MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Titan Q]

I was embarassed by the number of empty seats at the Shirk.  This is a major rivalry and a battle of top ten teams, and they can barely fill half the arena??  Forty five years ago we (to the chagrin of the fire marshall) filled Fred Young Fieldhouse with more than that for nearly every game.  Come on townies and students - what the heck is wrong with you!

I'd like to see bigger crowds too, Chuck. But remember, there were 1500 at the Shirk Center tonight.  That would have been a completely packed Fred Young Fieldhouse.  I went to games at FYF too, and there were not more than 1500 people at non-conference games.

Calvin had 784 Friday night for Carthage and 977 today for Wheaton.  Wooster had 1229 today for a conference game vs DePauw. Attendance is down in a lot of places the last few years for whatever reason.

ISU playing at the same time is always a factor.  It typically costs IWU about 200 people or so.

[Mr. Ypsi]

I was embarassed by the number of empty seats at the Shirk.  This is a major rivalry and a battle of top ten teams, and they can barely fill half the arena??  Forty five years ago we (to the chagrin of the fire marshall) filled Fred Young Fieldhouse with more than that for nearly every game.  Come on townies and students - what the heck is wrong with you!

I'd like to see bigger crowds too, Chuck.

But remember, there were 1500 at the Shirk Center tonight.  That would have been a completely packed Fred Young Fieldhouse.

A completely packed Fred Young was absolutely typical, which is why they built the Shirk Center.  I wanna see 'If you build it, they will come'!  (C'mon folks, you're letting down us old guys!  I see no reason whatsoever why IWU and B-N can't rival Hope for top attendance.)

[Titan Q]

I was embarassed by the number of empty seats at the Shirk.  This is a major rivalry and a battle of top ten teams, and they can barely fill half the arena??  Forty five years ago we (to the chagrin of the fire marshall) filled Fred Young Fieldhouse with more than that for nearly every game.  Come on townies and students - what the heck is wrong with you!

I'd like to see bigger crowds too, Chuck.

But remember, there were 1500 at the Shirk Center tonight.  That would have been a completely packed Fred Young Fieldhouse.

A completely packed Fred Young was absolutely typical, which is why they built the Shirk Center.  I wanna see 'If you build it, they will come'!  (C'mon folks, you're letting down us old guys!  I see no reason whatsoever why IWU and B-N can't rival Hope for top attendance.)

No one is going to top Hope, or get close...that is just not going to happen.  Hope has an amazing level of support from the community and students that I just don't see another D3 program matching.  IWU has a really good thing going in Bloomington...but Hope is just at another level...a crazy level. 

As to why IWU built the Shirk Center -- the university did so because Fred Young, as charming as it was (believe me, I loved watching basketball games there), was a bad facility...it was completely out-of-date.  Not really because they needed more seats.  There was no one getting turned away from attending IWU basketball games in the Fred Young days.

Again, I would have liked to see 2000+ too tonight, but IWU's 1500 was probably one of the biggest crowds in D3 today, Chuck. And 1500 would have packed Fred Young back in the day.

IWU's biggest crowds, of course, will come on those Saturday night CCIW games.

[Titan Q]

On the Alex Rossi situation...

http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/basketball/men/ailing-rossi-leaves-iwu-basketball-team/article_829bcb7e-5f94-11e3-be92-0019bb2963f4.html

[AppletonRocks]

Final from Grand Rapids:

Calvin 78
Wheaton 51


Postgame ponderings:

1) Is Wheaton too perimeter-oriented?

2) What would the late Art Kimball have done to me had I taken a cell phone call while on the air? ("Q, tell ya what, you leave R.A. Faganel Hall now on foot and I'll pick you up somewhere around Dwight.")

I had a good laugh with that cell phone call during an otherwise sad game. 

Players not named Teuscher, Peters or Haynes went 1-24 from the field. Mike Kvam is shooting 33% overall this year after another 0-7.  I think Wheaton has some young guards on the bench that can give something more with those minutes than a purely long-range set-shooter.

1-24?  The Ju Ju Hounds could have shot that percentage.

[bopol]

Does anyone have a good sense of how good Calvin and Hope are this year?

Calvin really hasn't much of quality until this weekend except getting hammered by Cornerstone (NAIA D2 who are #26 in the last coach's poll).  They have some real size though.

On the other hand, Hope has generally played such good teams (losses to #4 Whitewater, #2 Stephens Point, Cornerstone and D2 (and undefeated) Grand Valley St) with their only win before this weekend against Aquinas.

I'm trying to make some sense of the weekend split.

[USee]

It seems to me basketball, as much as any other sport, is about matchups. That's why you often see nonsensical results. I remember Mike Schauer saying last year his team didn't match up well with Carthage. He said they are good exactly where we are "weak". I think that's the case with Calvin vs Wheaton. Certainly the poor shooting by Wheaton and great shooting by Calvin was an accelerant on that fire, but Wheaton doesn't match up well with Calvin. I suspect the same is true of Hope v Carthage.

[izzy stradlin]

Final from Grand Rapids:

Calvin 78
Wheaton 51


Postgame ponderings:

1) Is Wheaton too perimeter-oriented?

2) What would the late Art Kimball have done to me had I taken a cell phone call while on the air? ("Q, tell ya what, you leave R.A. Faganel Hall now on foot and I'll pick you up somewhere around Dwight.")

I had a good laugh with that cell phone call during an otherwise sad game. 

Players not named Teuscher, Peters or Haynes went 1-24 from the field. Mike Kvam is shooting 33% overall this year after another 0-7.  I think Wheaton has some young guards on the bench that can give something more with those minutes than a purely long-range set-shooter.

1-24?  The Ju Ju Hounds could have shot that percentage.

Haha. I think you are probably right.

[Titan Q]

It seems to me basketball, as much as any other sport, is about matchups. That's why you often see nonsensical results. I remember Mike Schauer saying last year his team didn't match up well with Carthage. He said they are good exactly where we are "weak". I think that's the case with Calvin vs Wheaton. Certainly the poor shooting by Wheaton and great shooting by Calvin was an accelerant on that fire, but Wheaton doesn't match up well with Calvin. I suspect the same is true of Hope v Carthage.

Agree with everything here.  The CCIW/MIAA games are a great example.

Wheaton matches up really well against Hope -- that's exactly the kind of team Wheaton wants to play.  Calvin is a tough match up for Wheaton -- much like I think Wash U will be for the Thunder on Jan. 2.  I see Wash U being a significant favorite in that game with Wheaton in St. Louis.

Same can be said for Carthage vs Hope/Calvin I think.

[KnightSlappy]

It seems to me basketball, as much as any other sport, is about matchups. That's why you often see nonsensical results. I remember Mike Schauer saying last year his team didn't match up well with Carthage. He said they are good exactly where we are "weak". I think that's the case with Calvin vs Wheaton. Certainly the poor shooting by Wheaton and great shooting by Calvin was an accelerant on that fire, but Wheaton doesn't match up well with Calvin. I suspect the same is true of Hope v Carthage.

Agree with everything here.  The CCIW/MIAA games are a great example.

Wheaton matches up really well against Hope -- that's exactly the kind of team Wheaton wants to play.  Calvin is a tough match up for Wheaton -- much like I think Wash U will be for the Thunder on Jan. 2.  I see Wash U being a significant favorite in that game with Wheaton in St. Louis.

Same can be said for Carthage vs Hope/Calvin I think.

There's no way that 'matchups' can account for 20 point swings in both directions. 90%+ of what we saw in Grand Rapids this weekend was random variation at work.

[oldknight]

Does anyone have a good sense of how good Calvin and Hope are this year?

Calvin really hasn't much of quality until this weekend except getting hammered by Cornerstone (NAIA D2 who are #26 in the last coach's poll).  They have some real size though.

On the other hand, Hope has generally played such good teams (losses to #4 Whitewater, #2 Stephens Point, Cornerstone and D2 (and undefeated) Grand Valley St) with their only win before this weekend against Aquinas.

I'm trying to make some sense of the weekend split.

So are MIAA observers. You're a member of a large club. I believe Calvin is better than Hope--right now-- and closer to being a finished product. Hope is trying to work more players with little or no varsity experience into key roles, and Calvin's front line is big, experienced, deep and pretty athletic.

[Titan Q]

Some CCIW ties in the IBCA Hall of Fame class of 2014...

http://www.pjstar.com/article/20131207/SPORTS/131209324/10930/SPORTS

* 2001 M.O.P. Ryan Knuppel (Elmhurst)

* IWU grad Dave Kindred, a journalist

* Former LaSalle-Peru coach Chips Giovanine (Coach G's dad) -- the 2014 recipient of the Buzzy O'Connor Award (honoring  individuals who have contributed greatly to the game of basketball)


Congrats to all!

[Titan Q]

There's no way that 'matchups' can account for 20 point swings in both directions. 90%+ of what we saw in Grand Rapids this weekend was random variation at work.

I don't think anyone is suggesting that matchups account for a 20-point swing.  But they're a significant factor in basketball.

[jaybird44]

Regarding attendance, everything is relative...but I would think that schools would salivate for crowds of 1,500 fans. 

[oldknight]

I was embarassed by the number of empty seats at the Shirk.  This is a major rivalry and a battle of top ten teams, and they can barely fill half the arena??  Forty five years ago we (to the chagrin of the fire marshall) filled Fred Young Fieldhouse with more than that for nearly every game.  Come on townies and students - what the heck is wrong with you!

I have not data to back this up, but it seems to me that decreasing attendance levels at basketball games has been a trend the last several years. I'm curious how much the livestreaming of games has had an impact. There was at least one game last year I neglected to attend because I had a computer connection available allowing me to watch it from my living room couch. If a diehard fan like me would do that, I suspect others have done the same.