MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[iwumichigander]

I would love to see the Titans earn their way into the conference tournament.  After that awful MSOE game, I honestly did not think that was realistic.  Now I'm starting to feel like IWU will make a good push for the top 4.  The Titans are a strong offensive team, and teams that can score are always dangerous.  I hope they keep playing with the same confidence Wednesday at Millikin.

Looking at in from the outside, I find it hard to think that any of Carthage, Millikin, North Park, or Wheaton have the consistency to finish in the top four... my thought is IWU remains solid, and in the 4 spot....

i mostly agree with Q.  I have not watched Millikin as yet.  On any given night Carthage, Millikin or Wheaton could win an upset over the upper tier.

  North Park capable of getting into the top four.  It is hard to measure what the  recent additions will do for North Park.  A thought vs. North Central - Vikings needed a combo 2/3 off the bench that could also handle the ball; i.e, some bench production.

As to IWU, it has to not only remain solid - it needs to have continuous improvement in several areas.

[Gregory Sager]

Augustana 79
North Park 66

Jordan Robinson: 17 pts, 9 rebs
Juwan Henry: 17 pts
Michael Hutchinson: 6 rebs
Cam Burnett: 3:0 a:to

Ben Ryan: 19 pts (8-11 FG)
Hunter Hill: 14 pts
Tayvian Johnson: 12 pts, 7 rebs
Brandon Motzel: 11 pts, 10 rebs
Griffin Pils: 5:1 a:to

NPU was absolutely pantsed by Augustana last night. The Park made a game of it in the first half, even though the team didn't play very well, going into the locker room only down by nine. But Augie reeled off a 14-5 run in what I like to call Bobby Knight Time (the first five minutes of the second half), and the Doggies were off to the races. NPU really did nothing well at either end of the court for most of the night, and Augustana looked like a team that had something to prove after Wednesday night's bitter loss. Augie was physical, efficient, poised, unselfish -- in short, it looked like Augustana at its best. And that certainly had a hand in North Park looking like it was at its worst.

Don't be fooled by the relatively modest final margin; Augie had the lead up to 30 with under five minutes to go when both coaches put in the ends of their respective benches. Augie's non-rotation crew consists almost exclusively of freshmen, while NPU's contains several veterans that've been in and out of the rotation over the past couple of seasons, so NPU was able to make up a lot of ground pretty quickly in garbage time. But that doesn't change the fact that this was, in essence, a disguised blowout.

I remarked on the air last night that this was a lesson in how far North Park needs to go. The program has really come a long way since Tom Slyder took over three and a half seasons ago; he told me the other day that he checked Massey when he was first hired, and NPU's rating was #396; this past week it got up to #23. Having said that, North Park is most definitely not the 23rd-best team in D3, and last night illustrates that. While the Vikings have beaten several ranked teams last season and into this season, they don't know how to bring it night in and night out against good teams. The poise isn't there, the consistency isn't there, and quite often the smarts aren't there, either. It's not so much an issue of the lack of size -- every team that North Park has played this season has been bigger at most positions, if not all of them, and yet the Vikings are 9-5 -- as it is an issue of NPU not doing all the right things to: a) win in spite of the lack of size; and b) exploit the NPU quickness advantage by staying focused and disciplined (hustle's not the problem, but aimless hustle isn't productive). Great teams always execute well against quality competition; NPU isn't a great team because it hasn't learned how to do that yet. Last night was a good object lesson for the Vikes in how a great team executes, because the guys in the navy-blue unis were doing just that.

Now it's time for the Vikes to put it behind them and get back to taking care of business as Wheaton comes to town on Wednesday.

[Gregory Sager]

Looking at in from the outside, I find it hard to think that any of Carthage, Millikin, North Park, or Wheaton have the consistency to finish in the top four... my thought is IWU remains solid, and in the 4 spot....

I don't think Carthage, Wheaton, and Millikin have any chance to finish in the top 4.  I believe this group will beat top 4 contenders and impact the race, but this seems to be a clear bottom 3.

But I disagree on North Park.  The Vikings have deficiencies, but they have two legitimate CCIW Most Outstanding Player/All-Americans candidates:
- Juwan Henry (22.2 ppg, 4.5 rpg, 4.3 apg)
- Jordan Robinson (22.6 ppg, 11.6 rpg, .558 FG)

When you take the floor with the two most talented players, you can win any game.

And I agree NPU is not very consistent...but over 14 games, IWU (8-6) has probably been less consistent.  I think the Titans are settling in now and ready to play consistently well...but home wins over Wheaton and Carthage aren't enough to confirm that.

IWU and North Park are incredibly different teams, but I think these two will be in a tight battle for 4th place through February 20. (I see North Central at this point as the favorite for #3.)

I agree with everything Bob says here.

i mostly agree with Q.  I have not watched Millikin as yet.

T.J. Sims didn't appear in last night's box score, although he's still on the roster. Whether there continues to be turbulence between him and Matt Nadelhoffer, or there is some other reason why he didn't play last night (e.g., illness or injury), his presence or absence obviously has a very important impact on MU's ability to compete.

Having said that, it appears to me that MU is going to be a tough out at home. Elmhurst only won by eight at the Griz, and, although the 'jays were never headed from about the twelve-minute mark of the first half on, they never got their second-half lead above 11 points. How much of this was a terrier-like refusal of the Big Blue to let EC out of its grip and how much of it was simply the psychic weariness of that endless drive to gloomy Decatur and back that everybody other than quasi-local IWU absolutely dreads in CCIW sports is hard to say.

But if Sims is going to be another no-show for the Big Blue for another CCIW game, or for multiple games, that is certainly not going to help MU's chances to pull off any upset.

On any given night Carthage, Millikin or Wheaton could win an upset over the upper tier.

I wouldn't go that far. I agree with Bob that Carthage, Millikin, and Wheaton are capable of beating top-four contenders, but I don't consider Augustana and Elmhurst to be top-four contenders. I consider them to be top-four locks. I just don't see AC or EC losing to any of those teams. I suspect that AC and EC have already gotten their narrow run-ins with the bottom tier out of the way already, with Augie's coming against Wheaton eight days ago and Elmhurst's coming at Millikin last night.

I'd love to be proven wrong about that, since: a) I love underdogs; and b) it would demonstrate good top-to-bottom strength within the CCIW; but I don't see it happening.

North Park capable of getting into the top four.  It is hard to measure what the  recent additions will do for North Park.  A thought vs. North Central - Vikings needed a combo 2/3 off the bench that could also handle the ball; i.e, some bench production.

As to IWU, it has to not only remain solid - it needs to have continuous improvement in several areas.

I haven't seen IWU play since the Milwaukee Massacre, so I can't speak as to the ins and outs of the Titans over the past few weeks. I do agree with you about NPU's need for more bench production, which is why Ray Rubio intrigues me. I realize that he had fallen out of favor with Loras coach Greg Gorton, but in yesterday's North Park JV game against Governors State -- the GSU varsity, not a JV team -- Rubio really played well. GSU has talent. The Jaguars are only 2-17 (it's a brand-new program playing almost exclusively against scholie competition), but they lost by only three apiece to Wartburg (8-5) and Mount Mercy (12-5). They'd give bottom-tier CCIW varsities a tough battle, and they handled the North Park JV without much difficulty. But Rubio scored 14 points off the bench, more than held his own against the Jaguars at both ends of the floor, and really impressed me, in spite of the fact that he still barely knows the plays at this point. He can shoot (well, duh, he went to Brother Rice ... saying that a Brother Rice hoops alumnus can shoot is like saying that the sky is blue), he's deceptively quick, and he's got good handles and aggressive instincts. I think that there's a good chance that Rubio could become an important contributor for the NPU varsity right away.

[AndOne]

North Central  71
Wheaton         62

NORTH CENTRAL

* Connor Raridon-- 25 points, 10 rebounds
* Erwin Henry------ 14 points, 9 rebounds
* Jayme Moten----- 13 points, 3 three pointers
* Jagger Anderson- 12 points

WHEATON

* Trae Masten------- 15 points, 3 three pointers
* Michael Berg------ 14 points
* Ricky Samuelson-  13 points, 3 three pointers

After coming out for warmups seemingly loose, full of energy, and eager to go, the NCC Cardinals engine sputtered once play started. After somehow struggling to a 30-26 advantage, the engine stalled completely, failing to score again before the half while allowing their hosts to hit for 10 points. The Wheaton first half cause was aided by being successful on 6 of their 12 three point attempts.
After allowing another Wheaton trey to open the second half to fall behind by 9, the Cardinals took what was what was likely a butt blistering halftime tirade to heart, ripping off 16 consecutive points to seemingly take control of the contest at 46-39. However, after subsequently building their advantage to the largest of the evening at 58-46, they allowed the Thunder to storm back, closing the gap to 61-59 with 2:15 left to play. Once again clamping down on the defensive end, the Cardinals then went on a 10-0 run to put the contest away.

During the 2nd half, North Central limited Wheaton to 25% shooting, and held them to 26 points. Like many teams, the Cardinals certainly have their deficiencies. Chief among them so far this season have been some, at times, atrocious free throw shooting, along with poor marksmanship from distance, and some limited contributions off the bench.

In viewing Wheaton, they appear to be a very much of an outside orientated/3 point shooting team. It seems that if a team is able to control the outside 3 point shooting, chiefly of Samuelson and Masten, that Wheaton's chances for success are limited. Michael Berg has come a long way since his freshman year. However, he is the only thing resembling an inside presence that the Thunder appear to have. Play him physically, and you severely limit his chance to inflict much damage. Although he scored 14 points last night, he was only 3 for 10 from the field with 8 of his points coming from the line. Even when Mr. Berg has a monster game, which he has certainly become capable of, he can't do it alone.
Following the game, there was a great deal of speculation from some of the NCC staff and several fans as to why Wheaton's Joel Smith only saw 9 minutes of PT. Last season he was dynamite in both games against the Cardinals, totaling 40 points and 12 rebounds. 

[Gregory Sager]

Following the game, there was a great deal of speculation from some of the NCC staff and several fans as to why Wheaton's Joel Smith only saw 9 minutes of PT. Last season he was dynamite in both games against the Cardinals, totaling 40 points and 12 rebounds.

That is a puzzle, especially since Wheaton is starved for rebounders. The Sonic Atmospheric Disturbance is last in the league in rebounding margin both overall and in CCIW play, and by a lot in both categories.

[GoPerry]

Following the game, there was a great deal of speculation from some of the NCC staff and several fans as to why Wheaton's Joel Smith only saw 9 minutes of PT. Last season he was dynamite in both games against the Cardinals, totaling 40 points and 12 rebounds.

That is a puzzle, especially since Wheaton is starved for rebounders. The Sonic Atmospheric Disturbance is last in the league in rebounding margin both overall and in CCIW play, and by a lot in both categories.

Smith only played 15 mins vs IWU also.  Perhaps the injury that caused him to miss the first 2 games is nagging him?  He seemed ok last night.  In any case, I actually don't think it a terrible loss.  Yes, you would think the Thunder needed every able-bodied 6'6" forward due to the scarcity in that department.  But Smith really has not been giving the team what it needs from him which is rebounding and defense – neither of which he's ever been particularly strong at.  This season especially he's averaging a paltry 2.4 reb/game and several times this year he wasn't credited with a single rebound(in 15 mins vs Calvin, 27 mins vs Augie, 9 mins lastnight) and that's just not getting it done.  Last night, Luke Peters(6"3", 170 soaking wet)  in 12 minutes had 5 rebs, 4 pts.  On the other hand , Smith loves taking 3 pointers, averaging 3/game, as if Wheaton needs more 3 point shooters.  Again, if it is injury related I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.  But it wouldn't surprise me if the decrease in time is performance related.

One positive of last night's loss (and yes, we're looking for all the positives we can muster right now) was the play of 6'6" freshman Trae Masten.  Not just his stat line, 15 pts, 6 reb, 3-6 treys which was good in itself.  But in a dramatic change in his style of play from earlier games.  It was obvious early that he is a very good outside shooter, excellent from the arc.  But his minutes had been diminishing of late because his game was very one-dimensional in hanging around the perimeter looking to be set up for a 3 pointer.  No rebounding, little or no slashing to the basket or dribble drive to draw fouls.  I was very enthusiastic to watch him do all of those things last night.  He even tried posting up a few times which I had never seen him do despite having the size advantage most of the time.  If he can continue along that style trajectory for his overall game then his contribution ceiling goes way up for Coach Schauer.

The Thunder have a decent amount of talent.  But a whole bunch of freshman and sophomores are getting lots and lots of minutes and that makes it challenging to finish out games vs good, jr/sr laden teams (Hope, Augie, NCC).

[iwumichigander]

Following the game, there was a great deal of speculation from some of the NCC staff and several fans as to why Wheaton's Joel Smith only saw 9 minutes of PT. Last season he was dynamite in both games against the Cardinals, totaling 40 points and 12 rebounds.

That is a puzzle, especially since Wheaton is starved for rebounders. The Sonic Atmospheric Disturbance is last in the league in rebounding margin both overall and in CCIW play, and by a lot in both categories.

Smith only played 15 mins vs IWU also.  Perhaps the injury that caused him to miss the first 2 games is nagging him?  He seemed ok last night.  In any case, I actually don't think it a terrible loss.  Yes, you would think the Thunder needed every able-bodied 6'6" forward due to the scarcity in that department.  But Smith really has not been giving the team what it needs from him which is rebounding and defense – neither of which he's ever been particularly strong at.  This season especially he's averaging a paltry 2.4 reb/game and several times this year he wasn't credited with a single rebound(in 15 mins vs Calvin, 27 mins vs Augie, 9 mins lastnight) and that's just not getting it done.  Last night, Luke Peters(6"3", 170 soaking wet)  in 12 minutes had 5 rebs, 4 pts.  On the other hand , Smith loves taking 3 pointers, averaging 3/game, as if Wheaton needs more 3 point shooters.  Again, if it is injury related I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.  But it wouldn't surprise me if the decrease in time is performance related.

One positive of last night's loss (and yes, we're looking for all the positives we can muster right now) was the play of 6'6" freshman Trae Masten.  Not just his stat line, 15 pts, 6 reb, 3-6 treys which was good in itself.  But in a dramatic change in his style of play from earlier games.  It was obvious early that he is a very good outside shooter, excellent from the arc.  But his minutes had been diminishing of late because his game was very one-dimensional in hanging around the perimeter looking to be set up for a 3 pointer.  No rebounding, little or no slashing to the basket or dribble drive to draw fouls.  I was very enthusiastic to watch him do all of those things last night.  He even tried posting up a few times which I had never seen him do despite having the size advantage most of the time.  If he can continue along that style trajectory for his overall game then his contribution ceiling goes way up for Coach Schauer.

The Thunder have a decent amount of talent.  But a whole bunch of freshman and sophomores are getting lots and lots of minutes and that makes it challenging to finish out games vs good, jr/sr laden teams (Hope, Augie, NCC).

From a career perspective, Smith has not been a scorer or rebounder while at Wheaton.  He averaged 7.8 points and 4.2 rebounds per game last season (he did have career highs against NCC and North Park).  It could be a little bit injury and this might be all you get.

Michael Berg will need all the corn in Manito (his hometown 😃) and contributions from everyone on the team to generate some wins.  With 4 Sr and 1 Jr, Coach Schauer has got to utilize and develop the underclassmen.  And those that show hard work and productivity in practice will get varsity PT.

[voxelmhurst]

Elmhurst 73
Millikin 65

Peyton Wyatt - 16 points
Kyle Wuest - 11 points, 6 rebounds, 4 assists
Will Nixon - 10 points, 6 rebounds
Pat Coleman - 9 points, 2 assists
Kenny Payonk - 8 points
Jalen Loving - 5 points, 7 rebounds

Jack Simpson - 23 points, 3 rebounds
Leighton Lark - 13 points, 4  rebounds
TJ Griffin - 12 points, 2 rebounds, 3 assists


Victory for Elmhurst in what might have considered a trap game for the Bluejays. I remember some very good Elmhurst teams in the Ryan Burks/Brent Ruch era dropping games to Millikin. Huge effort from the Elmhurst bench, 33 points in all. Wyatt, Loving, Payonk all making significant contributions coming in off the bench. Brandon Schwebke started in place of Erik Crittenden, who did not play for Elmhurst. I'm not sure if Crittenden picked up an injury in the Augustana came or not.

I haven't caught an Elmhurst - Millikin game in person in many years so I don't know much about Millikin. They got a great night from freshman Jack Simpson.

Elmhurst 3-0 to start the CCIW for the first time since 06-07.

[iwu70]

Really sorry to hear that Rose and Marietti may be out for the year.  They both could have contributed significantly to this year's Titan edition.  I think it esp. true for Marietti, giving Ron Rose another big body, good rebounder, and big presence in protecting the rim and the paint, contribute to scoring, shoot FTs pretty well.  The current rotation is good, but let's hope we don't have other injuries or absences.  Good to have this depth, all the shooters, but could get thinner very fast.  Personally, have not been all that impressed with Bonnett and Falatico as yet, given their minutes and increased roles with B. Rose sitting.  Looking at the numbers, surely the better combination is Dolan and Pennington with perhaps more minutes, when he gets fully over the strep, from Jaylen Beasley.  Stempel has played a lot better so far in Conference play.  Good to see.

IWU'70

[GoPerry]

This weeks poll question on the D3Hoops site:  Elmhurst beat Augie at home in OT; Benedictine won at Elmhurst on Nov. 25. How should men's voters rank these three?

Ben U, Elmhurst, Augie is the leading vote getter with 33% so far.  EC-Augie-BenU and Augie-EC-BenU tied for 2nd.    I think Augie will drop a place, maybe two, but will still be ahead of Elmhurst.   

[iwumichigander]

Really sorry to hear that Rose and Marietti may be out for the year.  They both could have contributed significantly to this year's Titan edition.  I think it esp. true for Marietti, giving Ron Rose another big body, good rebounder, and big presence in protecting the rim and the paint, contribute to scoring, shoot FTs pretty well.  The current rotation is good, but let's hope we don't have other injuries or absences.  Good to have this depth, all the shooters, but could get thinner very fast.  Personally, have not been all that impressed with Bonnett and Falatico as yet, given their minutes and increased roles with B. Rose sitting.  Looking at the numbers, surely the better combination is Dolan and Pennington with perhaps more minutes, when he gets fully over the strep, from Jaylen Beasley.  Stempel has played a lot better so far in Conference play.  Good to see.

IWU'70

Marietti just give the Titans so much flexibility in the paint.  He has had an injury marked career.  I'm hoping he can find some way to get back.  He is a good guy.
I do think that losing Brady Rose hurts the Titans more. IWU is 4-4 since Rose got injured.  Despite the opinion of a certain poster, Rose was able to penetrate, distribute or score which, with all due respect, we just do not seem to have someone who can do just that consistently.

[Titan Q]

I do think that losing Brady Rose hurts the Titans more. IWU is 4-4 since Rose got injured.  Despite the opinion of a certain poster, Rose was able to penetrate, distribute or score which, with all due respect, we just do not seem to have someone who can do just that consistently.

Losing Brady hurts in a lot of ways.  He's a very good player.

[LongTimeTitan]

As a Titan fan watching in person,I think both Colin and Mark are bringing valuable minutes to the floor.Colin does a lot of little things not noticed in the scorebook and Mark improves each game as he gets more playing time.While still playing for a top 4 spot in conference this year, these 2 guys need to play this year as they will be important players for the next 3 years for the Titans.

[iwumichigander]

As a Titan fan watching in person,I think both Colin and Mark are bringing valuable minutes to the floor.Colin does a lot of little things not noticed in the scorebook and Mark improves each game as he gets more playing time.While still playing for a top 4 spot in conference this year, these 2 guys need to play this year as they will be important players for the next 3 years for the Titans.

First, welcome LongTimeTitan to the board.
I made the same observation about Colin, on this board, when I first saw him.  He sees the whole court, does a lot of little things as you noted and right now I think he maybe going through that "freshman wall".  I am expecting a break out game very soon.
I have not seen enough of Coiln to make a judgement other than - there is a lot to like. 

[79jaybird]

Elmhurst up to #2 Wow!  Unchartered territory for the Bluejays.   My first thought is while it is great to see EC at #2,  now it's time to prove that you belong there.  With two more road games facing them this week,   it is important for Elmhurst to not fall into a "trap".

VoxElmhurst- Agree,  for a while there Millikin was an Achilles heel that seemed to cause Elmhurst trouble, later in the season.  (i.e. falling short 1 game in the W column).