MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[WUPHF]

Interestingly, the final season of the Coach Edwards era included 4 players from Chicago and 3 from St. Louis.

I say Chicago players because even though they are from the suburbs, the use of Chicago as a stand-in for Chicago-area is commonly understood among all but one person on the boards.

Not that anyone cares, but Washington University admissions has always had a lot of Chicago students in general.

[Gregory Sager]

Interestingly, the final season of the Coach Edwards era included 4 players from Chicago and 3 from St. Louis.

I say Chicago players because even though they are from the suburbs, the use of Chicago as a stand-in for Chicago-area is commonly understood among all but one person on the boards.

Hey, I resemble that remark!

The Chicagoland suburbs aren't Chicago, no way, no how. Hence, the common use of the term "Chicagoland" in the first place.

[Gregory Sager]

Those are fascinating stats. For me, it begs the question of "why?" Is Wash U intentionally focusing on Chicago vs. local? Are they failing to attract local? Is there a shortage of local talent? A combination of all these? Something else?

Wash U is an academically elite institution, and as such it has a nationally-based student body -- same as the rest of the UAA, and the NESCAC as well. The school's sports teams are a reflection of that. It isn't a matter of "attract local" or "not attract local," because the school doesn't operate that way. UAA coaches recruit wherever they can find a UAA-level athlete who also has the top-echelon grades and test scores sufficient to gain admission to their schools. One way that they find them is that there are showcase camps across the country that cater to exactly that sort of high-powered student-athlete, and these camps are scouted by the UAA and NESCAC coaches (as well as Ivy League and Patriot League coaches). Some of it is just old-fashioned word of mouth, or the end result of high-school guidance counselors steering their high-achievement students towards top academic colleges and universities, with basketball players thus making the connection that way. And some of it is just plain ol' legwork on the part of coaches like Pat Juckem who establish contacts with the sort of academically elite high schools across the country (schools which in Chicagoland would include New Trier, Glenbrook North, Payton, Northside Prep, Stevenson, Libertyville, Hersey, Whitney Young, Hinsdale Central, Jones Prep, etc.) that are more apt to produce a UAA student-athlete than others.

As for why Wash U recruits more players from Chicagoland than from the St. Louis area, well ... WUPHF will correct me if I'm wrong, but I'm betting that Wash U has more students in general from Chicagoland than from the St. Louis area due to simple demographics. Chicagoland has 9.4 million people, while Greater St. Louis has 2.8 million. I'm sure that there's somewhat of a local tilt, because eighteen-year-olds who seek a school more than 150 miles from home are a minority, but by and large it's a matter of demographics. The greater the population of a region, the greater the number of high-school students that fit Wash U's exclusive admissions parameters.

I attended a large high school in upstate New York as a teenager, and I knew two people there who went to Wash U -- one of my best friends in the Honors division of my class, and his older brother -- because the older brother's guidance counselor knew that he had the grades and the test scores to get into an elite school, and steered him in that direction. Trust me, nobody from my high school ever got steered by a guidance counselor towards a CCIW school. That's not because they're bad schools; it's because they're regional schools, as opposed to national schools, with regard to their draw. The only exceptions are North Park, which is quirky in CCIW terms because it has always catered to its parent denomination (whose members are scattered widely across the country) and because its urban location makes it a magnet for international students, and Wheaton, because it exclusively admits evangelical Christian students and has both the means and the academic reputation to draw them from across the country.

(Admittedly, it's slightly different in athletics; NPU is much more Chicagoland-centric in most of its sports rosters than is the NPU undergrad student body at large, while other CCIW schools -- Augustana leaps to mind, with its Colorado athletics connections -- are slightly less regional in terms of student-athletes than they are in terms of the at-large student population.)

[Ultimate Titan Fan]

I see exactly what you're saying, Gregory. I wonder if that's a double-edged sword. More time and resources spent recruiting nationally means less spent locally, giving other motivated programs a greater chance in recruiting in the St. L. area.

[Titan Q]

* Word is also circulating about a possible noteworthy transfer. We'll see if anything comes of this.

I've heard this rumor...but no confirmation.

https://merrimackathletics.com/sports/mens-basketball/roster/ethan-helwig/10110

[WUPHF]

I see exactly what you're saying, Gregory. I wonder if that's a double-edged sword. More time and resources spent recruiting nationally means less spent locally, giving other motivated programs a greater chance in recruiting in the St. L. area.

I can only speak for one of my favorite Washington University coaches who retired years ago, but he was more than happy to recruit nationally as the foundation for recruiting nationally had been laid.

Maybe this happens everywhere but I know at least one coach who regularly checked for recruits who had indicated to him that they had no plans to play but had enrolled at the University anyway.  I know he found at least one four-year starter that way.

Neither coached basketball, but both had lots of interesting recruiting stories as I guess all coaches do.

[Gregory Sager]

I see exactly what you're saying, Gregory. I wonder if that's a double-edged sword. More time and resources spent recruiting nationally means less spent locally, giving other motivated programs a greater chance in recruiting in the St. L. area.

Well, yes and no. There's limited overlap involved. Think of recruiting in Greater St. Louis in terms of a Venn diagram. Of all of the high-school boy's basketball players in and around the Gateway City who want to play in college (and have the ability to do so), the slice of the circle that would be interested in Wash U -- and who have both the ability and the academic chops to warrant being recruited by Pat Juckem -- is comparatively small. And there's likely little to no overlap between that small slice and the much greater slice of the circle that constitutes the players that SLIAC teams are recruiting. There is, however, likely some overlap between that relatively tiny Wash U slice and the bigger (but not SLIAC-big) slice that the two CCIW schools that recruit the Greater St. Louis area, Illinois Wesleyan and Millikin, have.

If the IWU and Millikin men's basketball programs keep investing time and energy in Greater St. Louis -- and I think that that's only likely to increase for both schools, especially Millikin in the wake of its new coaching hire -- they're bound to bump into Pat Juckem every now and then in terms of looking at the same player. But I suspect that it's more the exception than the rule, because: a) Pat Juckem has to cast a vastly wider net geographically than either Ron Rose or Kramer Soderberg; and b) there will be St. Louis area players who Rose and/or Soderberg pursue that Juckem won't.

Caveat: This is mostly speculation on my part, because my insider info is limited with regard to the schools involved. It's based upon my years of observation and what I know of the respective D3 schools that recruit Greater St. Louis. Again, WUPHF will correct me if I'm wrong about any of this.

[WUPHF]

No disagreements.  It would be interesting to know how actively the St. Louis area players had to be recruited, relative to other players.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

I'm curious how much travel WashU does for recruiting. I know the NESCAC and NE UAA schools (and Centennial and Liberty League, too) spend a lot of time at Ivy sponsored camps. I wonder how often Emory or WashU or other elite academic programs father afield, venture to those as well.

[iwumichigander]

Ron Rose and the Titans have landed 6-7 Nick Roper from MICDS HS in STL.

As a SR averaged 12 pts, 8 reb, 4 assists.

Long, athletic, and skilled player.  Chose IWU over D1 and D2 opportunities.

Huge one for the Titans.

https://www.hudl.com/video/3/10432434/5e7d27c11600f60a2444d4c6

oh boy, he will be tough to guard!  Give him two summers in weight room, he will be featured in every opponent's game plan.

He reminds me of two or three previous D3 players capable of D1 or 2 whom I will mention right now. You just do not see those 6'8" skills in but a handful of D3 incoming freshmen.

[iwumichigander]

IWU commit Nathan Valentine was named Captain of the 2021 Daily Herald Fox Valley All-Area Team.

https://basketball.dailyherald.com/sports/20210320/wait-worth-it-for-genevas-valentine?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

I was just looking at his year highlights video. Insane. Check out his 3 pt shots. I bet a third are from NBA range.

He looks like a really talented kid.

https://www.hudl.com/video/3/13928095/6050b88a8cd40108e8126f4b

Well, my first thought was the refs in that conference do not call fouls on 3
Point shots.  So the lad will have already been accustomed to physical CCIW play.

A little unorthodox shot.  Needs to work on not jumping forward on shot.  Sets his feet pretty well by squaring to basketball.  Quick release ulmost insane.  Realizing it is a highlight video, he will shoot from 'anywhere in th gym'. Does have potential to be dangerous

[iwumichigander]

* Word is also circulating about a possible noteworthy transfer. We'll see if anything comes of this.

I've heard this rumor...but no confirmation.

https://merrimackathletics.com/sports/mens-basketball/roster/ethan-helwig/10110

Not saying this is the transfer.  BUT, having lived in New Hampshire, worked in Boston and very familiar with North Andover, Mass. I will guarantee this.  A college that fields men's and women's  ice hockey, field hockey/lacrosse  and soccer ... basketball is not a major sport (neither is football).

And, Merrimack began the transition  from D2 to D1 so no post season NCAA , NIT or NEC playoff chances until 2024.  Add to the mix changes in the portal rules and extra year eligibility, the young could be representative of the "overcrowding " at Div 1&2 this season and IMHO next season.

[Mr. Ypsi]

IWU commit Nathan Valentine was named Captain of the 2021 Daily Herald Fox Valley All-Area Team.

https://basketball.dailyherald.com/sports/20210320/wait-worth-it-for-genevas-valentine?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

I was just looking at his year highlights video. Insane. Check out his 3 pt shots. I bet a third are from NBA range.

He looks like a really talented kid.

https://www.hudl.com/video/3/13928095/6050b88a8cd40108e8126f4b

Well, my first thought was the refs in that conference do not call fouls on 3
Point shots.  So the lad will have already been accustomed to physical CCIW play.

A little unorthodox shot.  Needs to work on not jumping forward on shot.  Sets his feet pretty well by squaring to basketball.  Quick release ulmost insane.  Realizing it is a highlight video, he will shoot from 'anywhere in th gym'. Does have potential to be dangerous

He gave me flashbacks of Duncan Robinson!   If he becomes even half the player DR was/is, the Titans have their next mega-star.   (And, while he could use some time in the weight-room, he's already WAY ahead of DR at that age.)

[Titan Q]

He gave me flashbacks of Duncan Robinson!   If he becomes even half the player DR was/is, the Titans have their next mega-star.   (And, while he could use some time in the weight-room, he's already WAY ahead of DR at that age.)

I don't think a 5-10 PG should give you flashbacks of a 6-8 G/F.

[Next Man Up]

IWU commit Nathan Valentine was named Captain of the 2021 Daily Herald Fox Valley All-Area Team.

https://basketball.dailyherald.com/sports/20210320/wait-worth-it-for-genevas-valentine?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

I was just looking at his year highlights video. Insane. Check out his 3 pt shots. I bet a third are from NBA range.

He looks like a really talented kid.

https://www.hudl.com/video/3/13928095/6050b88a8cd40108e8126f4b

Well, my first thought was the refs in that conference do not call fouls on 3
Point shots.  So the lad will have already been accustomed to physical CCIW play.

A little unorthodox shot.  Needs to work on not jumping forward on shot.  Sets his feet pretty well by squaring to basketball.  Quick release ulmost insane.  Realizing it is a highlight video, he will shoot from 'anywhere in th gym'. Does have potential to be dangerous

You've uncovered the problem!
He's squaring up to the basketball. If he ever learns to square up to the basket he might be pretty good. 🏀 😉