MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[AndOne]

TQ mentions several recruits but not Hoepfner who intrigues me the most.

Just FYI, you are quoting newCCIWfan...not me.  I did not comment on any Augie recruits individually.

Yes, sorry TQ. I was looking at the 1st line of the post, rather than the name of the author as it appears in the upper left corner.
Additionally, I just did a very long post re my impressions of the various recruiting classes, adding some comments in addition to what new CCIWfan said, and asking some questions of either newCCIW fan or any other posters. I had wanted to modify it at one point, but somehow it seems I made the entire thing disappear. Maybe whatever happened is the Poster God's way of saying it was a confused and disorderly hodgepodge. All I know is it was too darn long to retype. 

[AndOne]

Key reserves returning:
PG - Pat Rourke, 6-3 Jr
PG/SG - Mike Boyd, 6-0 So
SG - CJ Goldthree, 6-0 Jr
SG - Kyle Pembrook, 6-2 Jr
F - Charlie Rosenberg, 6-5 Jr
C - Tyler Every, 6-7 So

CJ Goldthree will not be returning to NCC

Don't believe we have a final determination on that question as yet newCCIWfan. But, yes, its a possibility.

[AndOne]

I have made inquires as to the possibility/names of any additional Carthage recruits. I'll let the board know if I get any  news. 

[AndOne]

Here's my take on the 2012-13 recruiting class (as they have been announced right now). These evaluations are based upon seeing the players in person, talking to coaches, and articles I have read (I am hardly an expert so I fully admit there may be mistakes).

Please take into account that we haven't heard much from the Carthage front, and it wouldn't surprise me if we hear more from NPU as the new coaching staff gets settled in.

Also, as it has been said, this is purely speculation, the true ability of this class won't be known for 4 more year. None of this matters until these men step on the court. (But it's fun to think about)

1- Augustana: Ben Ryan could be a stud, Griffin Pills, Brandon Motzel and Tavian Johnson have big upsides. I don't know much about their guards, but they seem to be fairly good. Biggest question is who is going to fill the big holes left in the Viking backcourt. Pills can play a guard spot, but the others are all 3-4-5 type players (a place that Augie is now extremely deep).

2 - Illinois Wesleyan: IWU's class has a little bit of everything. Ryan Coyle is going to be a major contributor in the league, he's tough, can score from the outside and inside. Dolan, Nelms and Pennington are guards who can all shoot from the outside. They have the depth that they may not need any of the freshman to step up immediately. Like Augie, questions lie in the back court. Who will apply the defensive pressure and scoring lost to Gonzalez' and Zimmer's graduation. Sodemann is the wild card. He could turn the Titan recruiting class from good to great depending on how he plays at the D3 level.

3 - Millikin: The Big Blue needed a lot of help in every area of the game. They not only upgraded, but could have one of the top classes in the conference. A college coach in St. Louis told me Mitch Wilfer could be a stud (has the size and skill set to be a great CCIW big). An alumnus told me that the coaching staff is very excited about Robbins, Windemuller and Gardner. They should help immediately in the back court, and Owens and Johnson will give Millikin size they desperately need upfront.

4 - Wheaton: The quality of Wheaton's recruiting class lies almost entirely on Michael Burg. He's put up some impressive numbers. The question is can he adjust from small school competition to CCIW competition. If he's a big in the line of McCreary ... then the Thunder recruiting class is #3 ... perhaps #2 in the conference. Burg, Wikelius and Smith should combined to give Wheaton minutes in the front court that they lose from McCreary and Shultze graduating.

5 - North Central: The returning conference champs got some good pieces coming in. They didn't need a whole lot, but have some nice players to develop when the graduation hits next year. Not much size coming in, but some very good guards in Sutton and Heide. Spandiary intrigues me the most of all the NCC recruits. I did not see him play this year but he could be a very good guard! The question for Cardinals is: who will replace Gillespie? He wasn't the best player, but I thought he was the heart and catalyst for NCC.

6 - Elmhurst: Brought it a lot of guards, 6-4 Tyler Thurston could be a very good player (I really like the idea of a point guard that is 6-4). Chrittenden also has some great upside. There were a lot of issues the Blue Jays had to address going into next year. They may have a few answers, but I'm not sure if any of them are immediate.

7 - North Park: To be honest, with all of the out-of-state, and out-of-country recruits, I don't know much about NPU's recruiting class. This means the class could really be ranked anywhere on this list. I have made some inquiries and searches online but I haven't been able to find much. The one thing I can say, it was clear the biggest need coming out of last year for the Vikings were guards to match the bigs. Hopefully one of these incoming freshman can be an immediate impact player. I also wouldn't be surprised if the new coaching staff is able to add a few recruits before the academic year starts.

8 - Carthage: This rating is based purely upon depth. We only know of one Carthage recruit. That said Sean Valentine is a very good player who might be able to develop into a nice 2G or Wing.

All rankings are subject to change as more info becomes available.

I'll just add some impressions/thoughts/questions for any poster who might have a differing opinion or some additional insight they might want to share. While not necessarily a sign of total agreement, I'll take the teams in the same order newCCIWfan used.

Augustana: I agree that this class looks strong on paper. I have seen Pils play a couple of times, and was impressed. Operating from a wing, perhaps he can provide some outside shooting which is a definite  Augie need. As always, it appears Augie has brought in several talented bigs with nice upsides, but what I question about this class is whether they did enough to strengthen their back court corps. If the season started tomorrow, are Jurgutis and Roth the starting guards?

Wesleyan: Ryan Coyle is a good player and a nice guy. While I agree he is likely to become a valuable asset, I sense it may take him a little longer to become a solid contributor than a lot of people think. One reason is that much of the conference competition he faced could best be described as rather weak. To his credit, he did have some of his best games against the strongest opponents. As newCCIWfan said, backcourt defense is something that IWU could certainly use, especially with the graduation of Gonzalez. This is something that often takes an incoming player the longest to develop as many good incoming freshmen come to the college level with considerable skill on the offensive end, but not much knowledge, commitment, or skill when it comes to either man-to-man on the ball defense or the intricacies of help (and recover) defense.

Millikin: I guess it could be said that almost anything would be an improvement. Accordingly, its not hard to imagine that whatever the skill level of MU's incoming recruits is, its probably the best class they've had in a long while. However, I'm not sure you can rank this group as the 3rd best. There isn't a lot of height in the group. Yes, they have 3 guys listed as 6'5" but one of them only averaged 3 ppg, and another 6. 6'8" Mitchell Wilfer who newCCIWfan indicated was described by a St; Louis area college coach as a "stud" averaged about 9 ppg. Should that figure not be able to be improved upon at the college level, I think his "stud" status might be subject to being forfeited. MHO is that MU's class being ranked #3 is based more on sheer numbers at this point.

Wheaton: It seems the majority of the hoopla surrounding Wheaton's incoming class is centered around 6'6" Michael Berg. With an average of almost 28 ppg, this is readily understandable. While we've certainly seen a good number of small school kids be very successful at the college level including the CCIW, there are just as many who have superior HS careers, but then fizzle at the next level. I'm not saying Berg won't be successful or even a major player, but it seems reasonable to hoist a yellow flag at this early juncture.
I'm intrigued with WC recruit Luis Miller, a 21 ppg scorer from Miami, FL. While I know nothing about him, I do know that there is some very good basketball played in the Miami, FL area. My parents lived in a Miami suburb for 15 years, and I saw some pretty high level ball played down there during several Christmas visits. Keep in mind that all the kids in Miami need do to play ball even during the winter, is head down the street a few blocks to the playground. Lastly, might not Wheaton's top recruit actually be Brayden Teuscher? After all, he already has one season of pretty successful college experience at Wash U under his belt. At present, WC's back court looks to be its strength.

North Central: newCCIWfan ranks the incoming NCC class as 5th best. Admittedly, I would have liked to have seen a little more size included, but keep in mind that this is at least partially addressed by the fact that 6'6" Jack Burchett who started as a freshman for the 2010-11 conference co-champs, but sat out this past season, will definitely return to the fold in the fall. Burchett was NCC's 6th leading scorer and 2nd leading rebounder  during the 2010-11 campaign. Coupled with Burchett's return, consider also that:
1. 6'2" SG Tyler Sutton who banked 101 3 pointers and shot over 40% from distance, was an IBCA Class 4A All-State 2nd team selection.
2. 6'3" Christian Spandiary shot 57% from the floor, mostly from outside, was Conference Player of the Year, was named All-Area team captain, and was an IBCA All-State Honorable Mention selection.
3. 6'5" (not 6'6") Kevin Honn played on a team with two D1 recruits, but still managed to score 11.6 ppg, and to pull down 6.3 rpg. I think its fair to assume that his numbers would have been even higher if he had not played on a team with 2 such highly ranked teammates, as he most certainly have gotten a lot more touches/looks. Even at #3, Kevin was All-Conference, All-Area, and IBCA All-State Special Mention.
4 & 5. Ben Heide and Adam Reynolds were both All-Area selections.
Not too shabby for a 5th ranked recruiting class. And yes, I recognize my bias here.

Elmhurst: As newCCIWfan points out, they brought in a lot of guards. The problem from my viewpoint, is that with Foster, Robertson, and Grubl, guard is the Bluejays strength. I'm not sure they did enough to address their more pressing need for some quality bigs.

North Park: As newCCIWfan says, who really knows anything about these guys? One thing is for sure and that is a noticeable lack of size. However, as we know, NPU needs some guards who can shoot better percentages that something in the high twenties or low thirties, and who can get the ball to Holmes and Gabriel, and at least get in the way on defense. Perhaps someone in this group fills the bill. And, I agree it would not be a huge surprise to see the new coach add a body or 2.

Carthage: Only 1 known recruit so far. Surely, there must be more. Perhaps its a Wisconsin State secret? Sean Valentine seems like he could be a nice player. However, he also seems like a replica of several players Carthage already has, 6'2" or 6'3" slashers and wings. Some beef that can move and is willing to play inside is needed here!
I've made a couple of inquires regarding other possible CC recruits to sources who should know. Whether they do, or whether they'll get back to me is the question.

[izzy stradlin]

I'll just add some impressions/thoughts/questions for any poster who might have a differing opinion or some additional insight they might want to share. While not necessarily a sign of total agreement, I'll take the teams in the same order newCCIWfan used.

Wheaton: It seems the majority of the hoopla surrounding Wheaton's incoming class is centered around 6'6" Michael Berg. With an average of almost 28 ppg, this is readily understandable. While we've certainly seen a good number of small school kids be very successful at the college level including the CCIW, there are just as many who have superior HS careers, but then fizzle at the next level. I'm not saying Berg won't be successful or even a major player, but it seems reasonable to hoist a yellow flag at this early juncture.
I'm intrigued with WC recruit Luis Miller, a 21 ppg scorer from Miami, FL. While I know nothing about him, I do know that there is some very good basketball played in the Miami, FL area. My parents lived in a Miami suburb for 15 years, and I saw some pretty high level ball played down there during several Christmas visits. Keep in mind that all the kids in Miami need do to play ball even during the winter, is head down the street a few blocks to the playground. Lastly, might not Wheaton's top recruit actually be Brayden Teuscher? After all, he already has one season of pretty successful college experience at Wash U under his belt. At present, WC's back court looks to be its strength.

Agree on all three.   Here is some video of Luis Miller:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WgaZtxqiTVE

[sac]

6'1 G John Dodson III (2012) of Hammond's Bishop Noll Institute has committed to Elmhurst College (IL)...joins Bryant Ackerman & Kyle Wuest -- Scouting Indiana

[Titan Q]

Final 2011-12 Learfield Sports Directors' Cup standings...

http://thedirectorscup.com/wp-content/uploads/2012/06/DirCup-Div3-7jun12-release.pdf

CCIW final placement (out of 317 schools):

12.  Illinois Wesleyan
22. North Central
30. Carthage
56. Wheaton
155. Elmhurst
165. Augustana
229. North Park
314. Millikin

[Titan Q]

Elmhurst recruit...

Eric Leonard, 6-0 G (Sangamon Valley H.S.) - 23.4 ppg, 6.9 apg, 6.2 apg (1st Team all-state, Class A)



http://herald-review.com/sports/high-school/sangamon-valley-s-duo-pick-college-paths/article_6b5dbf7c-b062-11e1-84b2-001a4bcf887a.html

http://herald-review.com/sports/basketball/high-school-and-prep/the-end-of-an-era-sangamon-valley-s-leonard-caps/article_b8c2fb22-7635-11e1-b50c-0019bb2963f4.html

http://www.sj-r.com/sports/x1644234928/Franklins-Thoele-Sangamon-Valleys-Leonard-named-to-all-state-team

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XuS5A8fljfM

[markerickson]

Thanks for sharing the rankings.  I am surprised with the height of the top four CCIW teams.  Impressive!  And, congratulations.  I find it surprising that Millikin ranks so poorly.  I also find it surprising that Augie is not in said top four.

[Gregory Sager]

I find it surprising that Millikin ranks so poorly.

Why? Millikin's athletic programs across the board have been doing poorly for many years now. In the seven years since the Big Blue won the D3 national title in women's basketball, Millikin has only won a total of three CCIW titles: Volleyball in 2010, and softball and men's golf in 2011. If you're not winning many CCIW championships, chances are you're not getting into the various D3 tourneys, even as an at-large, and that's certainly the case with MU. Most Big Blue teams are at or close to the bottom of the league in their respective sports. (Unfortunately for you and I, the school with which Millikin is most often fighting to stay out of the cellar is our alma mater. )

I also find it surprising that Augie is not in said top four.

Augie used to be the most dominant CCIW school in terms of athletics, but that's changed in recent years. Augie wins a lot fewer CCIW titles nowadays than it used to, and it struggles in several sports -- including football, a high-profile sport in which Augustana once won four consecutive D3 titles. In fact, the slippage of the Augustana athletic department has led to an ongoing discussion of the topic over in the CCIW football room, as I think the school's fade is felt most acutely by the Augie football faithful.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Because of the scoring methodology, this year the CCIW may have done about as well as it possibly could in the Directors' Cup.  They include many sports that no CCIW school fields teams in, schools count only their 9 best teams for each gender (does any CCIW school field more than that? IWU has 9 for each gender; some NESCAC and other schools have 13+), and the scoring is equal for every sport (IWU's national title in women's basketball - 420? schools - receives the same 100 points that whoever won skiing, fencing, or rifle - 30? schools - received.  It is no surprise that the Cup is always won by one of the NESCAC schools (usually Williams; this year Middlebury).  Rather surprising is that a WIAC school UWW) managed to make #5.

Budget counts heavily for the Directors' Cup.  NESCAC schools finished #1 Middlebury, #3 Williams, #4 Amherst, #7 Tufts; WashU finished #2.

[CCIWFAN6]

Because of the scoring methodology, this year the CCIW may have done about as well as it possibly could in the Directors' Cup.  They include many sports that no CCIW school fields teams in, schools count only their 9 best teams for each gender (does any CCIW school field more than that? IWU has 9 for each gender; some NESCAC and other schools have 13+), and the scoring is equal for every sport (IWU's national title in women's basketball - 420? schools - receives the same 100 points that whoever won skiing, fencing, or rifle - 30? schools - received.  It is no surprise that the Cup is always won by one of the NESCAC schools (usually Williams; this year Middlebury).  Rather surprising is that a WIAC school UWW) managed to make #5.

Budget counts heavily for the Directors' Cup.  NESCAC schools finished #1 Middlebury, #3 Williams, #4 Amherst, #7 Tufts; WashU finished #2.

IWU has managed to finish in the top 25 every year since 2008, coming in 5th in 2010.

[mr_b]

Because of the scoring methodology, this year the CCIW may have done about as well as it possibly could in the Directors' Cup.  They include many sports that no CCIW school fields teams in, schools count only their 9 best teams for each gender (does any CCIW school field more than that? IWU has 9 for each gender; some NESCAC and other schools have 13+), and the scoring is equal for every sport (IWU's national title in women's basketball - 420? schools - receives the same 100 points that whoever won skiing, fencing, or rifle - 30? schools - received.  It is no surprise that the Cup is always won by one of the NESCAC schools (usually Williams; this year Middlebury).  Rather surprising is that a WIAC school UWW) managed to make #5.

Budget counts heavily for the Directors' Cup.  NESCAC schools finished #1 Middlebury, #3 Williams, #4 Amherst, #7 Tufts; WashU finished #2.

Some other sports that are included in the rankings but are not sponsored by any (or many) CCIW schools:

fall sports: field hockey
winter sports: swimming/diving; men's and women's ice hockey
spring sports: rowing; lacrosse; tennis; golf; men's volleyball

Now if ultimate frisbee were to be included, North Park might crack the top 100.

[John Gleich]

Rather surprising is that a WIAC school UWW) managed to make #5.

Whitewater is on an absolute tear right now. They've won 3 straight national titles in football and 4 of the last 5. They won the mens basketball national championship this year. They made the Sweet 16 in womens soccer, womens tennis, and baseball, made the tournament in volleyball, womens basketball and mens soccer, finished 8th in wrestling and indoor mens track, 21st in womens indoor track, got to the second round in mens tennis, and finished 12th and 28th in mens/womens outdoor track.

They basically made the tournament (or national meet, depending on the sport) in everything they offer except for womens golf, mens and womens swimming, and mens and womens cross country.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Because of the scoring methodology, this year the CCIW may have done about as well as it possibly could in the Directors' Cup.  They include many sports that no CCIW school fields teams in, schools count only their 9 best teams for each gender (does any CCIW school field more than that? IWU has 9 for each gender; some NESCAC and other schools have 13+), and the scoring is equal for every sport (IWU's national title in women's basketball - 420? schools - receives the same 100 points that whoever won skiing, fencing, or rifle - 30? schools - received.  It is no surprise that the Cup is always won by one of the NESCAC schools (usually Williams; this year Middlebury).  Rather surprising is that a WIAC school UWW) managed to make #5.

Budget counts heavily for the Directors' Cup.  NESCAC schools finished #1 Middlebury, #3 Williams, #4 Amherst, #7 Tufts; WashU finished #2.

IWU has managed to finish in the top 25 every year since 2008, coming in 5th in 2010.

Yeah, I had forgotten they had finished THAT high in 2010 until after I posted.  But it took THREE national titles (and several other good finishes) to do it - can't count on that very often when schools can count their 9 BEST men's and women's finishes and we only OFFER 9 of each!