MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[Gregory Sager]

I'd pick Wessels over Swetalla, too. I'm just saying that I won't be surprised if the coaches go the other route and pick Swetalla.

I'll give the coaches a little more credit---Any coach who has been paying attention would NEVER make that choice---There are a lot of players in the league better than Swetalla

I don't know how long you've followed this league, but you'd be quite surprised at some of the All-CCIW choices that the coaches have made over the years.

[advoice]

Regarding Raymond playing his last year of eligibility, there is another option that has not been mentioned...transferring to another institution to begin grad school - and play his final year. This is perfectly legal by NCAA standards. I'm not suggesting he make a "basketball" decision to play elsewhere. I'm suggesting it be an academic decision. I know nothing about Wheaton's grad school programs but if they do not have the program he is interested in and another school does...

The only limitation on the school would be it could not be another CCIW school. Any other D3 would be an option, D2 would be an option. D1 would have been an option until the last January NCAA convention. This type of transfer was allowed and the SA was able to compete immediately. At the last convention the        administrators changed it. Imagine if Kent would have decided to attend Northwestern for Grad school and also played his final year of eligibility there.

[Late nite]

Raymond, Raymond, Raymond---Everybody loves Raymond---Great player---But--- Wessels outplayed him both times they met this year---Hands down---No player in the league is more valuable for their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels---The only player that comes close to doing that is Walton

[theseguysaregood]

Raymond, Raymond, Raymond---Everybody loves Raymond---Great player---But--- Wessels outplayed him both times they met this year---Hands down---No player in the league is more valuable for their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels---The only player that comes close to doing that is Walton

"No player in the league is more valuable to their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels"

If you take that quote literally, I disagree completely on both Wessels and Walton.  Take each one of the three off their teams and Wheaton makes the biggest fall...by far!!!

[BRLHSFAN]

Could be as much as 15 inches by the time this storm gets through central Illinois is what they said this morning.  Bad part is the wind gusts are supposed to be up to 45 mph and we're under blizzard warnings.  Glad I work in town, but even then going to work this morning at 6 a.m. my town roads were drifted and it's even looking like white out conditions in town!!!  I hate snow so April you can have it!!!

[Late nite]

Value was the wrong word---I should have said, "No player PLAYS BOTH ENDS of the floor better than Wessels"---All three players are valuable to their teams---I disagree with Wheaton making the biggest fall if they were to lose Raymond---Their system and nation-wide recruiting base will always be strong---They were competitive last year, in a rebuilding year, without Raymond---IMHO, the depth of Augie and Wheaton would be able to handle the loss of Wessels (Delp moving to the 1 spot) or Raymond (Mohan) better than the loss of Walton (Drennan down, who's next?) for NCC---So, thanks for steering me in the right direction after my initial commentquote author=theseguysaregood link=topic=4592.msg675146#msg675146 date=1171377208]

Raymond, Raymond, Raymond---Everybody loves Raymond---Great player---But--- Wessels outplayed him both times they met this year---Hands down---No player in the league is more valuable for their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels---The only player that comes close to doing that is Walton

"No player in the league is more valuable to their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels"

If you take that quote literally, I disagree completely on both Wessels and Walton.  Take each one of the three off their teams and Wheaton makes the biggest fall...by far!!!


[/quote]

[79jaybird]

The new rankings are out
Augustana #9
Elmhurst #12
Wheaton #25
Women-  IWU #19
and if I was to take a gamble, I think 2 possibly 3 of these teams will be in the big dance.
Yes upstate New York and northward into Canada has 100 inches of snow and is just handcuffed by the white flakes.  The Syracuse--Ithaca--Green/White Mtns. in VT, NH,  are picturesque areas and usually get hit hard with snow each winter.  This is odd though to have THAT much snow.
Looking at the Elmhurst/North Central game,  this is an intriguing matchup.  Elmhurst really put away the Cardinals with many easy baskets in the paint.  Walton was basically a 1 man arsenal and was making some big shots to keep the Cardinals in shouting distance.
I think things are going to be a little different in Naperville.  I still think Elmhurst will dominate in the paint, but I think the Jays are going to be facing a "desperate" Cardinals team that will be playing with 110% intensity.  As somebody mentioned earlier, NC is close to falling out of the CCIW Tourney picture, and needs to win their last 2 games.  Having home court always helps too.

[theseguysaregood]

Value was the wrong word---I should have said, "No player PLAYS BOTH ENDS of the floor better than Wessels"---All three players are valuable to their teams---I disagree with Wheaton making the biggest fall if they were to lose Raymond---Their system and nation-wide recruiting base will always be strong---They were competitive last year, in a rebuilding year, without Raymond---IMHO, the depth of Augie and Wheaton would be able to handle the loss of Wessels (Delp moving to the 1 spot) or Raymond (Mohan) better than the loss of Walton (Drennan down, who's next?) for NCC---So, thanks for steering me in the right direction after my initial commentquote author=theseguysaregood link=topic=4592.msg675146#msg675146 date=1171377208]

Raymond, Raymond, Raymond---Everybody loves Raymond---Great player---But--- Wessels outplayed him both times they met this year---Hands down---No player in the league is more valuable for their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels---The only player that comes close to doing that is Walton

"No player in the league is more valuable to their team on BOTH ENDS of the floor than Wessels"

If you take that quote literally, I disagree completely on both Wessels and Walton.  Take each one of the three off their teams and Wheaton makes the biggest fall...by far!!!

[/quote]I still think Wheaton falls more, but I do agree with your main point...Wessels is the biggest impact player at both ends and it is because of that and the intangibles he brings that he gets mentioned with the others for MOP (although I don't think he is in the top three)

[theseguysaregood]

The new rankings are out
Augustana #9
Elmhurst #12
Wheaton #25
Women-  IWU #19
and if I was to take a gamble, I think 2 possibly 3 of these teams will be in the big dance.
Yes upstate New York and northward into Canada has 100 inches of snow and is just handcuffed by the white flakes.  The Syracuse--Ithaca--Green/White Mtns. in VT, NH,  are picturesque areas and usually get hit hard with snow each winter.  This is odd though to have THAT much snow.
Looking at the Elmhurst/North Central game,  this is an intriguing matchup.  Elmhurst really put away the Cardinals with many easy baskets in the paint.  Walton was basically a 1 man arsenal and was making some big shots to keep the Cardinals in shouting distance.
I think things are going to be a little different in Naperville.  I still think Elmhurst will dominate in the paint, but I think the Jays are going to be facing a "desperate" Cardinals team that will be playing with 110% intensity.  As somebody mentioned earlier, NC is close to falling out of the CCIW Tourney picture, and needs to win their last 2 games.  Having home court always helps too.

It will be interesting to see how it plays out, but I think this is a case of matchup problems for NC.  Their front court is by far their strength and Elmhurst is the one team in the league that has the size and depth to offset that.  So if you assume that is a wash, it comes down to backcourt play and that is where it is "no contest" (on paper at least).

Getting Elmhurst's bigs in early foul trouble seems to be the best chance for NC, especially with Drennan being out hurting their depth.

[petemcb]

Regarding Raymond playing his last year of eligibility, there is another option that has not been mentioned...transferring to another institution to begin grad school - and play his final year. This is perfectly legal by NCAA standards. I'm not suggesting he make a "basketball" decision to play elsewhere. I'm suggesting it be an academic decision. I know nothing about Wheaton's grad school programs but if they do not have the program he is interested in and another school does...

The only limitation on the school would be it could not be another CCIW school. Any other D3 would be an option, D2 would be an option. D1 would have been an option until the last January NCAA convention. This type of transfer was allowed and the SA was able to compete immediately. At the last convention the        administrators changed it. Imagine if Kent would have decided to attend Northwestern for Grad school and also played his final year of eligibility there.

Maybe that could happen anyways.  Raymond could continue his pattern of one year on, one year off, graduate from Wheaton in 4, use up 2, move to Northwestern, sit out a year, play a year, sit out another, and play another.  He'd probably have his Doctorate by then.  Sound crazy?  Think Evan Eschmayer.

[Ryan Scott (Hoops Fan)]

Think Evan Eschmayer.

Didn't he get a record three (3) medical redshirts during his college experience?

[Pat Coleman]

Regarding Raymond playing his last year of eligibility, there is another option that has not been mentioned...transferring to another institution to begin grad school - and play his final year. This is perfectly legal by NCAA standards. I'm not suggesting he make a "basketball" decision to play elsewhere. I'm suggesting it be an academic decision. I know nothing about Wheaton's grad school programs but if they do not have the program he is interested in and another school does...

The only limitation on the school would be it could not be another CCIW school. Any other D3 would be an option, D2 would be an option. D1 would have been an option until the last January NCAA convention. This type of transfer was allowed and the SA was able to compete immediately. At the last convention the        administrators changed it. Imagine if Kent would have decided to attend Northwestern for Grad school and also played his final year of eligibility there.

That rule may not be in place by the time he gets there.

And I'm not sure you're correct -- last I heard in Division III you only have graduate eligibility at the school where you got your undergrad degree. I am not sure the rule under which Vandy got its starting quarterback has the same impact here.

[b_holmgren]

Q - I'm surprised you haven't thrown this stat out yet:
Raymond is now 31/31 from the free throw line in his Shirk Center career. Must be something about that green backdrop.

Wichita State sure could use him.

Ahh!!! It's Brian! Brian, You are very much missed! Seriously, you need to give the current Wheaton broadcasters some pointers.... PLEASE!!!! All Wheaton alum everywhere beg you to give the ole WETN a call and or a tutorial...

On a lighter note.... How is your broadcasting career going?

It's still going - though not in the direction I would have guessed back in the WETN radio days. I'm in TV anchoring and reporting sports down in Wichita, KS. So far so good, though I still have a lot to learn.

I'll be around for CCIW tournament weekend, though from the looks of things it will be over in Augustana. Looks like I'll at least be able to catch some of the women's tourney I figure I have to come back and visit from time to time while I still actually know people.

[79jaybird]

These guys are good-- I think you hit it on the head with mentioning Drennan out with an injury.  I thought Drennan played real well at Elmhurst and was able to feed Walton some open looks.  Elmhurst big guys were pretty dominant in that game at Elmhurst, and I just don't see NC being able to handle the trio of Michael, Ruch, and Hintzsche.
All this talk about Raymond, well the game between Elmhurst/Wheaton I thought was decided by the play of Wiele and Fiddler, especially Wiele.    Wiele and Fiddler are a nice combination and handle the ball well.  I guess I feel that Raymond is getting "too much" of the spotlight, when there are other good players on the Thunder team.

[ecdubb420]

i have always "loved" all the talk about how bad a team would be without that player.  the problem with all that talk is that we rarely get to find out how bad (or good) they all become.  Always seemed like a pointless discussion to me.  Oh well,  i guess people have to talk about something besided the games at hand. 
As for EC-NCC, i'm getting ready to buckle up for a great game as three of the last four games at the fieldhouse have gone to OT, and the other was a wild 107-100 loss. 
Lets just hope that this is the last time I ever get to see Simmons in a uniform as his attitude is always good for at least one, "this type of player is what gives basketball a bad name" rant that I seem to make everytime calling one of his games.
I know he's been battling an injury all season, but I'm amazed more attention hasn't been made to this player who in the eyes of most people was a no-brainer 1st team All-CCIW performer (and preseason 2nd team All America).  I enjoy his poor performances for several reasons.  1) It shows that he is a headcase who was never albe to live up to his potential 2) will likely prove to Raridon never to recruit a player with that attitude 3) has let everyone in the conference know that Dan Walton is clearly the best player on that team.

Then again, I hope that Simmons drops 35 on Augie this Saturday and gives the EC faithful a chance to root the Bluejays towards a CCIW crown.