MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[lmitzel]

One thing I've noticed however:  They sure don't get to the free throw line much which is surprising to me with Sorenson/Raridon anchoring things.  Only 7 trips to the line last night, 8 vs BU, 11 vs Alma.

Part of the deal last night was that the officials let a lot go. There were a combined eight fouls in the first half. Then in the second half, Platteville picked up its sixth team foul with about 11:30 or so to go. The first foul that resulted in free throws after that didn't occur for another nine minutes of game clock. Not blaming them, since the calls went both ways, just pointing that out.

Obviously kind of an alarming trend though when you look at the context of the rest of the season to date.

[lmitzel]

It is too early to really question NCC with only four games played.  What does stand out - 3.7 point differential to opponents and maybe a lack of bench depth/scoring.  Cardinals might be more of a work in progress than thought before games were played.

There might be something to that, as well. Jaquan Phipps is in his second year, but was not a major scoring threat last year; I think he's more there for defense. And moving Aiden Chang into the starting lineup to replace Jayme Moten removes a lot of that bench scoring as well. That bench scoring load will probably have to be picked up by Fehrle, who hasn't looked bad through four games, but he's only got four games under his belt. And after Sorenson/Raridon, there's next to nothing offensively in the post. I think the depth is there at least in terms of minutes, but maybe not in terms of scoring. Other than last night though, Henry, Chang, and Anderson (and even Fehrle) have a good job of supplementing the scoring of Sorenson and Raridon.

Obviously no reason to panic yet. If things go south on Saturday though...

[Gregory Sager]

We even discussed after the game that neither of us really had any words to describe what the hell had just happened. I settled for "trap game,"

trap game

I've never quite understood why fans invariably resort to the "trap game" explanation for an unexpected loss that precedes an important game. On the one hand, it may simply be the tendency to fall into groupthink or to rummage through the cliche box when their team suffers that kind of an upset, and in that sense it's probably not worth analyzing too deeply. But on the other hand, I sometimes sense that fans are groping for an excuse rather than an explanation, which is completely understandable; the natural tendency of a fan is to disproportionally attribute the outcome of a game to his own team, whether it's a win or a loss.

There's a couple of problems with it, though. One is that the "trap game" explanation is a pretty severe indictment of your own team. You're not only blaming your team for the loss, you're stating in no uncertain terms that the head coach did not do his job by fully preparing his team for that opponent in a psychological sense as well as a tactical sense. And you're calling out your team's players for being unfocused and undisciplined, which I think is more than most fans would really be willing to do if they stopped and thought a little deeper about the "trap game" cliche.

The other problem is that a basketball game is forty minutes long. If the loss to UWP had come about because it was a trap game, which means that the outcome had been in NCC's hands all along, don't you think that the Cardinals would've realized what was happening at some point and done something to rectify it? It's not as though the Pioneers snuck up on the Cards at the end of the game. North Central didn't score for five and a half minutes pretty early on, from the 15:33 mark to the 9:55 mark of the first half. Don't you think that, if the Cards had gone into the game taking the Pioneers lightly because they were already looking ahead to IWU, that that five and a half minutes in which they didn't dent the scoreboard would've changed their thinking and thus led them to step it up and take control? After all, the score only went from 10-5 NCC to 12-10 UWP during that span.

I watched the game on YouTube last night after I had asked that "what the heck happened?" question here. My take is that the reason why North Central only scored 40 points is that it was about 80% due to UWP playing fantastic defense and 20% due to NCC screwing up. I might even go 85/15. The Pioneers bodied up the Cards down low and didn't give them an inch. They did a phenomenal job of staying on their men on the perimeter off the ball. And they had their hands active at all times, but smartly so -- they didn't get called for a lot of reach-ins, but they poked balls away when the Cards would drive, they got their hands up into shooters' faces, and they wrenched balls out of the hands of Cardinals in tight rebounding situations.

The Cards did force shots, but many of them were late in the shot clock (and I notice that there's already a discussion brewing about NCC's tendencies to take possessions deep into the shot clock as a matter of course). A lot of the shots that they took were on the move without having their feet set or were off-balance shots around the basket, both signs of a team rushing things because it's having trouble creating space for shooters. And when they drove to the basket they were often too strong on their shots, a tell-tale sign of a frustrated team that is forcing things. In other words, the kinds of misses that the Cards suffered last night were indicative to me of a team that was thoroughly taken out of its comfort zone by the defense.

It was like watching Ryan-era UWP rather than current-era UWP, and that's the highest compliment that I can pay to any defense, not just a UW-Platteville defense. You really had to have seen Bo Ryan's Pioneers teams of the '90s to appreciate just how robustly they would bulldog your offense for forty minutes a pop. I only saw his Pioneers teams play two or three times, but those memories stick with me. Every game that they played looked like last night; if you scored 60 points against UW-Platteville in the '90s, you felt as though you had really accomplished something.

Forget the "trap game" stuff, guys. Just tip your caps to UW-Platteville and congratulate the Pioneers on a job really, really well done.

Which will be higher: Seibring's and Sorenson's combined points and rebounds in the men's game, or the combined number of turnovers in the IWU @ NCC women's game?

I wanted to wait until morning to answer this; partially because typing it out on my phone would have been weird, and partially because I wanted to think about it. It was a toss up. Now, I think I'm leaning total combined turnovers in the women's game unless Angry Alex Sorenson shows up and/or Trevor Seibring has the night of his life. Which, if North Central plays like they did last night, isn't out of the realm of possibility.

[/overreactingtoonebadloss]

Well, I was just joking with that comment, so I hope that I didn't force you to use up too much brainpower in contemplating a response. But you've got the right outlook in that you've self-diagnosed that you're overreacting to one bad loss. The Cardinals will be just fine.

As shocked as I am at the outcome last night, I don't have any doubt that it was just one of those games for NCC.  16-55, 29%, from the field?  They likely saw that Platteville lost to consensus-lowly Wheaton last week, playing at home, and simply took the game very lightly and couldn't right the ship.

That's kind of a back-formation way of calling it a "trap game" -- instead of blaming the Cards for looking ahead to IWU, you're blaming them for looking back to UWP vs. lightly-regarded Wheaton -- and I doubt that it's any more valid for the same reason: NCC would've snapped out of it fairly early once it realized that the Pioneers weren't going to be a walkover.

I think that you had it right the first time: it was just one of those games for NCC. That, and UWP probably would've beaten anybody in D3 last night for as well as the Pioneers played on defense.

Again, nobody who roots for North Central has any reason to panic. As badly as the Cards were whipped last night, it's just one game. As I said, the Cardinals will be just fine.

They won't make that mistake Saturday and this will likely be a good wakeup to guard against during CCIW play where we all know that no victory is assured.

Certainly a disappointing loss for NCC fans but no panic button necessary.  I think they are still the team to beat in the league this year. 

One thing I've noticed however:  They sure don't get to the free throw line much which is surprising to me with Sorenson/Raridon anchoring things.  Only 7 trips to the line last night, 8 vs BU, 11 vs Alma.

Sorenson never gets to the line much. He averaged fewer than three FTAs per game last season. This season he's had only seven FTAs in four games. (And he's like a smaller, paler Shaquille O'Neal when he does get to the FT line, but that's another topic entirely.) For a big man, he shoots an inordinate number of jump shots. Raridon is more apt to both back in an opponent and to penetrate, which is why he gets to the line more.

But you're right on the mark in noting that NCC isn't shooting many free throws as a team. Last season the Cards were one of the most prolific teams in the league at the charity stripe. This year? Look at the CCIW stats in FTAs per game:

Elmhurst	30.4
Millikin	26.4
Wheaton	24.3
Carthage	23.6
Carroll	23.2
Augustana	22.4
North Park	20.0
Illinois Wesleyan	18.4
North Central	12.5

Even when you keep in mind that Elmhurst and Millikin have inflated FTA numbers due to their respective games against Greenville, the Cardinals are still shockingly below the rest of the league in terms of how often they get to the charity stripe.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Maybe "trap game" isn't a valid excuse for the CCIW, but it's a very real thing in much of D3.  Players look at the schedule as much as anyone - even if the coach is focused on the next opponent, the players still have to be motivated.  Some coaches are better at that than others, but even the best coaches admit its tougher to instill that discipline in teams with younger or less experienced players - time in the culture fights "trap game" tendencies.  I don't say that to make any specific comment on North Central, but just that, generally, for whatever reason, trap games do in fact occur.

[Gregory Sager]

Sure, I'll buy that it might happen sometimes in general terms, although I think it happens a lot less than people suspect. But I won't buy it for NCC in specific last night, not just for the reasons I've already stated but also because: a) the Cardinals are an outfit whose starters were all regulars on a 19-8 D3 tourney team last season; b) they would've learned the lesson last year not to overlook anybody after they were walloped at home by a Chicago team that was 1-2 at the time and then dropped a contest at Aurora right after the Chicago loss; and c) nobody in his right mind would ever consider a contest against a WIAC opponent to be a "trap game" -- the WIAC is too well-respected around these parts for that.

[Pat Coleman]

North Central is on a different academic calendar than everyone else, right? Is it finals week there?

[Gregory Sager]

Nope. North Central has a D-term, and it started this week.

[AndOne]

It is too early to really question NCC with only four games played.  What does stand out - 3.7 point differential to opponents and maybe a lack of bench depth/scoring.  Cardinals might be more of a work in progress than thought before games were played.

There might be something to that, as well. Jaquan Phipps is in his second year, but was not a major scoring threat last year; I think he's more there for defense. And moving Aiden Chang into the starting lineup to replace Jayme Moten removes a lot of that bench scoring as well. That bench scoring load will probably have to be picked up by Fehrle, who hasn't looked bad through four games, but he's only got four games under his belt. And after Sorenson/Raridon, there's next to nothing offensively in the post. I think the depth is there at least in terms of minutes, but maybe not in terms of scoring. Other than last night though, Henry, Chang, and Anderson (and even Fehrle) have a good job of supplementing the scoring of Sorenson and Raridon.

Obviously no reason to panic yet. If things go south on Saturday though...

1. JQ Phipps forte is definitely defense. He does not get minutes because of his offense, and isn't really looked at to score much. Any points he registers are a bonus. Quickness, athleticism, strength, and on-the-ball defense are what he is usually inserted to provide.
2. Last year the Cards bench was a major strength. In 6th and 7th men Kevin Honn and Aiden Chang they had TWO guys who could have started for 95% of the teams in the country. Consider that Honn finished 20th in CCIW scoring and 13th in rebounding despite playing only about 20 minutes a game. Chang was a 41% 3 point shooter who could provide instant offense. Honn was probably NCC's best player over the last month, and performed at an all-conference level.
This year so far, NCC has 1/2 of a bench player. Sam Fehrle has been very good in 2 games, and just kind of out there in 2 others, including last night (like everyone else). However, this inconsistency is to be expected. Sam is only a freshman, just 4 games into his college career. Like any freshman, he is still learning, and needs to get stronger. He is going to be a very good player for NCC, likely All-Conference. But it will take a while, as should be expected.
3. NCC's bigs need to be more aggressive inside earlier in a possession. If, for whatever reason this is a problem, they need to more often not settle for an outside shot (especially a late and off balance one), but rather put the ball on the floor, drive, and go to the basket to convert or draw a foul. Even if they miss the FT, the defender has picked up another foul which might help disqualify him.
4. Perimeter players need to be aware of spacing and pace, keep moving to get themselves open, and, especially, to take the open shot when they've got one instead of a crappy shot late(r) in the possession.
5. College players should be able to make layups, and hit a decent percentage of FTs.
6. If you're into the futures market, bet on seeing a new face beginning to see more time in the NCC lineup.

[AndOne]

North Central is on a different academic calendar than everyone else, right? Is it finals week there?

NCC is on a trimester system with each term being 10 weeks long followed by finals on Mon, Tues, & Wed of the 11th week. 1st term always ends with finals being the 3 days before Thanksgiving. Christmas, or Holiday if you prefer, vacation starts Thanksgiving Day, and runs until the first Mon in Jan (Tues this school year as the Sun New Year's Day Holiday will be taken on Mon., 1/2). Accordingly, most NCC students have an almost 6 week vacation every year.

Beginning the Mon after Thanksgiving (11/28-12/16 this yr), students can take a 3 week D-Term class. A limited number of traditional classes are held on campus, but most D-Term classes are things like study abroad, faculty led classes in places like Greece, France, or Australia, independent research funded by Richter Fellowships, or Service Trip options like working in community development in West Virginia with the Appalachian Service Project, Mission Of Hope trips to Haiti, or hurricane relief in Louisiana. On campus students get to stay in the dorms and eat in the cafeteria for no additional cost.

Due to practice, in season athletes do not take D-Term classes.
With specific reference to basketball, last week was basically a lost week as far as a regular schedule and practices were concerned. Players had finals Mon-Wed so on those days practices were abbreviated and not fully attended depending on exam schedules. Wed night NCC played Alma, Thursday was T'Giving, and Fri night they played Aurora.
Not an excuse, but the kids had a lot more on their minds than basketball last week which was both very mentally and physically taxing.

[Titan Q]

My take is that the reason why North Central only scored 40 points is that it was about 80% due to UWP playing fantastic defense and 20% due to NCC screwing up. I might even go 85/15.

I watched the whole game.  Agree 100% with this.

Overall game analysis -- UWP played well, NCC played poorly.

[4samuy]

Augie up 38-35 at half against Oskosh.  Both teams shooting over 60%. Augie had 10 players in the game within the first seven minutes. No question Augie needs to iron out its defensive inefficiencies, which will probably come with time.  One important stat is that they are shooting 81% as a team from foul line thus far for the year.

[markerickson]

Yes, I misspoke.  When I said "future" I meant the 2017-18 season.

Watching the NPU/Alma game right now.  Hard to believe the latter is ranked.  The Scots must have graduated some good players 'cause I don't see how this group got to the Elite Eight last year.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Yes, I misspoke.  When I said "future" I meant the 2017-18 season.

Watching the NPU/Alma game right now.  Hard to believe the latter is ranked.  The Scots must have graduated some good players 'cause I don't see how this group got to the Elite Eight last year.

Alma was ranked preseason, but since then voters have gotten more information (not just the game results, but two long-term, perhaps season ending, injuries to key players; they also graduated their two top scorers, and #3 transferred).  In this week's poll, Alma is not only not ranked, they didn't receive a single vote.

[Gregory Sager]

North Park 88
Alma 81

Jordan Robinson: 25 pts, 8 rebs, 3 blks
Colin Lake: 22 pts
Juwan Henry: 20 pts, 3 blks, 3:0 a:to
Darius Brown: 7 rebs

So much for the theory that the Vikings can't win on a night when the treys aren't falling. NPU shot an atrocious 4-24 (17%) from downtown, and still managed to pull out the win, however ugly it was. Furthermore, they did it with Jordan Robinson sidelined for much of the game with foul trouble. He only played 25 minutes tonight. The Vikings got their usual sterling defensive effort from T.J. Cobbs, while Jarvis Cannon and Darius Brown stepped up and played strong support roles.

Alma is very young -- five of the eight Scots who saw the floor tonight are freshmen -- and thus prone to a lot of self-inflicted mistakes. But that freshman class of theirs is really, really good. Once they have some experience, they're going to be tough. I wouldn't count out the Scots in terms of making the MIAA tourney.

Not a pretty one tonight, but finding a way to win when your shooters find a lid on the basket is a sign of a good team.

[Gregory Sager]

Augustana 77
UW-Oshkosh 64

Dylan Sortillo had 20 points, Jacob Johnston had 14 and 7, Brett Benning added 14 more off the bench, and Pierson Wofford had 10 for Augie.