 548 career assists with a much better cast around him.  I only chose to look up Adam's numbers because he was one of the finest true PG's in the CCIW in the past 15 years if not longer. 

Team's are only going to score so many points a season no matter how much they "share the ball".  I really do hope that Carthage can replace 22 PPG by playing better defense, rebounding the ball and a limiting the other team's scoring opportunities, hustling after loose balls, and playing intelligent basketball.  Addition by subtraction if you will.  I just don't see how they're going to replace it on the offensive side of the coin.

[pgkevin]

Have to agree that someone spouted a lot of baloney in their post.  I do not like baloney one bit, not even slapped between two pieces of bread, so I'll take this portion and see what I can make of it.

bopol- Why are you so worried about Steve being gone?

Speaking for myself as a Carthage fan, I'm worried about replacing the 22 PPG and the 6.6 APG as well as the on-court leadership.  I'd bet that is part of Bopol's worry as well.

With him gone, Carthage will be more of a team than a one man show. Last year, he would clearly go up to Malcom Kelly and other guards when they had the ball at the top of the key to get it himself. That isn't basketball. The man shot 85% of the time.

I won't even go into the lack of math here, but clearly a player who had 165 of the team's 338 assists was not shooting the ball 85% of the time (472 shots out of 1945 = 24%).  He did CLEARLY go to the top of the key and get the ball, I would agree, but it was a part of the offense.  He could create his own shot out of nothing, or draw multiple defenders to himself to create an open look for his teammates.  No one else on the team could do that.

I mean if the man is shooting that much everyone else isn't going to want to do the dirty work for him while he takes all the glory.

Someone doesn't understand the concept of a TEAM sport here.  You had a kid who set career and season records in scoring and ASSISTS.  Wake up!



I also don't understand the "sharing the ball" more argument that is being bandied about.  Passing the ball around to pass it around is one thing, but getting it to a teammate where he can do something with it is quite another.  Steve could work the court to do that.  Steve had 649 career assists.  By comparison, Adam Dauksas, from IWU, had 548 career assists with a much better cast around him.  I only chose to look up Adam's numbers because he was one of the finest true PG's in the CCIW in the past 15 years if not longer. 

Team's are only going to score so many points a season no matter how much they "share the ball".  I really do hope that Carthage can replace 22 PPG by playing better defense, rebounding the ball and a limiting the other team's scoring opportunities, hustling after loose balls, and playing intelligent basketball.  Addition by subtraction if you will.  I just don't see how they're going to replace it on the offensive side of the coin.

This is very nicely done.

When I read the original post from I'm Back it reeked to me of sour grapes, perhaps someone unhappy with Steve D. on a personal level.  I just didn't have the time or the effort to debunk it, but this was along the lines of what I was thinking.

Again, very nicely done.

[pgkevin]

Conference play is orientated with the 1st goal of the member teams being to win the conference. The 2nd goal is to make the conference tournament---which only the top 4 teams do. Everyone knows this is how play within the conference goes. During the conference portion of the season the coaches and players focus 1st on winning the conference and 2nd, on making the tournament. If you don't make the tournament the best you can call yourself is the FIFTH place team.

*As far as giving anything I say credence, Bob seems to have developed an aversion to doing so. If I said "El Hombre Rotundo fell hard, and hit the floor like a Hefty bag filled with vegetable soup," Bob would probably say it was jello rather than vegetable soup!      

The three teams had 9 wins - so they tied.  It's really not that tough.  9 wins = 9 wins = 9 wins.  You don't even need to take off your socks to figure out that one.  Which would be good, because based on your continued immaturity, I can only assume that you are a result of inbreeding and probably have 12 toes.

bopol---

Although I disagreed with you, I didn't resort to lowering myself to the point of assailing your family heritage.     
I can hear the oinks emitting from your pen from here.

You lowered yourself when you posted your little nickname for Raul Guzman again. 

I just didn't bother not to lower myself this time.

This seems hypocritical to me.  Yes, you claim that you felt you had to because he used a nickname for Raul Guzman.  However, the question that merits asking is how would "12 toed inbred" serve as a nickname.  That seems to cross the line more than any jab at someone's weight would.

I just get sick of people using the annonymous nature of the online world to act holier than thou.  Here is a clear example where you told someone for 5 or 6 posts not to do something, and then you did that exact thing to an even more extreme level. 

I tend to not care about all the fighting that accompanies the online world, it's the hypocracy that drives me crazy.

[devildog29]

taken his nasty pills he did this morning 

Is this supposed to be read in a Yoda voice, or am I the only one thinking that?

[bopol]

This seems hypocritical to me.  Yes, you claim that you felt you had to because he used a nickname for Raul Guzman.  However, the question that merits asking is how would "12 toed inbred" serve as a nickname.  That seems to cross the line more than any jab at someone's weight would.

I just get sick of people using the annonymous nature of the online world to act holier than thou.  Here is a clear example where you told someone for 5 or 6 posts not to do something, and then you did that exact thing to an even more extreme level. 

I tend to not care about all the fighting that accompanies the online world, it's the hypocracy that drives me crazy.

I've tried saying it nicely, I'm tried shaming him a touch and now I'm trying to make the point by acting the same way that I think he's acting.  Reverse psychology.  Maybe I'll try pitying him next; if necessary.  Or bribing. 

[Titan Q]

It appears Aaron Garrriott , at 6'4" and 215, is a linebacker in his other life. Matchup problems anyone?

Sources close to Titan Q are reporting that Aaron Garriott is not a pound more than 190.  215 is incorrect.  (But 6-4 is accurate.)  The same source says that Tyler Peters, listed at 6-4, is now a legitimate 6-5 and can play anywhere from the 2 to the 4.

Wheaton is stacked with big, talented perimeter players.  Add in preseason 1st Team All-American Tim McCrary (6-6) at the 4, and you've got a lot of weapons.  As seems to be the case so often with Wheaton, post depth might be the biggest question mark coming in. 

[John Gleich]

This seems hypocritical to me.  Yes, you claim that you felt you had to because he used a nickname for Raul Guzman.  However, the question that merits asking is how would "12 toed inbred" serve as a nickname.  That seems to cross the line more than any jab at someone's weight would.

I just get sick of people using the annonymous nature of the online world to act holier than thou.  Here is a clear example where you told someone for 5 or 6 posts not to do something, and then you did that exact thing to an even more extreme level. 

I tend to not care about all the fighting that accompanies the online world, it's the hypocracy that drives me crazy.

I've tried saying it nicely, I'm tried shaming him a touch and now I'm trying to make the point by acting the same way that I think he's acting.  Reverse psychology.  Maybe I'll try pitying him next; if necessary.  Or bribing.

... you could always try providing yourself as the example by which you'd like others to treat you instead of punishing someone whose actions you disapprove of in the selfsame manner with which you claim to disapprove...

It makes one wonder what end you desire.  Do you want an apology?  Do you want him to stop?  It seems like whichever of those ends you seek would be better served by politely asking for what you want and not stooping to the level you deem inappropriate.

[Titan Q]

This is my sense of the IWU depth chart as of this early stage of the practice season...

PG
Eliud Gonzalez (5-9 SR)
Stephen Rudnicki (6-3 SR)

SG
Jordan Zimmer (6-5 SR)
Brady Zimmer (6-4 SO)

SF
John Koschnitzky (6-6 SR)
Eric Dortch (6-3 SO)

PF
Victor Davis (6-5 SO)
Andrew Ziemnik (6-5 SO)

C
Nick Anderson (6-9 SO)
Kevin Reed (6-7 JR)


If the Titans played a game today, I think you'd see this 10-man rotation, with the highest guy listed at each position as the starter. 

I see Dortch and Ziemnik both playing a lot of minutes off the bench, and both being used in a variety of ways.

[Dennis_Prikkel]

taken his nasty pills he did this morning 

Is this supposed to be read in a Yoda voice, or am I the only one thinking that?

fonzi bear 

[bopol]

... you could always try providing yourself as the example by which you'd like others to treat you instead of punishing someone whose actions you disapprove of in the selfsame manner with which you claim to disapprove...

It makes one wonder what end you desire.  Do you want an apology?  Do you want him to stop?  It seems like whichever of those ends you seek would be better served by politely asking for what you want and not stooping to the level you deem inappropriate.

I would like him to stop, and I said that politely at first, then I wasn't so polite.  I understand your point and I will think on it; I just not sure that I think being polite will work, but perhaps I've said my peace and should move on...

[bopol]

Team's are only going to score so many points a season no matter how much they "share the ball".  I really do hope that Carthage can replace 22 PPG by playing better defense, rebounding the ball and a limiting the other team's scoring opportunities, hustling after loose balls, and playing intelligent basketball.  Addition by subtraction if you will.  I just don't see how they're going to replace it on the offensive side of the coin.

I wonder what you think the keys to defense are this year. 

Big for me is having a center that doesn't allow the opposing team's bigs get the ball so low, which Thompson had trouble with.  I do like that Thompson will be a shot blocking threat on opposing team's guards, but then the rotation needs to improve so that they can get the rebound on D.  I'd also like to see Pierce stay closer to the basket he doesn't need to be as mobile. 

I generally like Malcom's play, but I realize I don't have an opinion on Cary's defense.

I hope that Malcom's hustle is infectious for everyone.  That and Max Cary on 11 every night will make a big difference.

[iwu70]

Q, thanks for the IWU depth chart.  Do you know when the Green/White scrimmage might be?

And, is Schouten the Ed O'Callahan of the '11-12 season?  Didn't Schouten start at one point in the non-conference part of the season last year?

It will be interesting to see the development of Davis, Dortch and Anderson.  Seems to be key to how strong this Titan team is going to be.

Also, looking over that depth chart, one has to wonder a bit where the Titans are going to get consistent scoring . . . other than from Zimmer.  Some guys are really going to have to step up and change their roles from the past.  Your thoughts?

[mwunder]

Team's are only going to score so many points a season no matter how much they "share the ball".  I really do hope that Carthage can replace 22 PPG by playing better defense, rebounding the ball and a limiting the other team's scoring opportunities, hustling after loose balls, and playing intelligent basketball.  Addition by subtraction if you will.  I just don't see how they're going to replace it on the offensive side of the coin.

I wonder what you think the keys to defense are this year. 

Big for me is having a center that doesn't allow the opposing team's bigs get the ball so low, which Thompson had trouble with.  I do like that Thompson will be a shot blocking threat on opposing team's guards, but then the rotation needs to improve so that they can get the rebound on D.  I'd also like to see Pierce stay closer to the basket he doesn't need to be as mobile. 

I generally like Malcom's play, but I realize I don't have an opinion on Cary's defense.

I hope that Malcom's hustle is infectious for everyone.  That and Max Cary on 11 every night will make a big difference.

I think that the 2 and the 3 are set as far as defense goes!  Max hustles all over the court and Malcom is as quick as they come on defense.  As far as the bigs are concerned, I don't know what you can do.  There aren't any easy solutions.  Hopefully a freshman can step up and make a name for himself.  Maybe Mitch will start playing more like a 4 than a 2 on both sides of the court.  Maybe Tyler will make a concerted effort to not get beat back on defense 7 times out of 10.  We need some sort of toughness from our bigs.