MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[diehardfan]

Thanks to Go Thunder for posting Wheaton score updates! It's nice not to have to wait till the info is posted on the Thunder hotline. K+ to your very small karma.

So it was nice to see Johnnie Standard get his minutes from earlier in the season again this Saturday. He obviously proved to be clutch in the Carthage game, and after Kent's comment that someone posted from the Kenosha area paper about the carthage game being a "hard game to get up for" or whatever.... I've had to try very hard to not be annoyed at that comment, since I know things like that are often minconstrued, and I've never personally seen Kent give anything but his all on the court. However, I must say it's nice to have the guys who play with heart, namely our team captains and Mr. Mohan as other focal points to the offense. At the d3 level, the game is so much about heart, and focus and determination, all of which Johnnie has in spades. Obviously I haven't been able to watch any of the conference CCIW games this year, but I've honestly been confused by the decisions to play him less in several of the crucial contests this conference season.

Anyhow, all that aside, it's great to see Wheaton tied at the #2 slot in the conference standings.  8)

[Jim Matson]

Nice win for Wheaton last night.

What's with this new term, "beat down."  Absolutely sophomoric term.  Instead of winning or defeating, let's all agree to start saying "beat down."  Yeah!

I feel like Dennis.

[tjcummingsfan]

Usee,

Yes, North Park should be embarrassed for the beginning of last night's game.  Going almost a quarter of the game without a field goal is just awful.  The second half was a completely different story, North Park then, clearly looked like the better team.  They played fantastic defense, often creating turnovers, and cutting a lead that was once over 20 to 8, multiple times.  Wheaton should be embarrassed that they let North Park get that close after they way they shot in the first half.  


My biggest frustration of the game last night was Kent Raymond.  It gets really old watching a "superstar" get all the calls, and get away with murder.  With that said, I thought for the most part the defenders guarding him all night, Antonio Stevens, and Uriah Rice mostly, did a pretty good job.  He was 6-13 shooting, and 2-6 from behind the arc.  He had 21 pts, but 7 of those came from freethrows (probably half of which he shouldn't have been on the line for).  

Had North Park hit even 1/3 of their shots in the first 10 minutes of the game they would have won this no problem.  

[usee]

Usee,

Yes, North Park should be embarrassed for the beginning of last night's game.  Going almost a quarter of the game without a field goal is just awful.  The second half was a completely different story, North Park then, clearly looked like the better team.  They played fantastic defense, often creating turnovers, and cutting a lead that was once over 20 to 8, multiple times.  Wheaton should be embarrassed that they let North Park get that close after they way they shot in the first half.  


My biggest frustration of the game last night was Kent Raymond.  It gets really old watching a "superstar" get all the calls, and get away with murder.  With that said, I thought for the most part the defenders guarding him all night, Antonio Stevens, and Uriah Rice mostly, did a pretty good job.  He was 6-13 shooting, and 2-6 from behind the arc.  He had 21 pts, but 7 of those came from freethrows (probably half of which he shouldn't have been on the line for).  

Had North Park hit even 1/3 of their shots in the first 10 minutes of the game they would have won this no problem.  

I have no idea what game you were watching but last I checked the game is 40 minutes long. Deciding to play for a third, a quarter , or half of that time gets you a record somewhere south of 500, which is where North Park is. Wheaton is certainly not embarrassed after easily winning a CCIW contest. North park gave up 46 points in the first half, wheaton shot over 50% from the field for the game, how is that fantastic defense?

Raymond missed 3 three pointers that were wide open. North Park should feel fortunate they didn't lose by 20 vs 12. The officials were not a factor and i certainly didn't think Raymond got any more or less calls than any other player. he just happened to go to the basket aggressively and that will always yield more whistles. He was called for two fouls and Standard for one that were pretty obvious clean blocks. I also thought NP got fouled underneath several times that weren't called. The officiating was not as bad as it has been but there were clearly missed calls both ways.

North Park has some serious talent but they do anything but play as a team. If Wheaton had that talent they would surely be national champions.

[tjcummingsfan]

North Park is sub .500 in the CCIW not overall, just wanted to make that clear.

Wheaton turned the ball over 18 times, 9 of those were steals by North Park , that indicates good defense on some level (North Park had just 11 turnovers). 

And of course you didn't think Raymond got special calls, he's on your side. 

North Park has some serious talent but they do anything but play as a team. If Wheaton had that talent they would surely be national champions.

What a rediculous statement. 

[usee]

North Park is sub .500 in the CCIW not overall, just wanted to make that clear.

That's what I meant, thanks for clarifying

Wheaton turned the ball over 18 times, 9 of those were steals by North Park , that indicates good defense on some level (North Park had just 11 turnovers). 

I agree. They played good defense on at least 9 possessions. 

And of course you didn't think Raymond got special calls, he's on your side. 

My comments were fairly objective. I think that's pretty clear

North Park has some serious talent but they do anything but play as a team. If Wheaton had that talent they would surely be national champions.

What a rediculous statement. 

Exaggerated a bit, maybe, but my point is clear.

BTW, spell check on aisle 4

[tjcummingsfan]

What do you think makes it clear your comments were "fairly objective, " because you think so?  I think I'm being pretty objective too...

Exaggerated alot... although I appreciate the acknowledgement of the talent.  Keep in mind that 4 of the players who started are new this year to North Park (2 are freshman) along with Nick Williams.  Jason Gordon hasn't quite been what we expected, and Keith Willert was hurt, and had been playing JV most of this year.  So there are alot of things being thrown in to the mix almost nightly.  Now, with that said, we should be able to expect some sort of team play this late in the season that, you're right, wasn't very apparent last night. 

[usee]

What do you think makes it clear your comments were "fairly objective, " because you think so?  I think I'm being pretty objective too...

well, you never offered any instances to support your claim. I offered scenarios for both teams. that, by definition, is objective. it's not secret I cheer for Wheaton but I can certainly recognize bad officiating. Everyone on here has seen it all season. to say the officials we have seen have enough court awareness to give calls to one player is giving far too much credit.

[tjcummingsfan]

There was the time when Uriah Rice moved out of the way, and Kent traveled to miss his lay-up, but luckily got a foul called so he scored anyway...  There was the time when he (wait, times) he lowered his head and shoulder to drive, clearly out of control, but drew blocking calls.  There was the time he was trying to break the press and clearly stepped (half his right foot) on the line.  That's off the top of my head, I'm sure I could think of more.  A "star" player is going to get calls, period, and he did, it's just frustrating when it was so blatant at times. 

[robberki]

If Wheaton had that talent they would surely be national champions.

This is my favorite quote ever for soooo many reasons...

[diehardfan]

If Wheaton had that talent they would surely be national champions.

This is my favorite quote ever for soooo many reasons...

I thought it was pretty funny too... I just wonder if he was being intentionally ironic with his overstatement. 

[usee]

There was the time when Uriah Rice moved out of the way, and Kent traveled to miss his lay-up, but luckily got a foul called so he scored anyway...  There was the time when he (wait, times) he lowered his head and shoulder to drive, clearly out of control, but drew blocking calls.  There was the time he was trying to break the press and clearly stepped (half his right foot) on the line.  That's off the top of my head, I'm sure I could think of more.  A "star" player is going to get calls, period, and he did, it's just frustrating when it was so blatant at times. 

or the time when Raymond came from the weakside and clearly stuffed williams' layup and was called for a foul (standard did the same thing and was whistled), or the time Kent went into the lane, had his arms stripped by two different NPU players with no call? I too can think of many others. I recognize you may think kent was out of control. most of the rest of the CCIW calls that speed. 

it was pretty even both ways as far as I could tell.

[79jaybird]

"If  Wheaton had that talent they would surely be National Champions"
Whoa!  Where did this one come from?  Do you know how hard it is to win a National Championship?
I think Wheaton has just as much talent as Augie and Elmhurst, but let's see the Thunder make the CCIW Tournament-NCAA Tournament bid first, BEFORE stating they are Nat'l Championship material.

[usee]

"If  Wheaton had that talent they would surely be National Champions"
Whoa!  Where did this one come from?  Do you know how hard it is to win a National Championship?
I think Wheaton has just as much talent as Augie and Elmhurst, but let's see the Thunder make the CCIW Tournament-NCAA Tournament bid first, BEFORE stating they are Nat'l Championship material.

Jaybird,

You obviously misread my post.

[Dennis_Prikkel]

I've seen Wheaton play four times this year: they have an outstanding all-CCIW performer in Raymond, a tough as nails guard in Mohan and a good role player and occasional scorer in Standard.  To their coach's credit he is able to get the other players and hence, the team, to over-achieve on most nights.  Bill Harris is simply, right now the best coach in the league.

No way is Wheaton's overall team talent as good as Elmhurst, Augustana, North central or Carthage.

Where several other more-talented teams in this league often play like for long stretches like they would rather be in the student union with their friends, Wheaton usually plays hard for forty minutes.  The result is that Wheaton is challenging to be in the conference tournament while at least four other schools will be ending their season in a couple of weeks.

And put Wheaton up against teams that aren't well coached at all and whose players aren't physically or mentally ready to play against their agressive style of play - then presto you are down 21-1 before your coach realizes that what he's trying to do maybe hasn't worked against Wheaton for three years.

MW 70:3