MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[joehakes]

In my Personnel Management Class at Western Illinois University ages ago, we talked about how to write job descriptions.  That phrase was always to be included. The duties are usually worked out with the candidate at the time of hiring.

The reason for doing that is to not make the job description so narrow that you may have a menu secondary duties for a coaching position.  Intramurals, game management, scheduling coordinator, etc.  may fit a certain candidate better than others.  The main job would be the coaching, but the secondary job could be somewhat flexible.

Agreed that this is a fixture on a majority of job descriptions (including mine).

[emeritusprof]

It may be standard procedure, but it's one I've not seen for any position I've taken.  Such broad ambiguity would make even the most outrageous assignment within the scope of the contract -- a continuous shield of protection for "management," or the school administration.

[Pistol Pete]

...and your point is?

Job descriptions are written by management, not labor, in most situations.  The very reasons you identify are the reasons for the inclusion of that language.

[Jim Matson]

Yeah Mark!  Go Twins!

That trade was mentioned during last night's game on ESPN.

[David Collinge]

I'll take Francisco Liriano, thank you.

Now that is the worst baseball* trade in my lifetime.  AJ Pierzynski and cash for Liriano, closer Joe Nathan, and Boof Bonser.  AJ spent one year in San Fran while Nathan has been to several All-Star contests since the trade.  Liriano, coupled with Johan Cytana, make the best 1-2 starting combo in baseball.  Boof Bonser is expected to become a major league starting pitcher.

*Herschel Walker, 'nuff said.

Another truly awful trade from our lifetimes sticks out in my memory, and again it was the Twins who performed the highway robbery.  Feb. 6, 1998, the Twins acquired Eric Milton, Cristian Guzman, Brian Buchanan, Danny Mota, and cash from the Yankees in exchange for the immortal Chuck Knoblauch.

Knoblauch contributed two Silver Sluggers, one Gold Glove, and one Rookie of the Year Award to the Twins, not to mention 15 hits, 7 walks, and 6 stolen bases in 12 playoff games in 1991.  He had 5 seasons where he hit .290+, and after his rookie season committed just 47 errors at 2B in 6 years, all of which saw him record a better-than-league-average fielding percentage.  He eclipsed that error total in less than 3 seasons in the Bronx, two of which saw him far below the league's fielding average.  A year later, he was in left field.  A year after that, he was in Kansas City.  A year after that, he was just a bad memory. 

After getting almost every last drop of productivity from Knoblauch, the Twins unloaded him in exchange for:
* 57 wins from Milton, who was then traded to the Phillies for Carlos Silva and Nick Punto; and
* 5 seasons of 140+ hits and decent if unspectacular fielding from Guzman, before he left for Washington and one of the worst offensive seasons by a regular in baseball history (143 total bases in 142 games, .219/.260/.314).

The Yankees got:
* Bubkes

The Phillies got:
* Bubkes

The Nationals got:
* Bubkes

It still brings a smile to my face, and believe me, I'm no Twins fan. 

[Titan Q]

The Mets made a terrible trade a couple years back at the deadline, sending minor leaguer Scott Kazmir to Tampa Bay for Victor Zambrano.  At the time it made absolutely no sense and now it looks just ridiculous.  The 2006 Mets may be just one stud starter away from being able to win a World Series...Pedro, Glavine, and Kazmir would be one heck of a playoff trio.

[Jim Matson]

I was reviewing the old Sears Cup standings for 2006 (it now has a new name which I can't ever remember).  Williams continues to load up wins in the "obscure" athletic events and takes the title yet again - 10th in 11 years.

The CCIW didn't do too well in this year's standings:

1. Williams - 920 pts
9. Calvin - 561 pts
12. Hope - 487 pts
23. Wheaton - 429 pts
38. North Central - 312 pts
41. U of C - 301 pts
42. Illinois Wesleyan - 297

Oh well.  We don't do too poorly in the majors.  Now read what I just wrote in the previous sentence - doesn't it look like there has to be a mis-spelled word in there somewhere?!

[Mr. Ypsi]

A trade from 1987 which doesn't quite fit the discussion (it achieved exactly what it was intended to), but which epitomizes the disaster the Tigers became for the last 12+ years: John Smoltz for Doyle Alexander.

Doyle Alexander went 9-0 for the Tigers the rest of the year and without him there is no way they would have made the playoffs (where they promptly laid an egg against the Twins).  But he only lasted 2 more years, going 20-27.

John Smoltz was still a minor leaguer, but joined the Braves in 1988, winning 181 games (and counting) since then.

While Smoltz could not have single-handedly prevented the down years, he is exhibit A of their attempt to maintain the glory of 1984 WAY past the prime of the team.  Right up to the onset of this millennium, they continually traded their best prospects for over-the-hill veterans.

It is not until this year that they finally have a proper blend of promising youngsters, mid-career players, and over-the-hill-but-not-dead-yets (who can set the tone in the clubhouse.  Result?  They already have several more wins than in all of 2003.

[emeritusprof]

As an old Cardinals fan, I remain delighted with but one super trade.

Lou Brock

[Knightstalker]

I'll take Francisco Liriano, thank you.

Now that is the worst baseball* trade in my lifetime.  AJ Pierzynski and cash for Liriano, closer Joe Nathan, and Boof Bonser.  AJ spent one year in San Fran while Nathan has been to several All-Star contests since the trade.  Liriano, coupled with Johan Cytana, make the best 1-2 starting combo in baseball.  Boof Bonser is expected to become a major league starting pitcher.

*Herschel Walker, 'nuff said.

In my experience the worst baseball trade ever was basically a one for one swap.  Jay Buhner for Steve Bye Bye Balboni.  Worst trade ever.

[Knightstalker]

I'll take Francisco Liriano, thank you.

Now that is the worst baseball* trade in my lifetime.  AJ Pierzynski and cash for Liriano, closer Joe Nathan, and Boof Bonser.  AJ spent one year in San Fran while Nathan has been to several All-Star contests since the trade.  Liriano, coupled with Johan Cytana, make the best 1-2 starting combo in baseball.  Boof Bonser is expected to become a major league starting pitcher.

*Herschel Walker, 'nuff said.

Another truly awful trade from our lifetimes sticks out in my memory, and again it was the Twins who performed the highway robbery.  Feb. 6, 1998, the Twins acquired Eric Milton, Cristian Guzman, Brian Buchanan, Danny Mota, and cash from the Yankees in exchange for the immortal Chuck Knoblauch.

Knoblauch contributed two Silver Sluggers, one Gold Glove, and one Rookie of the Year Award to the Twins, not to mention 15 hits, 7 walks, and 6 stolen bases in 12 playoff games in 1991.  He had 5 seasons where he hit .290+, and after his rookie season committed just 47 errors at 2B in 6 years, all of which saw him record a better-than-league-average fielding percentage.  He eclipsed that error total in less than 3 seasons in the Bronx, two of which saw him far below the league's fielding average.  A year later, he was in left field.  A year after that, he was in Kansas City.  A year after that, he was just a bad memory. 

After getting almost every last drop of productivity from Knoblauch, the Twins unloaded him in exchange for:
* 57 wins from Milton, who was then traded to the Phillies for Carlos Silva and Nick Punto; and
* 5 seasons of 140+ hits and decent if unspectacular fielding from Guzman, before he left for Washington and one of the worst offensive seasons by a regular in baseball history (143 total bases in 142 games, .219/.260/.314).

The Yankees got:
* Bubkes

The Phillies got:
* Bubkes

The Nationals got:
* Bubkes

It still brings a smile to my face, and believe me, I'm no Twins fan. 

Actually the Yankees won three more world series while the Twins went home and Knoblauch was a big offensive piece to that puzzle.  He can't help it the spirit of Steve Sax possesed him at second.

[Gregory Sager]

A trade from 1987 which doesn't quite fit the discussion (it achieved exactly what it was intended to), but which epitomizes the disaster the Tigers became for the last 12+ years: John Smoltz for Doyle Alexander.

A far better example of a stretch-run-veteran-for-raw-prospect deal that went sour for the contending team that picked up the veteran was the deal in late August of 1990 that sent minor league 1B Jeff Bagwell from Boston's AAA Pawucket farm team to Houston in exchange for veteran reliever Larry Andersen. The Tigers got genuine value out of Doyle Alexander (9-0, 1.53 ERA, 1.008 WHIP in 11 starts in '87), and they definitely needed him to edge out Toronto and win the AL East. But Andersen, although he pitched well for Boston down the stretch in '90, would only log a grand total of 22 innings for the Crimson Hose -- and not even as the closer (that was Jeff Reardon's job) or as the setup man (that was Rob Murphy). And then Andersen departed to San Diego in the off-season as a free agent. All Houston got out of the deal was a guy who became one of the best hitters of his generation.

The Cubs are a mess right now, in no small part because the team's braintrust doesn't have its act together. But at least Jim Hendry can point to a couple of very good salary-dump deals that he's made for the Cubs on his watch: Hee Seop Choi and Mike Nannini to Florida in exchange for Derrek Lee in the fall of '03; and a bag of peanuts and a hearty handshake (actually, Bobby Hill, Mark Bruback, and Jose "Senor Whiff" Hernandez) to Pittsburgh in exchange for Aramis Ramirez and Kenny Lofton earlier that summer.

Cubs fans have long bemoaned the infamous '64 deal with St. Louis that sent Lou Brock and two other players to the enemy in exchange for sore-armed starter Ernie Broglio and a couple of extra nobodies. However, the Cubs have made three deals since that more than made up for that, and it bugs me that Cubs fans continue to dwell upon the negative deal (surprise, surprise) while rarely acknowledging the positive deals.

* A couple of weeks into the 1966 season, the Cubs sent Bob Buhl and Larry Jackson, a couple of nondescript journeyman pitchers, to Philly in exchange for 1B John Herrnstein, OF Adolpho Phillips (who would go on to start in centerfield for the Cubs for three years), and a rookie reliever named Ferguson Jenkins.

* In January 1982 the Cubs and Phillies swapped their starting shortstops. The Cubs sent Ivan DeJesus to the Phillies (where both his fielding and base-stealing skills eroded rapidly), and the Phillies sent Larry Bowa (eight years older than DeJesus, and yet he'd last longer with the Cubs than DeJesus would last with the Phillies) to the Cubs. Oh, yeah, Philadelphia also threw in a rookie infielder in that deal ... some guy by the name of Ryne Sandberg.

* During spring training of 1992, the Cubs and White Sox made a crosstown trade. The Cubs sent George Bell to the South Side in exchange for Sammy Sosa and Ken Patterson. Patterson never amounted to much, but Bell had a mediocre year and then an awful year for the White Sox before he left baseball after the '93 season to return to the Dominican Republic and pump gas for a living. Sosa merely went on to hit 500+ homers as a Cub.

[Mr. Ypsi]

Greg,

Good point!  I had totally forgotten the latter three trades, but still scoff about Broglio-Brock!  At least I have the excuse of not being a Cubs fan in the first place.

There was a rumor floated recently by John Kruk on ESPN that the Tigers would (and should) trade rookie Zumaya for Smoltz.  Manager Jim Leyland certainly raised no doubting eyebrows when he said "We're not trading Joel Zumaya - period."

While there is no doubt plenty of competition for the honor, that may well be the single dumbest thing Kruk has ever broadcast.  You've got a rookie with a 102 mph fastball and a 2.29 ERA vs. an 18-year veteran with a losing record.  THIS year Zumaya is the better pitcher, nevermind 5 years from now when Smoltz will be long gone and Zumaya may well be a perennial all-star!

Perhaps Kruk thought the Tigers would want to 'bookend' their disaster period with trades involving Michigan-native Smoltz?!

[Pat Coleman]

Actually the Yankees won three more world series while the Twins went home and Knoblauch was a big offensive piece to that puzzle.  He can't help it the spirit of Steve Sax possesed him at second.

Chuck Knoblauch postseason stats
As a Twin: 12 games, .326 avg., .407 OBA, .391 slugging pct., 5 RBI, 7 BB, 6-for-7 SB
As a Yankee: 54 games, .242 avg., .323 OBA, .308 slugging, 4 RBI, 20 BB, 4-for-7 SB

Yeah ... big, big offensive piece. He may have helped the Yankees get there but he did not have an impact in October. In fact, his two best postseason series of the 12 he played with the Yankees were the sweeps of the Padres and Braves, series I dare say the Yankees may have figured out a way to win without him.

[Wydown Blvd.]

Also a big defensive piece before he forgot how to throw...