MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Titan Q]

OK, IWU and Augie both have 2 losses. IWU to Loras and Augie, and Augie to Platteville, and current D3Hoops #21, Wheaton. Yet, despite the fact Augie beat Wesleyan in head to head competition, Massey ranks IWU above Augie.

Perhaps Mr Massey and Ron Rose are best buddies. Otherwise, I'm at a loss as to why IWU is #3, and Augie #4 rather than vice versa. Especially, given Augie's win over the Greenies.

Can any of our scholarly posters explain this to me? Thanks.

I certainly don't understand all of the math behind the Massey Index, but a couple thoughts...

1) In terms of a head-to-head result, Massey factors in where the game is played.  For example, before IWU played @ Augie last week, Massey had the Titans ranked slightly ahead of the Vikings...but Massey predicted Augie to win that game.  So Massey wouldn't even consider that result an upset - the homecourt advantage factored in for the Vikings made them a favorite going in.  (I like this about Massey, because it's how one would typically look at things subjectively - beating a good team on the road is tough.)

2) The Massey ratings are a reflection of all scores & venues this season.  When all of that data is entered into the super computer, Massey comes up with a ranking that has IWU ever so slightly ahead of Augie as of today (0.99 to 0.98 - essentially a tie).  I assume IWU's 25-point over Wash U (Massey #12) is a big mathematical boost for the Titans.

[bopol]

So, this is your own little invention?

Yes.

Got a problem with it?

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

[Titan Q]

CCIW fans, you may have seen that our friend Dave McHugh has started a fundraising campaign for his show Hoopsville...

http://www.d3blogs.com/d3hoops/2014/01/12/hoopsville-we-need-your-help/

I donated this morning and hope you'll consider giving a few dollars. Hoopsville is a passion of Dave's and he runs it "for the love of the game" - there are not any advertising dollars coming in, etc.  Dave could use a little help so he can develop and grow the show.

Hoopsville has become an important part of what happens here on D3hoops.com.  It's the only place for D3 fans to hear from coaches, players, NCAA tournament committee members, etc, and the only place to hear conversation around national D3 basketball topics. 

Thanks for considering!

[mwunder]

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

If you were around before the renovated Tarble arena, you'd understand the reference.  Back in the late 80's, early 90's...Toolshed was a compliment. 

[AndOne]

OK, IWU and Augie both have 2 losses. IWU to Loras and Augie, and Augie to Platteville, and current D3Hoops #21, Wheaton. Yet, despite the fact Augie beat Wesleyan in head to head competition, Massey ranks IWU above Augie.

Perhaps Mr Massey and Ron Rose are best buddies. Otherwise, I'm at a loss as to why IWU is #3, and Augie #4 rather than vice versa. Especially, given Augie's win over the Greenies.

Can any of our scholarly posters explain this to me? Thanks.

I certainly don't understand all of the math behind the Massey Index, but a couple thoughts...

1) In terms of a head-to-head result, Massey factors in where the game is played.  For example, before IWU played @ Augie last week, Massey had the Titans ranked slightly ahead of the Vikings...but Massey predicted Augie to win that game.  So Massey wouldn't even consider that result an upset - the homecourt advantage factored in for the Vikings made them a favorite going in.  (I like this about Massey, because it's how one would typically look at things subjectively - beating a good team on the road is tough.)

2) The Massey ratings are a reflection of all scores & venues this season.  When all of that data is entered into the super computer, Massey comes up with a ranking that has IWU ever so slightly ahead of Augie as of today (0.99 to 0.98 - essentially a tie).  I assume IWU's 25-point over Wash U (Massey #12) is a big mathematical boost for the Titans.

I'll buy that. Especially if the difference is only 0.01

[sac]

OK, IWU and Augie both have 2 losses. IWU to Loras and Augie, and Augie to Platteville, and current D3Hoops #21, Wheaton. Yet, despite the fact Augie beat Wesleyan in head to head competition, Massey ranks IWU above Augie.

Perhaps Mr Massey and Ron Rose are best buddies. Otherwise, I'm at a loss as to why IWU is #3, and Augie #4 rather than vice versa. Especially, given Augie's win over the Greenies.

Can any of our scholarly posters explain this to me? Thanks.

I certainly don't understand all of the math behind the Massey Index, but a couple thoughts...

1) In terms of a head-to-head result, Massey factors in where the game is played.  For example, before IWU played @ Augie last week, Massey had the Titans ranked slightly ahead of the Vikings...but Massey predicted Augie to win that game.  So Massey wouldn't even consider that result an upset - the homecourt advantage factored in for the Vikings made them a favorite going in.  (I like this about Massey, because it's how one would typically look at things subjectively - beating a good team on the road is tough.)

2) The Massey ratings are a reflection of all scores & venues this season.  When all of that data is entered into the super computer, Massey comes up with a ranking that has IWU ever so slightly ahead of Augie as of today (0.99 to 0.98 - essentially a tie).  I assume IWU's 25-point over Wash U (Massey #12) is a big mathematical boost for the Titans.

I'll buy that. Especially if the difference is only 0.01

Massey also hasn't updated all D3 scores from Wednesday.  One that would affect Illinois Wesleyan is Hope's loss at Albion.

[AndOne]

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

If you were around before the renovated Tarble arena, you'd understand the reference.  Back in the late 80's, early 90's...Toolshed was a compliment.

Call it The Toolshed (clever nickname, I think) or whatever, the Carthage arena is one darn impressive facility. Gets my vote for best in the CCIW. CC is fortunate to have a large company provide the funding it has just as IWU has benefited from the generous backing of the Shirk family of Beer Nuts fame who provided the financial consideration behind construction of the Shirk Center. Or is that the Beer NutHouse? 

[augiefan]

A few belated comments on Augie's road win Wednesday night at NCC:

1. Augie had lost their previous games with NCC, so a good road win despite a considerably less talented Cardinal team than in recent years.

2. Coach G's father, Chips Giovanine, a well regarded coach in his own right, had passed away the previous Saturday, so kind of an emotional win for Coach G and the team.

3. High scorer Hunter Hill had another great game but as usual a lot of players contributed to the win.

4. As much as I enjoyed Augie's win over IWU, I would still say IWU is the team to beat for the regular season title.

[Gregory Sager]

So, this is your own little invention?

Yes.

Got a problem with it?

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

Just because it comes across that way to you doesn't mean that it comes across that way to anybody else.

For the record, John Weiser (the radio voice of the Red Men and Lady Reds) likes the nickname.

If you were around before the renovated Tarble arena, you'd understand the reference.  Back in the late 80's, early 90's...Toolshed was a compliment. 

Back then we used to call it "the Cave" or "the Dungeon". K-Mark once made reference on CCIW Chat to the "cocktail-lounge lighting" of the pre-renovation Carthage gym, which was a perfect description. Or was that your reference, mwunder?

Call it The Toolshed (clever nickname, I think) or whatever, the Carthage arena is one darn impressive facility. Gets my vote for best in the CCIW.

Mine, too. Carthage wrote the book on how to re-fit an ancient and unfriendly facility in order to make it state of the art for small-college sports.

CC is fortunate to have a large company provide the funding it has just as IWU has benefited from the generous backing of the Shirk family of Beer Nuts fame who provided the financial consideration behind construction of the Shirk Center. Or is that the Beer NutHouse? 

I've considered "Beer Nut Gallery" or "Nut Hut", but, like everything IWU-related, I'm afraid that if I open it up for CCIW Chat discussion, iwu70 will take it as a cue to give us three paragraphs on the current status of the Titans women's lacrosse junior varsity or the IWU Vietnamese Exchange Student Glee Club. I've referred to the Millikin arena as "the Griz" in the past, and I should probably go back to using it, now that Millikin is getting more attention here. I've never really been able to get a handle on a good nickname for Carver or King, although I've pondered dubbing Faganel Hall "the Nest" or "the Woodpile".

[rollthunder]

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

If you were around before the renovated Tarble arena, you'd understand the reference.  Back in the late 80's, early 90's...Toolshed was a compliment.

Call it The Toolshed (clever nickname, I think) or whatever, the Carthage arena is one darn impressive facility. Gets my vote for best in the CCIW. CC is fortunate to have a large company provide the funding it has just as IWU has benefited from the generous backing of the Shirk family of Beer Nuts fame who provided the financial consideration behind construction of the Shirk Center. Or is that the Beer NutHouse? 

I concur completely with AndOne. Tarble is a great place for a game. Facilities are top notch.

[kiko]

So, this is your own little invention?

Yes.

Got a problem with it?

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

Just because it comes across that way to you doesn't mean that it comes across that way to anybody else.

For the record, John Weiser (the radio voice of the Red Men and Lady Reds) likes the nickname.

If you were around before the renovated Tarble arena, you'd understand the reference.  Back in the late 80's, early 90's...Toolshed was a compliment. 

Back then we used to call it "the Cave" or "the Dungeon". K-Mark once made reference on CCIW Chat to the "cocktail-lounge lighting" of the pre-renovation Carthage gym, which was a perfect description. Or was that your reference, mwunder?

Call it The Toolshed (clever nickname, I think) or whatever, the Carthage arena is one darn impressive facility. Gets my vote for best in the CCIW.

Mine, too. Carthage wrote the book on how to re-fit an ancient and unfriendly facility in order to make it state of the art for small-college sports.

CC is fortunate to have a large company provide the funding it has just as IWU has benefited from the generous backing of the Shirk family of Beer Nuts fame who provided the financial consideration behind construction of the Shirk Center. Or is that the Beer NutHouse? 

I've considered "Beer Nut Gallery" or "Nut Hut", but, like everything IWU-related, I'm afraid that if I open it up for CCIW Chat discussion, iwu70 will take it as a cue to give us three paragraphs on the current status of the Titans women's lacrosse junior varsity or the IWU Vietnamese Exchange Student Glee Club. I've referred to the Millikin arena as "the Griz" in the past, and I should probably go back to using it, now that Millikin is getting more attention here. I've never really been able to get a handle on a good nickname for Carver or King, although I've pondered dubbing Faganel Hall "the Nest" or "the Woodpile".

King would be the Dancefloor. 

[bopol]

So, this is your own little invention?

Yes.

Got a problem with it?

No, not a problem.  It's just that it comes across more as a lame attempt to degrade the facilities as if you're jealous than a humorous nickname with a strong basis in reality (it's requires a little too much information on Tarble's life to understand it easily, which I didn't even know until I looked it up). 

I'm sure that isn't your intention.

Just because it comes across that way to you doesn't mean that it comes across that way to anybody else.

For the record, John Weiser (the radio voice of the Red Men and Lady Reds) likes the nickname.

Yes, I agree that just because I find it a childish, not particularly witty and a not-so-subtle swipe at the Tarble's generosity doesn't mean anyone will.  To each his own.

[Titan Q]

Illinois Wesleyan (13-2, 3-1) vs Wheaton (10-5, 3-1) - 7:00pm

Illinois Wesleyan (13-2, 3-1)
G - Dylan Overstreet, 6-3/180 Jr (8.8 ppg, 3.5 rpg, 4.1 apg)
G - Pat Sodemann, 6-3/195 Jr (10.5 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 1.6 apg)
F - Andrew Ziemnik, 6-5/220 Sr (14.5 ppg, 7.3 rpg, 2.2 apg)
F - Victor Davis, 6-5/235 Sr (11.9 ppg, 6.4 rpg)
C - Mike Marietti, 6-8/245 So (3.8 ppg, 2.5 rpg)

F - Mike Mayberger, 6-6/205 Sr (8.7 ppg, 3.9 rpg)
G - Jordan Nelson, 6-1/170 Jr (7.8 ppg)
G - Bryce Dolan, 6-0/160 So (6.5 ppg)
C - Nick Anderson, 6-10/230 Sr (5.8 ppg, 3.3 rpg)
F - Eric Dortch, 6-4/210 Sr (5.0 ppg, 3.8 rpg)


Wheaton (10-5, 3-1)
G - Tyler Peters, 6-4/205 Sr (21.2 ppg, 5.9 rpg, 5.5 apg)
G - Brayden Teuscher, 6-3/205 Jr (14.7 ppg, 2.1 rpg, 2.4 apg)
F - Peter Smith, 6-6/190 Jr (7.7 ppg, 4.6 rpg)
F - Michael Berg, 6-6/210 So (6.7 ppg, 4.5 rpg)
F - Nate Haynes, 6-6/218 Sr (9.3 ppg, 8.3 rpg)

G - Caleb MeMoss, 6-0/165 Jr (5.5 ppg)
G - Tad Fisher, 6-0/185 Sr (3.4 ppg)
F - Joel Smith, 6-6/235 So (1.3 ppg)

Pantagraph - http://www.pantagraph.com/sports/college/basketball/men/road-tested-titans-to-play-host-to-wheaton/article_8af8ec58-7fd7-11e3-b83b-0019bb2963f4.html

WJBC radio - http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/wjbc.portal#

Live video/stats - http://client.stretchinternet.com/client/iwu.portal#

[Titan Q]

My wife and I leave in the morning for Dallas.  We're relocating there for work and this will be our house hunting week.  I will probably be out of the mix for a few days.

Go Titans!

[AndOne]

CC is fortunate to have a large company provide the funding it has just as IWU has benefited from the generous backing of the Shirk family of Beer Nuts fame who provided the financial consideration behind construction of the Shirk Center. Or is that the Beer NutHouse? 

I've considered "Beer Nut Gallery" or "Nut Hut", but, like everything IWU-related, I'm afraid that if I open it up for CCIW Chat discussion, iwu70 will take it as a cue to give us three paragraphs on the current status of the Titans women's lacrosse junior varsity or the IWU Vietnamese Exchange Student Glee Club. I've referred to the Millikin arena as "the Griz" in the past, and I should probably go back to using it, now that Millikin is getting more attention here. I've never really been able to get a handle on a good nickname for Carver or King, although I've pondered dubbing Faganel Hall "the Nest" or "the Woodpile".

As far as Carver, I nominate "the Pit." The entrance/balcony level surrounding the playing floor is elevated, and you walk down into the the seating area which, of course, is still above the floor which is still lower. The height of the entrance area/lobby/balcony being far above the actual playing floor makes you have to walk down into "the Pit' to view the game action.