MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[kiko]

This week's poll, sorted by movement:

(Rank / School / Points / Point Change)

10   Ramapo   400   80
17   Hampden-Sydney   256   70
6   Amherst   447   69
12   St. Mary's (Md.)   368   69
13   Calvin   296   66
5   Middlebury   519   55
8   Catholic   405   52
9   Illinois Wesleyan   401   50
24   Cortland State   52   50
19   Rose-Hulman   147   47
1   St. Thomas (13)   608   42
2   WPI (8)   585   34
23   MIT   56   34
25   Stevens   45   34
7   Williams   424   30
20   Washington U.   144   30
3   Whitworth (4)   568   8
16   UW-Whitewater   269   -16
18   Rhode Island College   183   -23
11   North Central (Ill.)   399   -40
22   Wheaton (Ill.)   69   -59
4   Rochester   521   -102
21   Christopher Newport   142   -105
14   Wooster   293   -143
15   UW-Stevens Point   280   -248

Gainers:

The seven teams with the most upward momentum all have one common denominator -- they have just two losses on the year ('cept for Middlebury, which has one).  Their opponents this week were of varying quality levels.

- Ramapo's gains came after beating NJAC bottom-feeder Montclair State and then Rowan.  Rowan is Massey #86 and 16-6 overall on the year.  Like IWU, Ramapo has pulled away with a three-game lead over the nearest chasing team.

- Hampden-Sydney topped Lynchburg (Massey #35) and mid-table Washington & Lee by 11 and 10 points, respectively.

- Amherst had an impressive win away to Massey #47 Rhode Island College, one of last week's big winners, and also topped Bates and a Tufts team that has hung near the top of the standings in the NESCAC.

- St. Mary's won at bottom-dwelling York before downing Massey #44 Wesley in a battle of the top two teams in the CAC.

- Calvin's gain came after beating the bottom two teams in the MIAA.

- Middlebury defeated Keene State and then two sub-.500 NESCAC teams.

- Catholic topped Juniata, who are 6-4/14-7, and then sub-.500 Drew.

---

On the downward slide:

- Stevens Point, which dropped its first two WIAC games to mid-table Platteville (Massey #28) and Lacrosse (Massey #37).

- Wooster, after a bad loss to Wabash (5-7/7-14 and Massey #206).

- Christopher Newport, which lost home games to Greensboro (now 5-5/11-8 and Massey #140) and Virginia Wesleyan (10-2/15-6 in the ODAC and Massey #39)

- Rochester also lost significant points and fell from #1 after losing at NYU, which is Massey #56 but sits in the bottom half of the UAA standings.

[kiko]

In other news of interest, and yes, I know this is the wrong sport and the wrong conference, but in case you missed it...

Caltech won a baseball game over the weekend.

http://d3baseball.com/notables/2013/02/caltech-skid

[cardinalpride]

Cardinal pride, that 3 minute span was at a crucial time of the game, I agree. I thought then, and still think now, that Coach Raridon should have used at least one time out. Maybe two. I don't know if he had those TOs left, but D Raridon is the one player that has to be on the floor at crunch time. There would have been a lot of shoe strings being tied, whatever the ref would let us do to stop that clock.
I said before, I thought IWU training staff fixed him up to quick, NCC fans probably thought he was stalling.  The home team has to supply the trainer for the visiting team, so your kinda at the mercy of that trainer. IWU travels with its own trainer, boys and girls teams. Don't know if they are ISU students, getting some credits, or if they employee that many, but they are good to have.

D3,
Not sure of NCCs timeout situation but you're right.  NCC was at the mercy of the IWU training staff.

NCC had three timeouts remaining: Two fulls and a thirty.

Thanks Greg for the information.
With more than 7 minutes of game time remaining, not sure if NCC could afford to sacrifice one of its TO's to buy time to get a player back on the court in a tied contest. Even if the player is Derek Raridon. 

[Titan Q]

Illinois Wesleyan vs North Park, 7:30pm...

(CCIW-only stats)

Illinois Wesleyan (18-3, 10-0)
G - Dylan Overstreet, 6-3/180 So - 8.9 ppg, 3.6 rpg, 5.7 apg, 2.3 A/TO
G - Pat Sodemann, 6-3/190 So - 11.7 ppg, 3.2 rpg, 1.5 apg
F - Andrew Ziemnik, 6-4/230 Jr -  11.3 ppg, 5.5 rpg
F - Victor Davis, 6-5/235 Jr -  10.6 ppg, 5.4 rpg
F - Kevin Reed, 6-6/230 Sr - 8.4 ppg, 7.4 rpg, 2.8 apg

G - Brady Zimmer, 6-4/180 Jr - 13.9 ppg, 2.8 rpg
F - Mike Mayberger, 6-6/220 Jr - 3.5 ppg, 3.0 rpg
F - Eric Dortch, 6-3/210 Jr - 3.2 ppg, 2.0 rpg
C - Nick Anderson, 6-9/220 Jr -  3.1 ppg, 1.9 rpg

North Park (6-15, 1-9)
G - Zach Cassita, 6-2/190 Sr - 8.9 ppg, 2.0 rpg, 2.4 apg, 0.7 A/TO
G - Ryan Hyrn, 5-11/155 Fr - 8.4 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 1.7 apg
G - Brett Peterson, 6-1/190 Sr - 0.9 ppg, 2.0 rpg
G - Reggie McGree, 6/2/175, So - 4.3 ppg, 1.3 rpg
F - Mark Holmes, 6-6/210 Sr - 13.2 ppg, 5.2 rpg

G - Chris Benjamin, 6-2/205 Fr - 9.9 ppg, 4.7 rpg
G - Cameron Burnett, 5-5/135 Fr - 5.5 ppg, 1.0 rpg, 3.1 apg
F - Michael Hutchinson, 6-3/210 Fr - 2.0 ppg, 1.7 rpg


Pantagraph: http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/illinois-wesleyan/iwu-men-vs-north-park-titans-two-wins-away-from/article_4d08b4fc-700e-11e2-91df-001a4bcf887a.html

Live video/stats: http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/iwu.portal#

WJBC: http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/wjbc.portal#

Massey predicts: IWU 85 North Park 56 (IWU #6, NPU #266) - http://www.masseyratings.com/rate.php?lg=cb&yr=2013&sub=11620

[Titan Q]

Thanks Greg for the information.
With more than 7 minutes of game time remaining, not sure if NCC could afford to sacrifice one of its TO's to buy time to get a player back on the court in a tied contest. Even if the player is Derek Raridon.

I'd trade a timeout for that 8-2 Raridon mini-run.

[Titan Q]

Big day - first regional rankings released.  A sign we're not far from the madness.

Midwest Region ranking projection (through Sunday, February 3)
1.      Ill. Wesleyan  .833 (15-3)/.546
2.      North Central  .842 (16-3)/.519
3.      Rose-Hulman  .900 (18-2)/.485
4.      Transylvania  .789 (15-4)/.563
5.      Wheaton  .737 (14-5)/.549
6.      Washington U  .789 (15-4)/.547
7.      Augustana  .750 (15-5)/.558
8.      Grinnell  .824 (14-3)/.475
-----
9.      St. Norbert  .789 (15-4)/.516

[shepherd]

I will say IWU usually a great atmosphere.  But IWU and the refs and or coaches did drop the ball on this occasion. They planned the football celebration.  They let the football team and other people roam on the boundary lines taunting and yelling at players.  The first five minutes of that game was out of control. What I saw was IWU players shoving their chests into Wheaton players with their arms in the air trying to walk away.  A fight was very close to starting and with the football players on the lines it could have been a tragedy.

Wheaton players may have said something.  I don't know but if they did they should have been punished and now should be punished by missing a game.  The refs did not call a technical on somebody to control the game.  The coaches did not do something soon enough.  Yet I'm not sure what Wheaton could have done besides tell the refs and pull some players off the floor which they did but I don't know if it was for that reason.  The CCIW heads including the bball refs authorities need to straighten this out so that it doesn't happen again if these teams meet again in the playoff at what looks like the same place.  If nothing is discussed between the authorities, refs and coaches then it is not a safe place for fans to attend especially with children.

No, it is not typical of IWU but their is unresolved tensions that may explode in tragedy if the above mentioned authorities stay quiet.  I for one will be contacting the CCIW authorities and demanding action.

Whatever happened with the IWU students chanting something inappropriate is really unfortunate.  But Go Thunder, your post is over the top, inaccurate, and quite frankly just ridiculous.

Here is the link for the On Demand video of the IWU/Wheaton game - http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/iwu.portal#.  Teams hit the center circle for the jump ball at the 36:30 mark on the player.

The extent of "chippy" plays in the first 5 minutes...

* The first incident happens after the basket to make it 4-0 Wheaton.  Michael Berg ends up tangled up with IWU's Pat Sodemann under the basket - Sodemann ends up in what looks like a head lock. I don't know if Berg's arm was caught in Sodemann's jersey or something, but clearly that little altercation wasn't the IWU players fault in any way.(Play starts at about 38:10)

* At 16:55, Dylan Overstreet drives to the basket with his left hand and is fouled by Tyler Peters.  Peters and Overstreet end up tangled up - Overstreet seems to be arguing that Peters is grabbing his jersey or something, and Overstreet keeps pleading his case before inbounding the ball.  Again, I have no idea what was going on, but I'm guessing it was a 50/50 little scrap.  Not really a big deal at all. (41:20)

* After Tyler Peters' second foul, with IWU getting set to in-bound the ball, Andrew Ziemnik and Nathan Haynes jockey for position in the middle of the lane.  Two big, strong kids battling in in the paint...something that happens in every CCIW game.  An official says something to them and that's that.  Again 50/50 thing. (43:06)

That's the first 5 minutes.  And I don't remember any incidents in the game after that. 

Where are the "IWU players shoving their chests into Wheaton players with their arms in the air trying to walk away"??  Are you referring to Berg, after he had Sodemann in some kind of head lock from under the basket to past the 3-point line?

And what play described above would have necessitated Wheaton to "tell the refs and pull some players off the floor"??  Are you serious?


Again, whatever happened with the chanting is really unfortunate.  As an IWU fan that's embarrassing.  But this post is just plain silly, Go Thunder.  Come on.

I looked back at the game and you are 100% correct.  For the second time my pain meds have made me see something I didn't.  I really thought I did. I'm really trying to do the best I can while working and dealing with this chronic pain.  Being on these meds for years is really getting to my thought process. 

My deepest and most sincere apologies to Illinois Wesleyan University, the coaches, fans and everybody else I offended.  I absolutely fell terrible about that post and a bit bewildered that it happened. 

Also to Mugsy who I also offended the day of the game.  As I was posting about what I thought I saw but didn't on the CCIW score board. 
Thanks
Go Thunder

[Titan Q]

I looked back at the game and you are 100% correct.  For the second time my pain meds have made me see something I didn't.  I really thought I did. I'm really trying to do the best I can while working and dealing with this chronic pain.  Being on these meds for years is really getting to my thought process. 

My deepest and most sincere apologies to Illinois Wesleyan University, the coaches, fans and everybody else I offended.  I absolutely fell terrible about that post and a bit bewildered that it happened. 

Also to Mugsy who I also offended the day of the game.  As I was posting about what I thought I saw but didn't on the CCIW score board. 
Thanks
Go Thunder

Very first-class of you to post this.

No harm done.  We're good.

[bopol]

Big day - first regional rankings released.  A sign we're not far from the madness.

Midwest Region ranking projection (through Sunday, February 3)
1.      Ill. Wesleyan  .833 (15-3)/.546
2.      North Central  .842 (16-3)/.519
3.      Rose-Hulman  .900 (18-2)/.485
4.      Transylvania  .789 (15-4)/.563
5.      Wheaton  .737 (14-5)/.549
6.      Washington U  .789 (15-4)/.547
7.      Augustana  .750 (15-5)/.558
8.      Grinnell  .824 (14-3)/.475
-----
9.      St. Norbert  .789 (15-4)/.516

I can't see Grinnell or St. Norbert playing for the Pool C's because they'll play off each other for the league championship and I doubt the loser can move ahead of others (either if the winner can, but it won't matter because they'll grab a Pool A).

I'm surprised by Wash U being behind Wheaton despite the head to head loss.  5 losses vs 4 with pretty equal SOS. 

[A Lover of the Game]

I will say IWU usually a great atmosphere.  But IWU and the refs and or coaches did drop the ball on this occasion. They planned the football celebration.  They let the football team and other people roam on the boundary lines taunting and yelling at players.  The first five minutes of that game was out of control. What I saw was IWU players shoving their chests into Wheaton players with their arms in the air trying to walk away.  A fight was very close to starting and with the football players on the lines it could have been a tragedy.

Wheaton players may have said something.  I don't know but if they did they should have been punished and now should be punished by missing a game.  The refs did not call a technical on somebody to control the game.  The coaches did not do something soon enough.  Yet I'm not sure what Wheaton could have done besides tell the refs and pull some players off the floor which they did but I don't know if it was for that reason.  The CCIW heads including the bball refs authorities need to straighten this out so that it doesn't happen again if these teams meet again in the playoff at what looks like the same place.  If nothing is discussed between the authorities, refs and coaches then it is not a safe place for fans to attend especially with children.

No, it is not typical of IWU but their is unresolved tensions that may explode in tragedy if the above mentioned authorities stay quiet.  I for one will be contacting the CCIW authorities and demanding action.

Whatever happened with the IWU students chanting something inappropriate is really unfortunate.  But Go Thunder, your post is over the top, inaccurate, and quite frankly just ridiculous.

Here is the link for the On Demand video of the IWU/Wheaton game - http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/iwu.portal#.  Teams hit the center circle for the jump ball at the 36:30 mark on the player.

The extent of "chippy" plays in the first 5 minutes...

* The first incident happens after the basket to make it 4-0 Wheaton.  Michael Berg ends up tangled up with IWU's Pat Sodemann under the basket - Sodemann ends up in what looks like a head lock. I don't know if Berg's arm was caught in Sodemann's jersey or something, but clearly that little altercation wasn't the IWU players fault in any way.(Play starts at about 38:10)

* At 16:55, Dylan Overstreet drives to the basket with his left hand and is fouled by Tyler Peters.  Peters and Overstreet end up tangled up - Overstreet seems to be arguing that Peters is grabbing his jersey or something, and Overstreet keeps pleading his case before inbounding the ball.  Again, I have no idea what was going on, but I'm guessing it was a 50/50 little scrap.  Not really a big deal at all. (41:20)

* After Tyler Peters' second foul, with IWU getting set to in-bound the ball, Andrew Ziemnik and Nathan Haynes jockey for position in the middle of the lane.  Two big, strong kids battling in in the paint...something that happens in every CCIW game.  An official says something to them and that's that.  Again 50/50 thing. (43:06)

That's the first 5 minutes.  And I don't remember any incidents in the game after that. 

Where are the "IWU players shoving their chests into Wheaton players with their arms in the air trying to walk away"??  Are you referring to Berg, after he had Sodemann in some kind of head lock from under the basket to past the 3-point line?

And what play described above would have necessitated Wheaton to "tell the refs and pull some players off the floor"??  Are you serious?


Again, whatever happened with the chanting is really unfortunate.  As an IWU fan that's embarrassing.  But this post is just plain silly, Go Thunder.  Come on.

Thank you for this post, TQ. You gave a good recap of what I saw. I thought the head-lock situation deserved a tech call, but I couldn’t tell if the WC student’s hand was caught in Sodemann’s jersey. I recall last year at the IWU/WC game at WC the WC students were just as bad. I sat in the section next to them and listened to them make some nasty remarks about some of the IWU players.  My point is it happens all of the time.  I get heckling, in my opinion its apart of the game, but when it gets distasteful it should be stopped.  Chanting Radio at one of the players (I saw the movie a number of times) was certainly distasteful and I am sure if the IWU staff knew what the students were referring to, they would have stopped it. To down a good educational institution because several student fans went too far with the heckling is as equally wrong. 

Sorry to continue on with the topic, but I wanted to add my two cents. 

[A Lover of the Game]

I looked back at the game and you are 100% correct.  For the second time my pain meds have made me see something I didn't.  I really thought I did. I'm really trying to do the best I can while working and dealing with this chronic pain.  Being on these meds for years is really getting to my thought process. 

My deepest and most sincere apologies to Illinois Wesleyan University, the coaches, fans and everybody else I offended.  I absolutely fell terrible about that post and a bit bewildered that it happened. 

Also to Mugsy who I also offended the day of the game.  As I was posting about what I thought I saw but didn't on the CCIW score board. 
Thanks
Go Thunder
[/quote]

My apologies, I didn't see your post until after I submitted mines.  As my late father use to tell me and my siblings, "Sometimes you have to put a smile on your face and keep your big mouth shut."

[iwumichigander]

Go Thunder - thanks for the IWU apology.  +1 to you

[USee]

I looked back at the game and you are 100% correct.  For the second time my pain meds have made me see something I didn't.  I really thought I did. I'm really trying to do the best I can while working and dealing with this chronic pain.  Being on these meds for years is really getting to my thought process. 

My deepest and most sincere apologies to Illinois Wesleyan University, the coaches, fans and everybody else I offended.  I absolutely fell terrible about that post and a bit bewildered that it happened. 

Also to Mugsy who I also offended the day of the game.  As I was posting about what I thought I saw but didn't on the CCIW score board. 
Thanks
Go Thunder

Very first-class of you to post this.

No harm done.  We're good.

D-3/AndOne,

See this? We can all get along!

"...cats and dogs living together, real wrath of God type stuff"

[thunder38]

I will say IWU usually a great atmosphere.  But IWU and the refs and or coaches did drop the ball on this occasion. They planned the football celebration.  They let the football team and other people roam on the boundary lines taunting and yelling at players.  The first five minutes of that game was out of control. What I saw was IWU players shoving their chests into Wheaton players with their arms in the air trying to walk away.  A fight was very close to starting and with the football players on the lines it could have been a tragedy.

Wheaton players may have said something.  I don't know but if they did they should have been punished and now should be punished by missing a game.  The refs did not call a technical on somebody to control the game.  The coaches did not do something soon enough.  Yet I'm not sure what Wheaton could have done besides tell the refs and pull some players off the floor which they did but I don't know if it was for that reason.  The CCIW heads including the bball refs authorities need to straighten this out so that it doesn't happen again if these teams meet again in the playoff at what looks like the same place.  If nothing is discussed between the authorities, refs and coaches then it is not a safe place for fans to attend especially with children.

No, it is not typical of IWU but their is unresolved tensions that may explode in tragedy if the above mentioned authorities stay quiet.  I for one will be contacting the CCIW authorities and demanding action.

Whatever happened with the IWU students chanting something inappropriate is really unfortunate.  But Go Thunder, your post is over the top, inaccurate, and quite frankly just ridiculous.

Here is the link for the On Demand video of the IWU/Wheaton game - http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/iwu.portal#.  Teams hit the center circle for the jump ball at the 36:30 mark on the player.

The extent of "chippy" plays in the first 5 minutes...

* The first incident happens after the basket to make it 4-0 Wheaton.  Michael Berg ends up tangled up with IWU's Pat Sodemann under the basket - Sodemann ends up in what looks like a head lock. I don't know if Berg's arm was caught in Sodemann's jersey or something, but clearly that little altercation wasn't the IWU players fault in any way.(Play starts at about 38:10)

* At 16:55, Dylan Overstreet drives to the basket with his left hand and is fouled by Tyler Peters.  Peters and Overstreet end up tangled up - Overstreet seems to be arguing that Peters is grabbing his jersey or something, and Overstreet keeps pleading his case before inbounding the ball.  Again, I have no idea what was going on, but I'm guessing it was a 50/50 little scrap.  Not really a big deal at all. (41:20)

* After Tyler Peters' second foul, with IWU getting set to in-bound the ball, Andrew Ziemnik and Nathan Haynes jockey for position in the middle of the lane.  Two big, strong kids battling in in the paint...something that happens in every CCIW game.  An official says something to them and that's that.  Again 50/50 thing. (43:06)

That's the first 5 minutes.  And I don't remember any incidents in the game after that. 

Where are the "IWU players shoving their chests into Wheaton players with their arms in the air trying to walk away"??  Are you referring to Berg, after he had Sodemann in some kind of head lock from under the basket to past the 3-point line?

And what play described above would have necessitated Wheaton to "tell the refs and pull some players off the floor"??  Are you serious?


Again, whatever happened with the chanting is really unfortunate.  As an IWU fan that's embarrassing.  But this post is just plain silly, Go Thunder.  Come on.

I looked back at the game and you are 100% correct.  For the second time my pain meds have made me see something I didn't.  I really thought I did. I'm really trying to do the best I can while working and dealing with this chronic pain.  Being on these meds for years is really getting to my thought process. 

My deepest and most sincere apologies to Illinois Wesleyan University, the coaches, fans and everybody else I offended.  I absolutely fell terrible about that post and a bit bewildered that it happened. 

Also to Mugsy who I also offended the day of the game.  As I was posting about what I thought I saw but didn't on the CCIW score board. 
Thanks
Go Thunder

As far as the opening five minutes goes, yes it seemed like it was on its way to spiraling out of control.  From where I was positioned, the Berg headlock was indeed a case of two players getting mixed up and Berg got his hand stuck. However perhaps Berg is shucking the case of "Johnson Syndrome" with which AO diagnosed him with earlier this season.

Where it really started to escalate was following the first foul against Peters. Overstreet and TP started exchanging words which due to the location on the floor led to the football guys behind Overstreet jumping in on and you could really start to feel things build very fast.  Then you had the jockeying for position which was a perfectly normal case of two guys wanting to own the same spot but given the circumstances it took on more heat than it should have.  All that led to a pretty tight whistle the rest of the way and more than a handful of calls on both sides that seemed soft.

That being said I think there were times that the crew wanted to be part of a pretty good game. *Disclaimer: This is in no way saying that the refs even remotely affected the outcome of the game.* However, there were multiple cases where the officials wanted a part of the spotlight that was shining on the Titans. One case comes to mind where a ball flew out of bounds on the baseline by the IWU bench and the baseline official was shielded and asked for help from the sideline official. The crowd was fairly quiet at the time and the sideline official proceeded to blow his whistle three times and dance his way down the sideline to make an emphatic point IWU's direction a la Roy Williams. Completely unnecessary given that it was also a 15+ point lead at the time.  Just a pet peeve of mine when officials are overly dramatic.

[markerickson]

Where's NPU's Aaron Weaver these days as he hasn't been in the last few box scores?