MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Titan Q]

http://athletics.carthage.edu/news/2013/2/6/Mens_Basketball_0206135515.aspx

"Illinois Wesleyan is coming here on Saturday for a coronation, and we don't want that to happen here." -Bosko

[NCF]

I have to explain myself.  I posted my question while at work, but "time expired."  Then the same thing happened at home when I posted again.  I am surprised that both postings appear.  Regarding Greg's snide comment about the info being entered three weeks ago, I am so ashamed at the state of NPU bball that I have redirected energies elsewhere.  I have rarely posted this season and do not frequent this board much. Given the rate at which the pages accrue...well...there are so many times when people will quote some obscure passage from a week, month, or year ago, but I guess it is too much trouble for all y'all to answer my question.  Sorry.

Sorry if I was snippy with you.  I will admit that one of my pet peeves here is what I'll call "lazy posting."  Like...

* "Is this the first time Victor Davis has been the leading scorer this year?"  Uh, like, if you stay seated in your chair, and just click your index finger about 2 times you can find that really easy.

* "Is (such-and-such) game in-region?"  Uh, that's right here on D3hoops.com.

* "Is there a video link for the game?"  Uh, yeah dude, it's on the frontpage of the site.

I'm out to stop lazy posting - I won't stop my crusade until all lazy posting has been stopped.

If you were not lazy posting I apologize.

I guess we all better start reading all the postings more carefully, lest we be considered "lazy."

Consider good intentions when others post.  They might not have time to scour three pages back, or keep up when the pages scroll faster than most of us can type.

Great point! Most people do post with good intentions and might only read the current page of posts, not posts from days or weeks past.

[AndOne]

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/illinois-wesleyan/titans-double-up-north-park-win-share-of-cciw-championship/article_f2386990-70db-11e2-88e9-0019bb2963f4.html

North Park did not use leading scorer Mark Holmes (16.8 per game) and other key players in Zach Cassita (8.9), Chris Benjamin (9.6) and Brett Peterson because of what Vikings' coach Tom Slyder called "team issues."

"You can say they won't rebound. I don't think the rebound total (40-24) would have been any different if they played," Slyder said. "Either they will get the message through the seat of their pants or they won't."


Yikes.

And now the question becomes whether these guys will play Sat vs Elmhurst.   

[AndOne]

IWU 88
North Park 44

http://www.iwusports.com/boxscore.aspx?id=1823&path=mbball


That's the biggest mismatch I think I've ever seen in 24 years following the CCIW.

I would submit Wheaton 82, Millikin 27 was worse: http://athletics.wheaton.edu/boxscore.aspx?path=mbball&id=2480

And I, for One, would submit the correct answer is a 70 point difference just last year on 1/28/12-----> Augie 98/Millikin 28

http://athletics.millikin.edu/custompages/Stats/mens%20basketball/MBB%202011-12%20Updated/mil-19.htm

[blue_jays]

IWU 88
North Park 44

http://www.iwusports.com/boxscore.aspx?id=1823&path=mbball


That's the biggest mismatch I think I've ever seen in 24 years following the CCIW.

I would submit Wheaton 82, Millikin 27 was worse: http://athletics.wheaton.edu/boxscore.aspx?path=mbball&id=2480

And I, for One, would submit the correct answer is a 70 point difference just last year on 1/28/12-----> Augie 98/Millikin 28

http://athletics.millikin.edu/custompages/Stats/mens%20basketball/MBB%202011-12%20Updated/mil-19.htm

Ding-ding-ding, we have a winner! Collect your prize at the front desk.

[Gregory Sager]

I have to explain myself.  I posted my question while at work, but "time expired."  Then the same thing happened at home when I posted again.  I am surprised that both postings appear.  Regarding Greg's snide comment about the info being entered three weeks ago, I am so ashamed at the state of NPU bball that I have redirected energies elsewhere.  I have rarely posted this season and do not frequent this board much. Given the rate at which the pages accrue...well...there are so many times when people will quote some obscure passage from a week, month, or year ago, but I guess it is too much trouble for all y'all to answer my question.  Sorry.

It wasn't a snide comment, Mark. It was an attempt to be sensitive to Aaron Weaver. I provided you with the answer to your question, right within the post itself.

Here it is again:

Where's NPU's Aaron Weaver these days as he hasn't been in the last few box scores?

We covered that topic here three weeks ago, Mark.

Now, perhaps you haven't caught on that when d3board.com text is in light blue, it has a link embedded within it. If you weren't aware of that, then I apologize. But, in the future, if you see something within a post that is in light blue type, click on it. It will take you to an Internet page that either answers a question addressed within the post, or to info that further clarifies the point being made.

I didn't come right out and answer your question directly for reasons that D-3 watcher caught right away, which is that some topics regarding players should not to be dwelt upon, out of simple consideration for the feelings of others. I addressed the issue once, felt that it shouldn't be a topic a second time on CCIW Chat, and thus referred you to a link in my answer to you. Sorry if that wasn't clear.

[cardinalpride]

IWU 88
North Park 44

http://www.iwusports.com/boxscore.aspx?id=1823&path=mbball


That's the biggest mismatch I think I've ever seen in 24 years following the CCIW.

I would submit Wheaton 82, Millikin 27 was worse: http://athletics.wheaton.edu/boxscore.aspx?path=mbball&id=2480

And I, for One, would submit the correct answer is a 70 point difference just last year on 1/28/12-----> Augie 98/Millikin 28

http://athletics.millikin.edu/custompages/Stats/mens%20basketball/MBB%202011-12%20Updated/mil-19.htm

Ding-ding-ding, we have a winner! Collect your prize at the front desk.

Hey, cut TQ some slack. Technically, he may not have seen the Millikin games a year ago. I assume he only heard or read about them...

[Gregory Sager]

This NPU team now has a matched set. Back in December, the Vikings suffered the worst loss in school history. And last night, they suffered the worst CCIW loss in school history. Par for the course.

But at least Tom Slyder is still coaching his team. To wit:

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/illinois-wesleyan/titans-double-up-north-park-win-share-of-cciw-championship/article_f2386990-70db-11e2-88e9-0019bb2963f4.html

North Park did not use leading scorer Mark Holmes (16.8 per game) and other key players in Zach Cassita (8.9), Chris Benjamin (9.6) and Brett Peterson because of what Vikings' coach Tom Slyder called "team issues."

"You can say they won't rebound. I don't think the rebound total (40-24) would have been any different if they played," Slyder said. "Either they will get the message through the seat of their pants or they won't."


Yikes.

He did the right thing. Benching his three best players didn't really affect the outcome of the game. The absence of Holmes, Benjamin, and Cassita turned what would've been a pretty decisive Wesleyan win, no matter how well NPU played, into an epic rout. In other words, whether they played or not wasn't going to affect the ultimate outcome of the game; margin aside, a loss is a loss whether it's by a dozen or a 44-point pasting. Given that, and given the fact that, quite frankly, this season was over before it even started for NPU, it was a perfect time for Tom to send a message to his team. I'm guessing that the four players who sat out last night's game received the message loud and clear. At least, I hope they did.

All things considered, I'm actually kinda surprised that NPU only lost by 88-44. What the Vikings had on the floor last night was really not much more than an intramural team in terms of its talent level. That sounds harsh, but it's an inescapable truth. Two or three of the guys who played last night could be useful pieces off the bench for next season, but, taken as a group, the team that Tom put on the floor last night was somewhere down in Principia or Caltech territory -- and I might actually be insulting Principia or Caltech by saying that. And yet, again, I agree with why he played that particular group of players.

And now the question becomes whether these guys will play Sat vs Elmhurst.   

Depends upon how they practice today and tomorrow. That's where they'll get to show the coach that they've learned their lesson.

[Gregory Sager]

That game was not even fun for me to watch, I can't begin to think what the Park fans are thinking.

I can't speak for anybody other than myself. Mark Erickson, for one, has "redirected energies elsewhere," and he certainly has a lot of company among NPU students, alumni, staff, etc. The men's basketball team has become an afterthought at the Park, and who can blame anybody for not paying attention to the Vikings cagers anymore? I certainly understand the feeling.

But if you really do want to know what I'm thinking, I'm thinking two things:

1) NPU hired the right guy. I'm not casting any aspersions upon Dylan Howard, who wasn't around long enough to receive any grade other than Incomplete. He might've turned out to be a great head coach at NPU, he might've turned out to be a lousy one. We'll never know. But what I do know is that Tom Slyder's the right man in the right place at the right time. I see him coaching and teaching at the ends of routs, when a lot of other coaches would basically sit there silently with arms folded and wait for the clock to run out. I see him making a point via discipline by benching his three seniors among the four players who didn't play last night. I see a guy who really cares about this team, who has not abandoned them and simply said, "The heck with these guys. I'll have better guys coming in next season, so anything I say to this current group is just a waste of time and effort." To me, it's a reflection of his inability to simply write people off as not being useful to his needs, as well as the fact that he is a coach by training and by instinct, and that's what he'll do -- coach -- whether his team is talented or not.

2) This program is going to get a lot better. A lot better. Sure, you can say that the Vikings have nowhere to go but up from this point, given that they're either going to finish 7-18, 2-12 or 6-19, 1-13, depending upon how NPU fares against fellow sad sack Elmhurst on Saturday afternoon. But the NPU coaching staff is really busting its collective hump to bring in players who are not only up to CCIW standards in terms of ability, but who also have the capacity to excel in this league. Nobody had to work harder than Matt Nadelhoffer did last year in terms of recruiting, and we've seen the fruits of that this season with Millikin's freshman class. Well, nobody has to work harder than Tom Slyder this year, and we'll see the fruits of that somewhere down the road. The fact that he has Cordell Henry working alongside him as his recruiting coordinator makes me even more optimistic that some pretty terrific players are going to mull it over and then decide to choose North Park as their school.

I'm pretty sanguine about North Park men's basketball right now. The big losses and the overall ineptitude of the team? Pfft. I've seen it before. I've lived through it. It didn't kill me then, and it's not going to kill me now. I think that I have a lot of justification in seeing good days ahead for this program. Some of you will think I'm nuts, or self-deluded, and that's fine with me. I honestly don't care. I've been at plenty of stages with NPU basketball over the past two decades in which I had no hope -- the entire four-year Keith Peterson debacle, the final year of the Rees Johnson era, several points along the way during Paul Brenegan's watch -- and I don't feel that way now at all. I am thoroughly convinced that some pretty great things are ahead in the not-too-distant future for NPU men's basketball.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Greg, just don't pull a cabonney and predict five more national titles!

[Gregory Sager]

How about if I predict six?

[toooldtohoop]

When good leaders do the right things for the right reasons, good people will follow.  sounds like NPU has found a good leader.

[Mr. Ypsi]

How about if I predict six?

If they DO it, you're a genius.  Otherwise you'll still get ragged on years later!

And notice I said 'cabonney'; Mr. Ypsi doesn't do crazy stuff like that, but some still think he is that ol' cabonney guy!  (Last year I didn't think IWU would even get into the tourney, then was certain they'd be out in round 2 - only AFTER they beat #1 Hope in Holland did the thought of Final Four even enter my mind.)

[Titan Q]

That's the biggest mismatch I think I've ever seen in 24 years following the CCIW.

To those citing bigger blowouts, again, I was referring to games I have personally witnessed.  In 24 years I have never seen a CCIW game with that big of a disparity in talent.

Obviously NPU was already really struggling...and then they decided to not play 3 regulars.  It was just a really strange game to watch.

[markerickson]

I'll say it then, Greg.  Dylan Howard sucked as a coach last year.  He rarely gave instruction when the ball was in play.  Instead, he just sat, mute.  Then it was reported on this board that Howard was rarely seen on the recruiting trail.  I can't speak to that except Greg told me NP's current top assistant coach brought in Cassita and the player who has a sensitive issue, not Howard.  Regarding the latter player, if the issue is so sensitive, why inform this board in the first place? 

I appreciated Brenegan's ability to recruit talent from Chicago's Catholic League, other private schools, and CPS schools like Morgan Park.  There was a lot of potential on his rosters that didn't fully develop over the years.  I hope Slyder can retain (repair?) relationships with those schools.  I hope he has also learned a lesson that CPS kids from non-magnet schools are true academic risks or headcases.  Go the Brenegan route.  All the best, Coach Slyder.

The kids I've watched for years at my local level are HS seniors now.  I coached some of them before they entered HS and my son has been a teammate at multiple levels.  I'd rather watch the HS Vikings on the hardcourt and mat as well as the #1 Gopher hockey team than NPU's current team.