MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Mr. Ypsi]

Greg,

Are you able to provide a little more detail about some of the new players that should make an impact?

In the (recent) CCIW it is, in fact, difficult to associate the word "impact" with almost any new player, especially when that player is a true freshman. With the exception of last year's Millikin team, I'd venture that very few freshmen throughout the conference have been starters over the past several seasons. Additionally, only a handful more have probably even played meaningful minutes let alone made an "impact."
Titan Q has regaled us with stories of players who were eventual all-conference caliber stars as juniors and seniors but who only played on the JV team as freshmen. Right off the top of my head I can think of a player who, as a freshman just last season, started on one of the conference's national tourney participants but who was far from an impact player despite being good enough to be a pretty rare freshman starter.

Me, too - including the best story of them all: Keelan Amelianovich went from JV as a freshman to CCIW MOP as a sophomore, and d3hoops.com 2nd team AA as a sophomore and junior, and first team AA as a senior.  At a school with a loaded roster, JV for a season is no 'badge of shame'; just a coach's decision that playing time is better than 'pine time'.

[Titan Q]

In the (recent) CCIW it is, in fact, difficult to associate the word "impact" with almost any new player, especially when that player is a true freshman. With the exception of last year's Millikin team, I'd venture that very few freshmen throughout the conference have been starters over the past several seasons. Additionally, only a handful more have probably even played meaningful minutes let alone made an "impact."

This is the list of all-CCIW freshmen over the course of the last 10 seasons (2003-04 through 2012-13):

Ben Ryan (Augustana), 2nd Team '12-13
Deavis Johnson (Millikin), 3rd Team '12-13
Landon Gamble (North Central), 1st Team '10-11
Derek Raridon (North Central) , 2nd Team '09-10
Tyler Pierce (Carthage), 3rd Team '09-10
Mitch Thompson (Carthage), 3rd Team '09-10
Steve Djurickovic (Carthage), 1st Team '07-08
Sean Johnson (IWU), 3rd Team '07-08
Drew Gensler (Millikin), 3rd Team '05-06
Kent Raymond (Wheaton), 2nd Team '04-05
Zach Freeman (IWU), 3rd Team '03-04


Beyond the all-CCIW guys, I'm sure we could think of quite a few more freshmen who made an "impact."  Just thinking of IWU, for example, I'd point to Jordan Zimmer ('08-09), Travis Rosenkranz ('07-08), and Doug Sexauer ('07-08) who were impact players as freshmen during that 10-year span. 

Seems like every season there are 3-4 freshmen on average across the CCIW who are "making an impact."

[iwu70]

Korey Coon.

iwu'70

[Dennis_Prikkel]

Michael Thomas, NPC national champions in 1978.

John Laing, Augustana, 1970

[Dennis_Prikkel]

Mel Peterson, Wheaton, first college-division national champs in 1957.

[Gregory Sager]

Greg,

Are you able to provide a little more detail about some of the new players that should make an impact?

In the (recent) CCIW it is, in fact, difficult to associate the word "impact" with almost any new player, especially when that player is a true freshman. With the exception of last year's Millikin team, I'd venture that very few freshmen throughout the conference have been starters over the past several seasons. Additionally, only a handful more have probably even played meaningful minutes let alone made an "impact."
Titan Q has regaled us with stories of players who were eventual all-conference caliber stars as juniors and seniors but who only played on the JV team as freshmen. Right off the top of my head I can think of a player who, as a freshman just last season, started on one of the conference's national tourney participants but who was far from an impact player despite being good enough to be a pretty rare freshman starter.

Me, too - including the best story of them all: Keelan Amelianovich went from JV as a freshman to CCIW MOP as a sophomore, and d3hoops.com 2nd team AA as a sophomore and junior, and first team AA as a senior.

Sorry, Chuck, but no sale. The best story of them all is Michael Harper: JV as a freshman, CCIW MOP and NABC second-team All-American as a sophomore, D3 tournament Outstanding Player Award winner as a sophomore and a junior (he's the only two-time winner of the award in D3 history), CCIW MOP and NABC first-team All-American as a junior and as a senior, and a Portland Trailblazer for two seasons before embarking upon a lengthy and successful career in France and Spain.

(It should also be noted that both Harper and Amelianovich played some varsity ball as freshmen. I don't know how many games Harps played in as a frosh for North Park -- we will have to rely upon the dust-covered archives housed in the library of Castle Prikkel for any such data, if it is forthcoming at all -- but Amelianovich played in 18 games for Wesleyan as a plebe in 2002-03. He was basically in only for garbage time, but 18 games is still a considerable number of varsity appearances.)

[AndOne]

In the (recent) CCIW it is, in fact, difficult to associate the word "impact" with almost any new player, especially when that player is a true freshman. With the exception of last year's Millikin team, I'd venture that very few freshmen throughout the conference have been starters over the past several seasons. Additionally, only a handful more have probably even played meaningful minutes let alone made an "impact."

This is the list of all-CCIW freshmen over the course of the last 10 seasons (2003-04 through 2012-13):

Ben Ryan (Augustana), 2nd Team '12-13
Deavis Johnson (Millikin), 3rd Team '12-13
Landon Gamble (North Central), 1st Team '10-11
Derek Raridon (North Central) , 2nd Team '09-10
Tyler Pierce (Carthage), 3rd Team '09-10
Mitch Thompson (Carthage), 3rd Team '09-10
Steve Djurickovic (Carthage), 1st Team '07-08
Sean Johnson (IWU), 3rd Team '07-08
Drew Gensler (Millikin), 3rd Team '05-06
Kent Raymond (Wheaton), 2nd Team '04-05
Zach Freeman (IWU), 3rd Team '03-04


Beyond the all-CCIW guys, I'm sure we could think of quite a few more freshmen who made an "impact."  Just thinking of IWU, for example, I'd point to Jordan Zimmer ('08-09), Travis Rosenkranz ('07-08), and Doug Sexauer ('07-08) who were impact players as freshmen during that 10-year span. 

Seems like every season there are 3-4 freshmen on average across the CCIW who are "making an impact."

Well, the all conference freshmen certainly can be categorized as having been"impact" players in their 1st year. And, with only 11 such players in 10 years (1.1 per yr), I think we can safely say there have been only been a "few" who have made such an impression.

As to players who weren't all conference in their freshman year, their degree of impact is likely open to discussion in many cases. 

[AndOne]

Mel Peterson, Wheaton, first college-division national champs in 1957.

Long. long ago in a galaxy far, far away. 

[AndOne]

It would be hard to top the Harper story. From CCIW freshman JV to the NBA. I think we have a winner! 

[Gregory Sager]

Mel Peterson, Wheaton, first college-division national champs in 1957.

Long. long ago in a galaxy far, far away. 

Defending a team whose players wore the word "Wheaton" on their chests does not come easily to me, but I wouldn't be so quick to jibe about the '57 national title for the then-Crusaders, Mark. You may consider it to be superannuated and therefore irrelevant, but, as the only national championship ever won in any sport by a CCIW team at what is now the NCAA Division II level, it is quite possibly the greatest single-season achievement ever accomplished by a team from this conference. That team, and that achievement, deserves your respect.

[AndOne]

Greg,

That record is certainly one to be respectful of. The problem I had is that my original post was with regard to freshman "impact" players of the past "several" seasons. Not the past many seasons. When I originally posed the question I was thinking of about the last 10 years, the time frame Titan Q made reference to in his post about freshmen all-conference players. The discussion had ventured from the realm of the past several seasons way back to 1957. However, I do appreciate your historical perspective, and the information you imparted was certainly something nice to know/learn about.

[joehakes]

Mel Peterson also played for the ABA Oakland Oaks.  The "other" forward on that team was a guy named Rick Barry.  I saw Peterson play when I was a child and Wheaton's Centennial Gym was brand new.  The place would be jam packed full for those games and I can remember them like yesterday. 

Peterson would have been a star at any juncture of the CCIW.  Not to disparage anyone or sound like the old fogie that I am, the quality of athlete in the College Division and the beginning years of DIII was very high.  Increased recruiting by the scholarship programs, and the heightened expectations of players and parents has changed that somewhat over the years.  DIII still has the potential to "do college athletics right" when it gets the chance.

[havej]

Joehakes - I couldn't agree with you more on the high quality of the D3 athlete back in the day.  In the 70s I believe there were less than 200 D1 basketball schools compared to the over 300 currently.  Less D1 schools, higher caliber players at D3 schools.

[Gregory Sager]

Greg,

That record is certainly one to be respectful of. The problem I had is that my original post was with regard to freshman "impact" players of the past "several" seasons. Not the past many seasons. When I originally posed the question I was thinking of about the last 10 years, the time frame Titan Q made reference to in his post about freshmen all-conference players. The discussion had ventured from the realm of the past several seasons way back to 1957. However, I do appreciate your historical perspective, and the information you imparted was certainly something nice to know/learn about.

That's fair. I would say as a general word of caution, though, that to attempt to restrict a topic of conversation in this room to the teams and players of the last decade is to fight an uphill battle, given the average age of CCIW Chat regulars.

Mel Peterson also played for the ABA Oakland Oaks.  The "other" forward on that team was a guy named Rick Barry.  I saw Peterson play when I was a child and Wheaton's Centennial Gym was brand new.  The place would be jam packed full for those games and I can remember them like yesterday. 

Peterson would have been a star at any juncture of the CCIW.  Not to disparage anyone or sound like the old fogie that I am, the quality of athlete in the College Division and the beginning years of DIII was very high.  Increased recruiting by the scholarship programs, and the heightened expectations of players and parents has changed that somewhat over the years.  DIII still has the potential to "do college athletics right" when it gets the chance.

Joehakes - I couldn't agree with you more on the high quality of the D3 athlete back in the day.  In the 70s I believe there were less than 200 D1 basketball schools compared to the over 300 currently.  Less D1 schools, higher caliber players at D3 schools.

The reasoning that you two have used here tends to be part of the rebuttal I offer to people who challenge my assertion that the threepeat North Park teams of '78-'80 are the best D3 teams ever. The usual contention to the contrary is that weight training, improved conditioning methods, AAU ball, fewer multi-sport athletes, etc., have made modern D3 players better than their counterparts of yesteryear. But, as you've both said so well, the exponential growth of D1 over the past thirty years cancels out whatever other improvements can be cited for the modern D3 player.

Now get off of my lawn, you young whippersnappers.

[havej]

There's no doubt NPC's teams in the late 70s were the best ever in D3 - they were complete and could beat you in many ways.  They had a great coach, terrific perimeter play and maybe the best big in the history of D3.