MBB: College Conference of Illinois and Wisconsin

[cardinalpride]

but I know NCC was led in scoring by Chris Drennan with 32.

Wow Mr. Drennan really stepped up in the scrimmage.  Did the maroons preseason all american play?  I believe his name is Nate H. (can't pronounce his last name)  Thanks for the report Andone!

Nate Hainje (HANE-jee). Yes, he played and was Chicago's leading scorer. It's hard to miss him; he's sporting a fauxhawk this season and was his usual eccentric and self-aggrandizing self on the court.

AO, looks like we were simulposting!

Well that's an even better sign for the cardinal and white!!:)
Thanks again Greg and Andone!!!

[Gregory Sager]

Since AO mentioned this twice in his post, I should add that the 34 points Chicago received in the new d3hoops.com Top 25 are a clear illustration of how the pollsters are forced to fly blind in the preseason poll. Chicago's got some good ballplayers, Hainje and Pancratz in particular, and Mike McGrath's established a solid track record in coaching editions of the Maroons that are based upon big front lines (Reich/Henderson/Poyer from the early '00s) ... but the Maroons lost a pair of multi-season All-UAA guards to graduation in Brandon Woodhead (15.5 ppg in '06-'07) and Jesse Meyer (12.3 ppg in '06-'07), one of whom was a four-year starter and the other a three-year starter, as well as their third starting guard, Drew Adams. Both Adams and fellow departing senior Jason Vismantas joined Woodhead and Meyer on the All-UAA team last season.

Given those losses, I can't for the life of me figure out why pollsters were giving any preseason love to the Maroons. Chicago is in the midst of a pretty radical switch from being a team with three starting guards and a propensity to go bombs away from beyond the arc on every possession to a team based upon lots of interior size that will be looking to pound the ball down low every play. They look to me like a team that'll be slotted in the middle of the pack in the UAA preseason poll (if the UAA has one; I'm not sure that they do). I know what the 35th-best team in the nation is supposed to look like, and the Maroons are definitely not the nation's 35th-best team coming into the season, preseason poll or not.

[cardinalpride]

Since AO mentioned this twice in his post, I should add that the 34 points Chicago received in the new d3hoops.com Top 25 are a clear illustration of how the pollsters are forced to fly blind in the preseason poll. Chicago's got some good ballplayers, Hainje and Pancratz in particular, and Mike McGrath's established a solid track record in coaching editions of the Maroons that are based upon big front lines (Reich/Henderson/Poyer from the early '00s) ... but the Maroons lost a pair of multi-season All-UAA guards to graduation in Brandon Woodhead (15.5 ppg in '06-'07) and Jesse Meyer (12.3 ppg in '06-'07), one of whom was a four-year starter and the other a three-year starter, as well as their third starting guard, Drew Adams. Both Adams and fellow departing senior Jason Vismantas joined Woodhead and Meyer on the All-UAA team last season.

Given those losses, I can't for the life of me figure out why pollsters were giving any preseason love to the Maroons. Chicago is in the midst of a pretty radical switch from being a team with three starting guards and a propensity to go bombs away from beyond the arc on every possession to a team based upon lots of interior size that will be looking to pound the ball into the post every play. They look to me like a team that'll be slotted in the middle of the pack in the UAA preseason poll (if the UAA has one; I'm not sure if they do). I know what the 35th-best team in the nation is supposed to look like, and the Maroons are definitely not the nation's 35th-best team coming into the season, preseason poll or not.

Greg, you sure know how to kill a man's optimism!!!:)
(modified by GS for formatting)

[Gregory Sager]

No need to lose your optimism, CP. Given the conditions under which NCC had to play this evening -- no Rogers, only two weeks of practice, and a wagonload of players being thrust into prominent roles for the first time -- the Cardinals looked very good.

The fact that NCC's opponent this evening really isn't as good at this point as the preseason poll is making it out to be shouldn't detract from that.

[cardinalpride]

No need to lose your optimism, CP. Given the conditions under which NCC had to play this evening -- no Rogers, only two weeks of practice, and a wagonload of players being thrust into prominent roles for the first time -- the Cardinals looked very good.

The fact that NCC's opponent this evening really isn't as good at this point as the preseason poll is making it out to be shouldn't detract from that.

You break me down only to build me back up again!  Any idea how long Rodgers will be out?  Andone?...

[AndOne]

http://www.d3hoops.com/top25/

Augie #5

Elmhurst #18

"Receiving votes" - Wheaton, Carthage

Strikes me as very interesting that although Carthage "received votes" in the D3Hoops poll, the coaches vote ranked North Park slightly ahead of the Redmen. Excuse me Red Men.

While we're on the subject--------------------------. And I know the Wheaton supporters will disagree which is fine, IMHO, I'd rate North Park ahead of BOTH Carthage AND Wheaton this year.   

Maybe because North Central handled Wheaton fairly easily last year, I was not that impressed with the Thunder. Additionally, I believe superstar Kent Raymond had a stronger supporting cast last year than he does this season. Accordingly, I think that if you hold Raymond down, as NCC did last year, it will be even easier to defeat them this season than it was last year.

As far as my rating NPU ahead of Carthage this season, I just think the Vikings have more players who can run faster, and jump higher than the Red Men. While Carthage may POSSIBLY shoot the ball better overall, I think North Park's work on the glass and its ability to sustain defensive pressure longer will be the telling factors in a NPU=Carthage matchup. Lastly, except for long range shooting, NPU displayed overall superior talent during 07 nsummer league play.   

[AndOne]

No need to lose your optimism, CP. Given the conditions under which NCC had to play this evening -- no Rogers, only two weeks of practice, and a wagonload of players being thrust into prominent roles for the first time -- the Cardinals looked very good.

The fact that NCC's opponent this evening really isn't as good at this point as the preseason poll is making it out to be shouldn't detract from that.

You break me down only to build me back up again!  Any idea how long Rodgers will be out?  Andone?...

Nope, not yet.
I don't think that will be known fully without further testing and evaluation by the ortho specialist. Only then will both a treatment plan and rehab plan be able to be formulated, after which a more accurate estimate will be able to be made.

[Gregory Sager]

I would've been totally floored if North Park had received even one point in the d3hoops.com preseason poll, AO. I think that the pollsters who are honest with themselves will acknowledge that there is a "name factor" that comes into play in the preseason poll, and maybe the first few polls of the regular season as well -- and NPU has no national cred at this point. Carthage does. Plus, the Vikings barely topped the .500 mark last season and really haven't proven yet that they can successfully navigate a CCIW season. Given that, a wait-and-see attitude towards them on the part of the pollsters is entirely appropriate.

The CCIW teams lined up about where I figured they would in the d3hoops.com poll, except that Elmhurst dipped slightly for some reason; I had figured that the boys in baby blue would've been ranked in the low teens, given that they have the best returning inside-outside tandem in the CCIW in Brent Ruch and Ryan Burks. Also, Carthage might've received a few too many points in the poll; I'm not sure if the pollsters are aware of how much we've all been squawking on CCIW Chat about the Red Men's lack of size. I figured that they'd get about half as many points in the preseason poll as they actually got.

I'm certainly optimistic that NPU will finish ahead of both Wheaton and Carthage. Heck, I'm holding out hope that they'll finish ahead of Augie, Elmhurst, NCC, IWU, and Millikin as well. We'll see.

As far as how the Vikings compare to Carthage and everyone else when it comes to performance from beyond the arc, I'm not terribly worried about NPU's outside shooting. Last season the Vikings finished second in the league in three-point shooting, only five percentage points behind Augustana and a whopping 46 points ahead of third-place North Central. Why am I not worried about how the Park will fare from downtown? Here's the returning CCIW trey leaders from last year:

'07 rank	player, team	G	3FG	3FGA	Pct
3.	Williams, Nick-NPU	14	17	35	.486
4.	Capalbo, Joe-NPU	14	31	64	.484
7.	Fendley, Sean-CARTHAGE	14	22	48	.458
8.	Mohan, John-WHEATON	14	26	57	.456
9.	Delp, Jordan-AUGIE	14	28	62	.452
12.	Burks, Ryan-ELMHURST	14	34	80	.425
13.	Gilmore, Andrew-IWU	14	20	48	.417
14.	Gordon, Jason-NPU	14	14	34	.412
15.	Raymond, Kent-WHEATON	14	29	75	.387

[AndOne]

As Mr Sager seconds above, the Cardinals put on a very good display of early season basketball this evening. They still have a lot to work on and improve on. However, given the facts 1) that they have only 1 returning player (Chris Drennan) who saw any significant time last year and only 3 others (Raridon, Barringer & Prince) who saw any measurable time, 2) they are working SEVERAL newcomers into the mix, 3) they are somewhat vertically challenged, and 4) they have already been hit by the injury bug, they certainly should be optimistic following tonight's performance.

Team chemistry, which can go a long way toward building a winning squad,  is without doubt better this year than last. If you choose to go to war with one of the Cards, you better be prepared to take on the whole bunch as they certainly do have each others backs. If the 07-08 Cardinals pay attention to and execute what the coaching staff teaches them, continue to bring 100% effort to each practice and game, continue to play as a team instead a bunch of "me first" individuals, and
get their injured players back, they will most certainly surprise a lot of people this year and produce a record that they can be proud of and which will put them squarely in the hunt for a conference tourney spot.   

[petemcb]

Greg, what time is that NPU @ Dominican game Friday night?  That should be a fun one.  Both NPU and Dominican played some of the most exciting, up-tempo basketball in the Deerfield league this past summer.  If my work schedule permits, I might try to squeeze that game in before my son's and daughter's basketball schedule begins to dominate my winter.   

[dansand]

A pre-season ranking the Vikes probably deserve with their returning group---Just a few questions that I have----

1.  Will they be able to overcome the loss of Wessels at the 1 spot?  Not only his leadership, but his on-the-ball defensive presence and his ability to easily handle pressure.  I would fully expect teams to pressure the Vikes to see if they can handle it.
   
2.  Will they be able to find replacements for Nate Swetalla and Brusveen from the 3 point area?  Delp is back, but who else will step up?  Augie is always perceived as a physical, defensive oriented group, but many have forgotten that last year they lead the CCIW in 3 point percentage.  The strength of the team last year was supposed to be their inside game and it was the perimeter game that carried them.  Hopefully, a consistent inside game will be there this season. 

We'll soon find out.     

Drew Wessels is definitely a big loss, but I expect Coach G will probably go with a smaller lineup this year with (I'm guessing) Matt Pelton, Jordan Delp and Brett Wessels. Also, Alex Washington played a lot of minutes at the 3 last year and I expect will this year as well, so I think, when healthy, their ball handling shouldn't be a problem.

I agree with the second point. They led the nation in three-point shooting last year and they'll need some guys to fill the void left by three mid-40% three-point shooters they lost.

[Gregory Sager]

Greg, what time is that NPU @ Dominican game Friday night?  That should be a fun one.  Both NPU and Dominican played some of the most exciting, up-tempo basketball in the Deerfield league this past summer.  If my work schedule permits, I might try to squeeze that game in before my son's and daughter's basketball schedule begins to dominate my winter.   

It's at 7 pm, Pete. NPU's second scrimmage will be in the crackerbox against Benedictine next Wednesday, also at 7 pm.

Tonight's scrimmage should be a good one. I think that Dominican's gonna have a very good team this season.

[mr_b]

NPU's second scrimmage will be in the crackerbox against Benedictine next Wednesday, also at 7 pm.

Is next week's scrimmage at North Park on Tuesday or Wednesday?

[Gregory Sager]

NPU's second scrimmage will be in the crackerbox against Benedictine next Wednesday, also at 7 pm.

Is next week's scrimmage at North Park on Tuesday or Wednesday?

It's Wednesday. Sharpen those pencils, Mr. B.

[Jim Matson]

I think AO has something with his thoughts on Wheaton.  I had asked about the #3 pick being interpreted as so obvious because I'm not sure what kind of season they'll really have.  Wiele is and has been a strong player but has also demonstrated inconsistency.  And Ben Panner has also be up and down in his performance (no pun intended).  Also consider that Wheaton has a grand total of 1 senior and 4 juniors - this is a young squad.  We may see a lot of young Andrew Jahns from Wheaton North.