MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[AndOne]

As I have said before regarding AO---Why let the facts get in the way of a negative opinion---I'm with TQ---He's a lot closer to the program than most

Soooo, if that is the case, how can AndOne's comment about Rose being third choice be SILLY?

It could be true. He could have heard "stuff" the same as you. His thoughts are no less or no more viable maybe than yours.

Lots of people pay attention to what goes on in the CCIW. Coaches and asst coaches and people talk to each other. Some know who applied and what was said to them. Some don't.

Here is what AndOne said:

"...was anyone else surprised he got the job after the obvious first two choices turned it down or withdrew from consideration?"

It was silly because he has absolutely no idea who the lead candidates were going into that process but talks about "obvious first two choices." 

The name batted around in IWU circles (just fans speculating) more than any other by a big margin the last few years in the discussion of who would replace Scott Trost if he left was Ron Rose.   The thought was that there would be a strong desire to hire an Illinois Wesleyan alum.  But just as I cannot in good faith post here that I'm sure that Ron was the first choice going in last April (because I have no idea), I'd hope AndOne would use similar discretion -- or at least make it clear that he's posting rumors.  His suggestion that some group of financially influential IWU alums is affecting athletic department hiring decisions is so comical that it leads me to believe his sources on everything IWU are, well, not so good.

Late-----

Its been a couple of months, since you made the above comment  "As I have said before regarding AO---Why let the facts get in the way of a negative opinion."

Your comment was made in response to my comments that 1) EC's Nick Michael sometimes plays "soft" and would have more of a tendency to back down compared with one of his teammates, and 2) Augie's Pat Brusveen is somewhat of a ballhog/gunner. Note I never said either isn't a good player. I just felt both could be even better. I let the comment go at the time because I didn't want to give further facts or any other negative reflection to the young men beyond the obvious implication that Michael would be even better if he played a little tougher and Brusveen would be if he distributed the ball a little more instead of shooting so much.

The facts supporting these two contentions are out there but, in light of what I said above about why I didn't comment further at the time, I suggest you just find them rather than spout off because you don't like me or my opinions. I'll give you a clue---I'm not the only one on here who shared the same opinion/observbation re at least one of the two players.  Either do a little research or just let this one go...... 

[ecdubb420]

as a strong supporter of my alma maters (York and EC), whatever the process that brought Rose to IWU, I must say that was a very good decision.  I hope to not be eating these words in 5 years when IWU is running all over EC.
AndOne, couldn't have said it better about michael.  He is a good player who would be great if he would just commit to playing on the block and use that strength that we know he has.

[79jaybird]

Nick Michael has been a great Senior Leader for the Bluejays and teams up well with Ruch and Hintzsche inside.  HOWEVER, I do feel that Nick could benefit from being a little more physical.  Sometimes he gets that "passive" approach, which often doesn't get the outcomes he's looking for.  Still, I am glad he is in a Bluejay uniform because him and Ruch are a great 1,2 inside.

[AndOne]

ECDUBB------

As an Elmhurst authority-----thank you for confirming my thoughts on Michael

Additionally, I happen to agree with you about Coach Rose.

For those of you who can't read------LOOK again at my post. Right in the first paragraph it states "I have no doubt he can coach."
I said I was surprised he got the job over Coach Baines (who I believe was one of the 4 people who IWU interviewed from all the applicants).

[AndOne]

79jaybird----

Exactly!
Exactly the point I was trying to make to Late Nite!

Come on guys---------the slightest form of negative comment on here brings such an avalanche of criticizm. We ALL have opinions. Unless we use the word "garbage" or  something on that order that everyone would condem, lets just DISCUSS why we don't share the same opinion.

Another thought---sometimes someone can know something that you don't. However, the person with the knowledge may not seem to fully support his statement/position because he knows that the source of his info doesn't really want his name brought up to be bantered all over some portion of the Internet.
This is from an insurance investigator who would never have gotten all the info I did if sources were woried that their names would become public.

[79jaybird]

AndOne, we seem to agree that Michael could put link that extra--ordinary into extraordinary if he could get a little "tougher" and ditch the passive approach.  I have noticed Nick getting a little more physical that last 2 games, but there is room for more.  Ruch makes of for that too, as I think Ruch is everything you want in an inside player.

[Dennis_Prikkel]

I'm just curious Dennis is it something personal you have against Paul?

Augustana   0-6
Carthage      0-5
Elmhurst       0-5
Ill. Wesleyan  1-4
Millikin            4-2
N.Central       1-4
Wheaton        0-6

Scores vs Wheaton

2004-05
lost 99-80 at home
lost 97-78 at WC

2005-06
lost 68-53 at home
lost 73-52 at WC (down like 15-2 in the first 8 minutes)

2006-07
lost 73-60 at home
lost 85-73 at WC (down 21-1 in the first 10 minutes)

Now its obvious from these scores and having seen North Park play against Wheaton that the present coaching staff is lacking something when they play Wheaton (and not just victories).

It takes more than just a nice suit and five assistants to make a good basketball coach and a good basketball team.  Something is lacking.

It's time for a change.

There was a time when North Park would bring a thousand fans out to Wheaton - how many showed up last Saturday night?

In the great blizzard of '79 North Park students traveled to Wheaton for the game and didn't make it back to campus until Tuesday morning.

Dan McCarrell is happily retired in Mankato, Minnesota.

Bosko Djurickovic is an outstanding coach at Carthage.

Is the current coaching staff the best North Park can do?
Is the school really satisfied?
In your heart of hearts (and not just somebody's golfing buddy), do you really think that this coaching staff can someday blossom with knowledge, competence, competitiveness, desire and elan against the entire CCIW?

It's time for a change.

MW 70:3

[AndOne]

AndOne, we seem to agree that Michael could put link that extra--ordinary into extraordinary if he could get a little "tougher" and ditch the passive approach.  I have noticed Nick getting a little more physical that last 2 games, but there is room for more.  Ruch makes of for that too, as I think Ruch is everything you want in an inside player.

jaybird-------I concur 100% with every sentence, phrase, and word of your post.   

[Dennis_Prikkel]

I agree with tjcummingsfan assessment that Raymond gets a lot of calls - but I don't think it's because he's a star.

I think you give CCIW basketball officials too much credit if you really believe they know who the stars are in the league.

I think Raymond gets a lot of calls going to the basket and the officials miss a lot of calls on defensive players when Raymond is going to the basket, because he is agressive.

Unless you're playing back in the sixties and seventies when Bob Brodbeck called a charge on any agressive visiting player anywhere on the court at Fred Young Fieldhouse, in this day and age its always easier for the ref to call a block. 

I remember one game at Fred Young in the opening round of the NCAA tournament in 1986 where the refs called UW-Whitewater four times for offensive fouls by their guards using the ball to push off their IWU defenders thirty feet from the basket.

Raymond does put his shoulder down - a lot - so does Mohan - so does Lee of Elmhurst.  Often times both the offensive player, the defensive player trying to stay in front of them and the referree are all "out-of-control" physically by the time all three meet under the basket and one thing I learned in reffing hundreds of basketball games - the tie always goes to the referee and the easiest thing to call is a block, rather than a charge.

Sorry - tj - you're right - but there's absolutely nothing that can be done other than planting a defender full-time under the basket and that's just not good basketball.

The best way to beat that tactic is to score on the other end so Wheaton has to take the ball out of bounds.

MW 70:3

[AndOne]

Excellent point tuvwxyz------------->  + 1 for you.

Speaking of Coach Rose. I have no doubt he can coach, but was anyone else surprised he got the job after the obvious first two choices turned it down or withdrew from consideration?

I thought EC Asst Coach Baines would be the best choice at that point. He, naturally,  has experience coaching at the DIII level where Coach Rose did not. More specifically, he was/is familiar specifically with the CCIW. Additionally, he had experience recruiting which is perhaps just as important as coaching ability. As tuvwxyz pointed out, Coach Rose also lacked this experience. As I have heard from several sources, Coach Baines is even seen out recruiting more than EC Head Coach Scherer. Lastly, Coach Baines is IWU "family" having played for the Titans where he was a member of their 1997 championship team. The opinion, and prob even moreso the $ of the local alums must have carried more weight in Dennie Bridges' decision.

After Coach Baines, I though Elmhurst York HS Coach Al Biancalana, who had DI experience at Bradley would have been an excellent candidate. 

AndOne, for you or anyone else not part of the committee that conducted the search and interview processes for IWU's head coaching vacancy to suggest that Ron Rose was the third choice is silly.  You have no idea how the process played out.  There are people really, really close to IWU men's basketball that have no idea how that process played out.  I'm glad you and your North Central circle has all the gossip and has it all figured out, but when you are just throwing rumors out there it is unfortunate.

The money of local alums??  That is laughable.  IWU is a place where all financial donations have to go through the school's general fund.  When an alum like myself wants to give his annual contribution to IWU and says, "I'd like to give this to men's basketball" or athletics in general, they are told that is not possible.  They are steered to the general fund and told that as that grows, the Athletic department eventually grows, and as the Athletic department budget grows, men's basketball will get a few more bucks.  That is what's funniest to me about your assertion that there is some wealthy group of IWU alums that has influence over athletic department decisions -- there are several alums like me who would really love to donate directly to men's basketball (or football or baskeball, etc) because that is where our passion in and strongest connection with the university is, but are told that is not possible.  Believe me when I tell you that the IWU people who read this board will have a real laugh at that statement.

Finally, you do realize that Ron Rose is a Wesleyan alum, right?  You mention that Baines is "family", but not Rose (Class of 1988).

IWU hired a good coach who will recruit good players and build a winner.  You know, unfortunately I remember 5 seasons ago having to make about the same exact statement when IWU had a first-year head man who was really struggling (6-8 CCIW/12-12 overall with way more talent than Ron Rose has this year).  In five years, Scott Trost recruited 3 All-Americans, won 3 CCIW titles, and got IWU to Salem.  Gosh, can we avoid suggesting that Ron Rose was not the right choice until he at least has a chance to recruit even 1 or 2 years?   

Titan Q----

Please read ALL of my statement. I don't think you can have the impression I was dissing Coach Rose when one of my opening statements was "I have no doubt he can coach."
And yes, of course I know he is a Wesleyan alum. I can't believe you asked that ?

Also, I may not be an IWU alum and have all the inside knowledge about IWU that you do, but I am in a position to hear certain things that perhaps even an insider like you is NOT ALWAYS privy to. I assure you I am not in the habit of just throwing something out there to stir up controversy.

I did know something about the lead candidates.

Whether or not it had anything to do with Coach Rose being hired,  I also know that in this day and age money talks. You are a bright and knowedgeable guy. I cannot believe you are so naive as to believe the the most wealthy alums who are the contributors most closly affiliated with the athletic program do not have a strong voice concerning major decisions within that area. They may not be the final deciding factor, but bet on the fact they have a very strong influence.   

Other news that might interest you---I inquired, and according to what is broadcast as IWU policy, it appears you CAN designate your contribution to go toward the athletic dept. I would be glad to point out where you can find said policy should your research not reveal that point of information.    

[tjcummingsfan]

Now its obvious from these scores and having seen North Park play against Wheaton that the present coaching staff is lacking something when they play Wheaton (and not just victories).


There was a time when North Park would bring a thousand fans out to Wheaton - how many showed up last Saturday night?


In your heart of hearts (and not just somebody's golfing buddy), do you really think that this coaching staff can someday blossom with knowledge, competence, competitiveness, desire and elan against the entire CCIW?

Bit by bit here...

-  For the last two years a big part of whats been lacking is talent.  Rees left Paul basically nothing.  The fact that Paul has the players he does is a huge testament to his recruiting ability.  

- I don't know Dennis, I didn't count.  You weren't there, so I don't think you have any right to complain about the number of fans that showed up for a North Park game.  When you start supporting the school you say you do then you can talk about the good old days.  

- I think Paul deserves a chance to get the guys he recruited playing more than a year or two before you run him of campus.  He's done a heck of a job getting the players he has, and has a team that plays significantly more disciplined ball than the teams of the last couple years.  If nothing else the team is fun to watch again, they're competitive, and the crowds this year are way better than the past couple, so I'm pretty happy in the direction the team is going.  

[AndOne]

As an outside observer, its clear to me that NPU is a MUCH better team than they have been for at least the last 2 years.

If that is not primarily due to the dedication and ability of the coaching staff, then who should we give the credit to? The current NPU roster didn't arrive as gifts from Santa!   

[79jaybird]

The North Park team that almost beat Elmhurst at home earlier this year was the best Vikings team I have seen in a good 2-3 years.  Why all the hoopla about NPU?  Give or take a couple of plays and the Park could have 2-3 more wins than they already have.  I guess I just don't understand why you guys are taking the whjips to Ron Rose and Paul Brenaghan.  Remember, in the end, the players have to make the plays and execute.
You could have the best coach, but if the players don't make their plays, then what do you have?

[REDMENFAN]

Been away for a few days, just want to add a few quotes from the article in the newspaper from the Carthage/Augie game.
-"It feels really good, Hood said. To finally get them, especially the last time...hopefully we'll get another shot at them in the conference tournament." -referring to himself and Thompson being the only 4 year seniors and beating Augie for their first time.
-"After the game at their place, I should have just kicked myself in the butt, Djurickovic said. I really didn't do a very good job. We weren't prepared to play."
-"I think what we needed to do was change how we played them because the last three years it's been their system being better than our system. They just flat out overpower you on both ends of the floor with size and physical play. We elimintated the half of it by zoning them. Zones are only as good as the other team shoots. Tonight, they didn't make some shots that they ordinarlily would.  We took away their physical play on the offensive end.  That kept us out of foul trouble, kept the game moving and gave us an opportunity."

The article also praised Luke Majewski, a junior who has played jv the last 2 years and played only 19 minutes before Saturday. Bosko praised his work ethic and what he does for the team. Hood and Thompson were also mentioned a lot being the only 2 seniors. 

[Scream]

Is the current coaching staff the best North Park can do?
Is the school really satisfied?
In your heart of hearts (and not just somebody's golfing buddy), do you really think that this coaching staff can someday blossom with knowledge, competence, competitiveness, desire and elan against the entire CCIW?

It's time for a change.

MW 70:3

Dennis, I don't think you have any idea that the actual numbers show your error.

Records over the last three seasons:
2004-2005  4-21 (0-14)
2005-2006  4-21 (2-12)
2006-2007 so far 12-9 (4-6)

If the team stopped playing today, they would have already increased their wins by 200%  The team is improving and not just in non-conference battles. 

Sometimes, numbers speak for themselves...